weak bass in RTi10

photocrazy

I bought a pair of RTi10s and hooked em up to Pio 1325, but the bass is very weak. I have them set as "Large" speakers in Pioneers setup menu. Even after running MCACC, still the bass is very weak. does it improve after break-in period ? how many hours of break-in, do these speakers need ?

MADGSF

I would give them some break in time, say 200 hours or so, but I don't remember the bass improving much after break in. Unfortunately I was never blown away by the bass they produce until I added an external amplifier.

mdaudioguy

See my response in the other thread where you asked about an amp.

pearsall001

Add a nice sub...set them to "small" at 80Hz XO & experience brand new speakers! No more problem with bass.

photocrazy

pearsall001 wrote: »

Add a nice sub...set them to "small" at 80Hz XO & experience brand new speakers! No more problem with bass.

thanks..!! But I still guess a pair of 7" must be punchy and tight in 100-150hz.

tonyb

What other gear/cables are you running ? Sure it's not a problem with the source ?

photocrazy

tonyb wrote: »

What other gear/cables are you running ? Sure it's not a problem with the source ?

I am having a motorola HD set top box and WDTV live, which streams all my music and movies from my pc.

tonyb

photocrazy wrote: »

I am having a motorola HD set top box and WDTV live, which streams all my music and movies from my pc.

...to what receiver ? What kind and ga. speaker wire are you using ? Everything matters.

Sorry,just caught the pioneer. When you ran the auto calibration what level did it set the speakers to ?

photocrazy

tonyb wrote: »

...to what receiver ? What kind and ga. speaker wire are you using ? Everything matters.

Sorry,just caught the pioneer. When you ran the auto calibration what level did it set the speakers to ?

I didn't notice the levels. I will check it tonite. But I did set them as "large"

photocrazy

tonyb wrote: »

...to what receiver ? What kind and ga. speaker wire are you using ? Everything matters.

Sorry,just caught the pioneer. When you ran the auto calibration what level did it set the speakers to ?

I ran 16 guage speaker wire

mole'

i have RTi10s and i love the bass they put out (well broken in tho) mine put out more bass than my SDS SRS 2.3TLs.
2.3TLs powered by Adcom 5802 Pioneer elite AVR, MIT AVt 3
RTi10s powered by Acurus 250x3 Pioneer elite AVR, MIT EXp 1

tonyb

photocrazy wrote: »

I didn't notice the levels. I will check it tonite. But I did set them as "large"

16 ga. is borderline imho. 12 or 14 ga. is better on big floorstanders. When you check the speaker levels, it might say something like -3.5, or something with a negative value. Return the value to 0.0 and see how you like it,you can always go up or down from there.

photocrazy

mole' wrote: »

i have RTi10s and i love the bass they put out (well broken in tho) mine put out more bass than my SDS SRS 2.3TLs.
2.3TLs powered by Adcom 5802 Pioneer elite AVR, MIT AVt 3
RTi10s powered by Acurus 250x3 Pioneer elite AVR, MIT EXp 1

I guess you are running external amps with your RTi10s

tonyb

Of coarse he is, big floorstanders don't do well with low to midline receivers,not if you want to hear what they are capable off. You need some current to drive big boys.
You were also asking about a Denon receiver over at AVS forum, another bad choice for these speakers friend.

mole'

photocrazy wrote: »

I guess you are running external amps with your RTi10s

yes, an Acurus 250x3 for the RTi10s and a CSi5

they still sounded good right off of the Elite AVR. 140wpc

but nothing like they sound with the ext amp.

photocrazy

tonyb wrote: »

16 ga. is borderline imho. 12 or 14 ga. is better on big floorstanders. When you check the speaker levels, it might say something like -3.5, or something with a negative value. Return the value to 0.0 and see how you like it,you can always go up or down from there.

MCACC has set my levels to -2.0 and -1.5. But even bypassing MCACC, i still dont see the punch in bass. Looking at the following link
http://www.polkaudio.com/homeaudio/specs/recent/rti10/, anything below 125hz is sent to 7" woofers. Tight and punchy bass are above 125hz ?

photocrazy

will Klipsch RF-82s have tight and punchy bass ?

mole'

how many hours do you have on your RTi10s?

have you added more power to them yet?

comfortablycurt

mole' wrote: »

i have RTi10s and i love the bass they put out (well broken in tho) mine put out more bass than my SDS SRS 2.3TLs.

I find that statement kinda hard to swallow. One of my best friends has a pair of RTiA7's, which are basically the new version of the RTi10's...and my SDA 2A's completely blow them out of the water as far as bass output, extension and quality goes. We've compared the two speakers to one another side by side in both my home and his. I find it basically impossible to believe that your 10's have more bass output than your 2.3TL's. Are you sure you have the 2.3TL's placed properly? They should absolutely crush the RTi10's as far as bass output goes.




To the OP-One thing that I haven't seen mentioned in this thread yet(surprisingly) is the importance of proper speaker placement. How do you have your RTi10's placed? How far are they from the back walls and sidewalls? Proper placement can make a subpar speaker sound great, and improper placement can make an incredible speaker sound terrible. It's very important. Try playing around with speaker placement and see if that helps you out. Moving the speaker closer to the back wall will increase the perceived bass output.

That being said, it is possible that you're simply expecting too much out of them. The RTi10's have some respectable bass output, but they'll never have what I'd consider to be bone crushing bass output. Two 7" woofers can only produce so much bass.

Adding an external amp will bring them to live, and make them sound like a completely different pair of speakers. I used to run a pair of RTi8's off of my Onkyo 606, and they sounded pretty good. Once I added my 100 wpc Adcom GFA-545 to the equation though, they opened up and turned into a different pair of speakers. They had some VERY respectable bass output for only having two 6.5"midwoofers, and no dedicated bass drivers...but not until I had them running off the Adcom. AVR's simply don't have the guts to bring out the best in a speaker.

Tour2ma

photo...

Nice... The 10's were not only my favorite RTi, but my fav modern Polk of a few years ago.

I don't know your AVR so does "bypassing MCACC" mean output goes to 0.0 as tonyb suggested?

Agree with ComfyCurt on placement... Are the 10's mid-wall? Near corners?

One thing I did not see addressed above is your room... How big of a room? Carpeted or hard floors (speaker stability issue)?

photocrazy

Tour2ma wrote: »

photo...

Nice... The 10's were not only my favorite RTi, but my fav modern Polk of a few years ago.

I don't know your AVR so does "bypassing MCACC" mean output goes to 0.0 as tonyb suggested?

Agree with ComfyCurt on placement... Are the 10's mid-wall? Near corners?

One thing I did not see addressed above is your room... How big of a room? Carpeted or hard floors (speaker stability issue)?

My AVR is Pioneer 1325 which can bypass all its processing in pure direct mode. Regarding placement, I have placed it 15cms from the wall. My room is 10' x 25' with a listening distance of 10' from the screen. It is carpeted.

photocrazy

mole' wrote: »

how many hours do you have on your RTi10s?

have you added more power to them yet?

I would say around 12 hrs. I dont have any external amps. I am running them via Pio 1325 in stereo mode

photocrazy

comfortablycurt wrote: »

I find that statement kinda hard to swallow. One of my best friends has a pair of RTiA7's, which are basically the new version of the RTi10's...and my SDA 2A's completely blow them out of the water as far as bass output, extension and quality goes. We've compared the two speakers to one another side by side in both my home and his. I find it basically impossible to believe that your 10's have more bass output than your 2.3TL's. Are you sure you have the 2.3TL's placed properly? They should absolutely crush the RTi10's as far as bass output goes.




To the OP-One thing that I haven't seen mentioned in this thread yet(surprisingly) is the importance of proper speaker placement. How do you have your RTi10's placed? How far are they from the back walls and sidewalls? Proper placement can make a subpar speaker sound great, and improper placement can make an incredible speaker sound terrible. It's very important. Try playing around with speaker placement and see if that helps you out. Moving the speaker closer to the back wall will increase the perceived bass output.

That being said, it is possible that you're simply expecting too much out of them. The RTi10's have some respectable bass output, but they'll never have what I'd consider to be bone crushing bass output. Two 7" woofers can only produce so much bass.

Adding an external amp will bring them to live, and make them sound like a completely different pair of speakers. I used to run a pair of RTi8's off of my Onkyo 606, and they sounded pretty good. Once I added my 100 wpc Adcom GFA-545 to the equation though, they opened up and turned into a different pair of speakers. They had some VERY respectable bass output for only having two 6.5"midwoofers, and no dedicated bass drivers...but not until I had them running off the Adcom. AVR's simply don't have the guts to bring out the best in a speaker.

I have placed the speakers 15cms from the wall and my floor is carpeted.

Sorry for the newbie question, but with the following link,

http://www.crownaudio.com/apps_htm/designtools/elect-pwr-req.htm

I guess why would we need external amps. coz a receiver with a capability of 50wpc can comfortable play in reference levels. I guess polk RTis are rated for sensitivity of 89db

photocrazy

I am thinking probably monitor 70s would do a better job, as they have 4 6.5" drivers to handle anything below 2.6Khz

http://www.polkaudio.com/homeaudio/specs/recent/monitor70

dorokusai

I don't believe an external amplifier is needed for that model. It's not hard to drive. I'm not sure if either a setting is wrong or your expectations are huge but they put out decent bass, and I've owned all the floor standers. I'll skim the thread for your gear answers and other things since I need to get up to speed.

The difference between 89dB vs 90dB means nothing in regards to the problem. The strong suit for those speakers is above 80hz, all midrange with a little low end kick but not much. Don't expect subwoofer level bass response, for that get a subwoofer.

Even the RTi12 doesn't slam hard enough on the low end. It still requires a sub and a external amplifier to open up and really bloom. I'm sure the RTi10 would benefit as well and it's been mentioned earlier but to get a good sonic picture your AVR is fine.

Toolfan66

mole' wrote: »

i have RTi10s and i love the bass they put out (well broken in tho) mine put out more bass than my SDS SRS 2.3TLs.

:eek: Mole there is no way the 10's put out more bass then the 2.3tl's.
You have to have something wrong.

If that was true then my RTiA9's would do better then my 1.2tl's and that is not the case not even close....

dorokusai

I tend to let owners decide what sounds better to them, since they are in a much better position to state that opinion. Does it sound odd? Sure but if he's happy, I'm happy.

photocrazy

dorokusai wrote: »

I don't believe an external amplifier is needed for that model. It's not hard to drive. I'm not sure if either a setting is wrong or your expectations are huge but they put out decent bass, and I've owned all the floor standers. I'll skim the thread for your gear answers and other things since I need to get up to speed.

The difference between 89dB vs 90dB means nothing in regards to the problem. The strong suit for those speakers is above 80hz, all midrange with a little low end kick but not much. Don't expect subwoofer level bass response, for that get a subwoofer.

Even the RTi12 doesn't slam hard enough on the low end. It still requires a sub and a external amplifier to open up and really bloom. I'm sure the RTi10 would benefit as well and it's been mentioned earlier but to get a good sonic picture your AVR is fine.

Thank you very much for the detailed response. These speakers have excellent highs and midrange, but may be I am expecting too much in the low end. I used to have sony HT 150 speaker bar with 6.5" sub and I am not getting the same tight and punchy bass from the RTi 10s. From the specs, the 7" woofers are crossed at 125hz, so anything above is handled by 6.5" midrange driver. are the tight and punchy lows above 125hz ?

inspiredsports

The Pioneer VSX-1325-k looks to be a nice 7.1 home theater receiver, but its specs say it is not 4 ohm capable which may mean the power section doesn't have a lot of reserve, even with 8 ohm speakers.

Toolfan66

dorokusai wrote: »

I tend to let owners decide what sounds better to them, since they are in a much better position to state that opinion. Does it sound odd? Sure but if he's happy, I'm happy.

Good Point but still not right.

photocrazy

inspiredsports wrote: »

The Pioneer VSX-1325-k looks to be a nice 7.1 home theater receiver, but its specs say it is not 4 ohm capable which may mean the power section doesn't have a lot of reserve.

Hmm.. how much power do I need ?