Welded, (not soldered) cables.

virtualdean

FYI new welding technology from BlueJeansCable. No, I don't mean soldered.
Nothing impresses me like good solid engineering. Nothing bores me more than unlinked claims. But thats me.
I bought a set. :cool:

New: Ultrasonically-Welded Speaker Cables

Blue Jeans Cable is proud to offer a new product available nowhere else: speaker cable with ultrasonically-welded banana plug terminations, for the highest pull strength and best electrical connection integrity available in any speaker cable, anywhere. Our West Chester, PA-built Sonobond Ultrasonic Welder allows us to fuse the copper speaker wire directly to the brass banana plug without the use of compression screws, setscrews, or solder--...

BJC sez The result is a speaker cable with the best physical durability and electrical integrity of any speaker cable on the market, but without the crazy pricing of the boutique cable companies.
American Cable, American Technology, American Assembly

All assembly of our welded speaker cables is done here in our shop in Seattle, Washington. Our primary speaker cable stocks come from Belden Wire and Cable in Richmond, Indiana, and the welder is, as mentioned above, made by Sonobond in its factory in West Chester, PA. Blue Jeans Cable is committed to keeping manufacturing jobs in the USA, and whenever we can source and assemble products and equipment here, that's how we prefer to work. The price is a bit higher than you'll find on some of the many generic Chinese products available elsewhere, but so is the quality of manufacture--this is the best-engineered, best-built speaker cable you will find anywhere, at any price.
*********************************************************
I have edited out irrelevant stuff about spade lugs. Go to BJC and read the article.

Mytmauro

I had bought two 7' cables on Tuesday for my SDA 2 Originals and am waiting to try them out.

Hope to get them today or tomorrow.

My cable now is about the quality of a coat hanger so I am hoping for a difference.

steveinaz

Audioquest uses this on some of their higher priced offerings.

virtualdean

steveinaz wrote: »

Audioquest uses this on some of their higher priced offerings.

I couldn't find anything on Audioquest's website.

BJC says that its available *nowhere* else.

By this time next year? I'll bet many will be offering it.

BJC was foolish, IMO, for blabbling about it in this way.

Toolfan66

And welding is better then good soldering how?? this will not make any sonic sound difference so it really don't matter..

virtualdean

TOOLFORLIFEFAN wrote: »

And welding is better then good soldering how?? this will not make any sonic sound difference so it really don't matter..

Goto the BJC website.

No possibility of cold solder joints, is a big difference. A perfect wire/connection makes no sonic difference. Cables and Connections aren't supposed to add colouration to the music. It should be transparent.

ben62670

Other companies have been using this technique for a while. Cold solder joint? Soldering is not rocket science. I think that any company out there can solder without making a cold solder joint.

steveinaz

virtualdean wrote: »

I couldn't find anything on Audioquest's website.

Diamondback is an example that is cold welded rather than soldered.

virtualdean

ben62670 wrote: »

Other companies have been using this technique for a while. Cold solder joint? Soldering is not rocket science. I think that any company out there can solder without making a cold solder joint.

Ben:
i find that attitude baffling. Cold solder joints have been the bane of electronics since it was invented...Sure you can minimise cold solder joints when manufacturing something, but you cannot guarantee that it will never occur later. Its a physical fact. Did you read the article?

http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/

I don't work for BJC..I'm a hobbyist like you. I do have a technical background and like to believe I can appreciate sound engineering.
I'll bet you lunch that this process will be widespread within a few years.

virtualdean

steveinaz wrote: »

Diamondback is an example that is cold welded rather than soldered.

Link?

virtualdean

virtualdean wrote: »

FYI new welding technology from BlueJeansCable. No, I don't mean soldered.
Nothing impresses me like good solid engineering. Nothing bores me more than unlinked claims. But thats me.
I bought a set. :cool:

New: Ultrasonically-Welded Speaker Cables

Blue Jeans Cable is proud to offer a new product available nowhere else: speaker cable with ultrasonically-welded banana plug terminations, for the highest pull strength and best electrical connection integrity available in any speaker cable, anywhere. Our West Chester, PA-built Sonobond Ultrasonic Welder allows us to fuse the copper speaker wire directly to the brass banana plug without the use of compression screws, setscrews, or solder--...

BJC sez The result is a speaker cable with the best physical durability and electrical integrity of any speaker cable on the market, but without the crazy pricing of the boutique cable companies.
American Cable, American Technology, American Assembly

All assembly of our welded speaker cables is done here in our shop in Seattle, Washington. Our primary speaker cable stocks come from Belden Wire and Cable in Richmond, Indiana, and the welder is, as mentioned above, made by Sonobond in its factory in West Chester, PA. Blue Jeans Cable is committed to keeping manufacturing jobs in the USA, and whenever we can source and assemble products and equipment here, that's how we prefer to work. The price is a bit higher than you'll find on some of the many generic Chinese products available elsewhere, but so is the quality of manufacture--this is the best-engineered, best-built speaker cable you will find anywhere, at any price.
*********************************************************

Gentlemen
I posted this as an FYI service to the board not to try and stir up stuff with the magic cable/no magic cable crowds.

Read the article...debate its claims. Links and articles would be wonderful in proving a point..

Face

Too bad they use brass termination.

steveinaz

virtualdean wrote: »

Link?

Hate to sound like Captain Obvious, but...the Audioquest website? I haven't been on that site for quite awhile, but they use to state specifically about the Diamondback (and higher) IC's that they were welded and not soldered.

steveinaz

Ahh, what the hell, I'm bored:

Go to: www.audioquest.com
click on interconnects, analog, Diamondback
Look at the info at the bottom left, note: "Cold-welded direct silver plated"

The lower level sidewinder/copperhead and so forth are soldered terminations.

amulford

Face wrote: »

Too bad they use brass termination.

Word. I'd rather see OFC connectors. Not that you can't weld dis-similar metals, but if you REALLY want a seemless joint...

I don't like any kind of "look at me" BS like that. Personally, a matter of fact statement would be much more effective...

ben62670

virtualdean wrote: »

Ben:
i find that attitude baffling. Cold solder joints have been the bane of electronics since it was invented...Sure you can minimise cold solder joints when manufacturing something, but you cannot guarantee that it will never occur later. Its a physical fact. Did you read the article?

http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/

I don't work for BJC..I'm a hobbyist like you. I do have a technical background and like to believe I can appreciate sound engineering.
I'll bet you lunch that this process will be widespread within a few years.

VD you find "a new technique" for connecting a cable, and I mention that it is not a new technique. You turn that into I have an attitude Cold solder joints are rare now with the exception of hobbyist that are lacking experience, or using piss poor materials. The newer solders and better temperature controlled irons make soldering a pretty easy task with a little practice. BTW you read an add from a manufacture not a technical article.
Cheers
Ben

el_duderino

FYI new welding technology from BlueJeansCable

This is hardly "new" technology. Pretty widespread in industry. Maybe new as far as consumer market is concerned but it remains to be seen whether it is worthwhile.

And by worthwhile I mean worth noting... as in worth paying a premium for.

virtualdean

el_duderino wrote: »

This is hardly "new" technology. Pretty widespread in industry. Maybe new as far as consumer market is concerned but it remains to be seen whether it is worthwhile.

And by worthwhile I mean worth noting... as in worth paying a premium for.

Any links??

BJC's articles says its available nowhere else.(in speaker cables) R they making false claims?

virtualdean

ben62670 wrote: »

VD you find "a new technique" for connecting a cable, and I mention that it is not a new technique. You turn that into I have an attitude Cold solder joints are rare now with the exception of hobbyist that are lacking experience, or using piss poor materials. The newer solders and better temperature controlled irons make soldering a pretty easy task with a little practice. BTW you read an add from a manufacture not a technical article.
Cheers
Ben

Sorry about the attitude point Ben....Perhaps I should have said position/opinion or something else. The word attitude can be so loaded with meaning to many people.
True, it was a news release from the company.

I doubt anyone will be able to provide a link to another speaker cable company that shows they use sonic welding. (yet)

Take care

virtualdean

steveinaz wrote: »

Ahh, what the hell, I'm bored:

Go to: www.audioquest.com
click on interconnects, analog, Diamondback
Look at the info at the bottom left, note: "Cold-welded direct silver plated"

The lower level sidewinder/copperhead and so forth are soldered terminations.

Good hunting Steve...I wonder what "cold-welding" means?
Its not ultrasonic welding. Could coldwelding be salesman's slang for silver soldering? Soldering is thousands of degrees cooler than conventional welding.
It looks to me like they "tinned" the end of the conductor with silver.\\
Too bad they didn't put in some explanations. I've never held that particular cable. Is it a bulky tip?
Good work. Links rule.

virtualdean

amulford wrote: »

Word. I'd rather see OFC connectors. Not that you can't weld dis-similar metals, but if you REALLY want a seemless joint...

I don't like any kind of "look at me" crap like that. Personally, a matter of fact statement would be much more effective...

I prefer matter of fact too. But everybody has sales managers to please.
I wouldn't have released the information about who/what/where at all.

Toolfan66

I better get out the card and buy BJ cables!!! you just sold me on them!!!

ben62670

I'm fine with a good solder joint. The gear these cables are attached to have 100's if not 1,000's of solder joints. Google ultra sonic welding. Wiki of coarse has the info.

virtualdean

TOOLFORLIFEFAN wrote: »

I better get out the card and buy BJ cables!!! you just sold me on them!!!

Perfect example of being sarcastic, right?]\
I think these are way below your normal price range. They aren't pretty and don't cost as much as an amp.
I bought mine not because my old ones weren't good, they are excellent. But, I wanted to see what this looks like. And they don't cost much.. If they were hundreds per cable, I'd live without them.

I also wanted to have a technical discussion and learn stuff.

To each his own.


Take care

:biggrin:

Knucklehead

As far as cold weld soldering being new in the electronics industry is not correct. My Co has been using cold weld soldering in our products for at least 10 years.

steveinaz

virtualdean wrote: »

Good hunting Steve...I wonder what "cold-welding" means?
Its not ultrasonic welding. Could coldwelding be salesman's slang for silver soldering? Soldering is thousands of degrees cooler than conventional welding.
It looks to me like they "tinned" the end of the conductor with silver.\\
Too bad they didn't put in some explanations. I've never held that particular cable. Is it a bulky tip?
Good work. Links rule.

Actually, comparatively speaking the diamondback is relatively thin.

virtualdean

Knucklehead wrote: »

As far as cold weld soldering being new in the electronics industry is not correct. My Co has been using cold weld soldering in our products for at least 10 years.

Knucklehead...

We are talking about ultrasonic welding, not cold welding. Steve found a link showing AQ uses cold welding in their anolog interconnects conductor tips.

There are many definitions of cold welding in google. Ultrasonic is not one of them.

The BJC article establishes that ultrasonic welding is used in industry. They ran across it at a trade show.

Whats new and unigue is that they are the first to use it in speaker cables. So they claim. If you can show a link that proves otherwise, go for it.

My intro to the article is full of incorrect words and statements. It proves you can't put everything past you guys. Its seems people want ot focus on my intro.. I'm sorry..Beat me with a Dayton speaker cable! Lets please concentrate on what the article said, not what I said. Hell, I'm not BJC...just an interested hobbyist. I do make mistakes,,,hard as that might be to believe! :biggrin:

virtualdean

ben62670 wrote: »

I'm fine with a good solder joint. The gear these cables are attached to have 100's if not 1,000's of solder joints. Google ultra sonic welding. Wiki of coarse has the info.

All the questions answered...First used in plastics and containers...recently used in dissimilar metals...cool...:biggrin:

Most if not all circuit boards are robotically soldered. It wouldn't be cost effective otherwise.
Even then, Cold joints can and do arise later in its service life. If it falled during manufacturing you'd never see it, (one would hope it wouldn't get shipped)
Hmm..think of this..what if you had a cold joint and you didn't know it..And it didn't cause catastrophic failure...what if it only changed the signal a little bit? Some might like the way that cable sounded and some might not....

Knucklehead

virtualdean wrote: »

Knucklehead...

We are talking about ultrasonic welding, not cold welding. Steve found a link showing AQ uses cold welding in their anolog interconnects conductor tips.

There are many definitions of cold welding in google. Ultrasonic is not one of them.

The BJC article establishes that ultrasonic welding is used in industry. They ran across it at a trade show.

Whats new and unigue is that they are the first to use it in speaker cables. So they claim. If you can show a link that proves otherwise, go for it.

My intro to the article is full of incorrect words and statements. It proves you can't put everything past you guys. Its seems people want ot focus on my intro.. I'm sorry..Beat me with a Dayton speaker cable! Lets please concentrate on what the article said, not what I said. Hell, I'm not BJC...just an interested hobbyist. I do make mistakes,,,hard as that might be to believe! :biggrin:

You are correct, my bad, I was sidetracked. I called our Engineering dept in Canton Ohio and was informed that we do use ultrasonic welding in our PBX devices, when asked for a lay-mens explanation I was emailed this web info:


Ultrasonic Welding is a Solid State Welding process, in which two work pieces are bonded as a result of a pressure exerted to the welded parts combined with application of high frequency acoustic vibration (ultrasonic).
Ultrasonic vibration causes friction between the parts, which results in a closer contact between the two surfaces with simultaneous local heating of the contact area. Interatomic bonds, formed under these conditions, provide strong joint.

Ultrasonic cycle takes about 1 sec. The frequency of acoustic vibrations is in the range 20 to 70 KHz.
Thickness of the welded parts is limited by the power of the ultrasonic generator.

Ultrasonic Welding is used mainly for bonding small work pieces in electronics, for manufacturing communication devices, medical tools, watches, in automotive industry.

Toolfan66

virtualdean wrote: »

Perfect example of being sarcastic, right?]\
I think these are way below your normal price range. They aren't pretty and don't cost as much as an amp.
I bought mine not because my old ones weren't good, they are excellent. But, I wanted to see what this looks like. And they don't cost much.. If they were hundreds per cable, I'd live without them.

I also wanted to have a technical discussion and learn stuff.

To each his own.


Take care

:biggrin:

:cool::biggrin:

arun1963

Excuse my ignorance, but the debate on sonic value of soldered vs welded is a bit humorous on two fronts.

I can hear better than you and my equipment is at a level that lets me hear the difference. Really?

Don't mean to ruffle feathers, carry on.