Pearl Harbor

George Grand

Today.

vmaxer

My dad used to talk abut how he could never forget about this, could remember where he was the moment he learned about it. He was only 7 when it happened, guess it left a major impression:frown:

George Grand

The 9/11 of his generation.

The Kennedy assassination was it for my age group (10-11). You can't help but remember where you were. It's burned in.

vmaxer

George Grand wrote: »

The 9/11 of his generation.

The Kennedy assassination was it for my age group (10-11). You can't help but remember where you were. It's burned in.

Yep, I remember how upset my parents were over that one, especially my mother (I was with her more as dad worked a lot.)

George Grand

It can go back VERY far.

In 1956 my "Nouna" (Greek for godmother) was visiting us from California. She and I were going out somewhere late morning in her orange Mercury convertible. On the way out of the house, on the second floor staircase landing, she asked me "So Georgie, what are you going to do now that the Dodgers are moving out of Brooklyn?"

I looked at her and said "Nouna, WTF did you just say?"

THAT one is burned in like no other my friend.

reeltrouble1

George Grand wrote: »

The 9/11 of his generation.

The Kennedy assassination was it for my age group (10-11). You can't help but remember where you were. It's burned in.

Yes another day of infamy.

President Kennedy we gathered outside the school around the Flag I remember very clearly Mrs. Kinsella crying, never saw my teacher cry before, the tears ran down her face, I remember how her make-up ran, she had a small white tissue balled in her hand.

I have stood on the deck of the Pearl Harbor memorial, it was a very moving thing, the oil still bilges from her tanks, its real, very real, men died, women died, they still do.

God Bless our soldiers.

RT1

RuSsMaN

Hard to think about.

dkg999

Let us never forget.

nooshinjohn

George Grand wrote: »

It can go back VERY far.

In 1956 my "Nouna" (Greek for godmother) was visiting us from California. She and I were going out somewhere late morning in her orange Mercury convertible. On the way out of the house, on the second floor staircase landing, she asked me "So Georgie, what are you going to do now that the Dodgers are moving out of Brooklyn?"

I looked at her and said "Nouna, WTF did you just say?"

THAT one is burned in like no other my friend.

So you are the reason they left Brooklyn? That must be a heavy burden to carry.:biggrin:

TroyD

Amen.

Jstas

I was fortunate to have the chance to spend a good deal of time at Pearl Harbor. Since I had access to the naval base, I got to see things that the general public doesn't get to see. It's not just the Arizona Memorial or the Missouri. The whole place has a vibe that something happened there. The oldest buildings are eerie. Especially the ones that served as morgues and field hospitals. Just creepy stuff.

Most of the remaining battle damage is still on Ford Island. There are some buildings on the main base that have been left like the concrete block warehouses and some of the buildings around the older piers. Get to the ammo dump where all the weapons are stored on the other side of the harbor and you can see rotting hulks of machinery that was destroyed in the attack. The Navy just dumped it on the island until they could figure out what to do with it. Alot of it has been moved off. Much of it was cleaned up and dumped off the coast to make artificial reefs.

If you ever get a chance to go to Hawaii, Pearl Harbor should be on your short list of stuff to see. Worth the time, completely.

nooshinjohn

+1 to that John... Pearl Harbor is on the short list of places that every American should visit at least once in their lifetime. Once you go there, our freedoms mean just a bit more to you than before. The sacrifice made there by our brave men and women reaches across time and touches your soul.

God bless them and their sacrifice. You are all remembered and shall never be forgotten.

Polkie2009

Thanks George for starting this thread. It's very important that people remember the sacrifices American men and women in uniform made for our freedom. Lest We Forget

cnh

This one has even more meaning for me. My father served in that war--he died a two and a half years ago. I'd always remember Pearl Harbor both for its significance and because it was the day before my father's Name Day! This year, of course, he's not here.

I'm also old enough to remember the Kennedy assassination. We were traveling to NYC across N.J. on a bus to meet my Uncle who was a cook on a Greek Merchant Freighter and spend the weekend in a Hotel there. When we got to Somerville (a scheduled) stop, the bus driver got off the bus and returned with the words "The President has been shot!". It was a long weekend! I was just old enough to vaguely grasp what all that meant.

cnh

shack

Just case your teachers in school never bothered to expose you to this...

This is the address given by President Franklin Delano Roosevelt at the United States Capitol, Washington, D.C., on December 8, 1941, in response to the Attack on Pearl Harbor.

Mr. Vice President, Mr. Speaker, members of the Senate and the House of Representatives: Yesterday, December 7th, 1941 — a date which will live in infamy — the United States of America was suddenly and deliberately attacked by naval and air forces of the Empire of Japan.

The United States was at peace with that nation, and, at the solicitation of Japan, was still in conversation with its Government and its Emperor looking toward the maintenance of peace in the Pacific. Indeed, one hour after Japanese air squadrons had commenced bombing in the American island of Oahu, the Japanese Ambassador to the United States and his colleague delivered to our Secretary of State a formal reply to a recent American message. And while this reply stated that it seemed useless to continue the existing diplomatic negotiations, it contained no threat or hint of war or of armed attack.

It will be recorded that the distance of Hawaii from Japan makes it obvious that the attack was deliberately planned many days or even weeks ago. During the intervening time the Japanese Government has deliberately sought to deceive the United States by false statements and expressions of hope for continued peace.

The attack yesterday on the Hawaiian Islands has caused severe damage to American naval and military forces. I regret to tell you that very many American lives have been lost. In addition American ships have been reported torpedoed on the high seas between San Francisco and Honolulu.

Yesterday the Japanese Government also launched an attack against Malaya.

Last night Japanese forces attacked Hong Kong.

Last night Japanese forces attacked Guam.

Last night Japanese forces attacked the Philippine Islands.

Last night the Japanese attacked Wake Island.

And this morning the Japanese attacked Midway Island.

Japan has, therefore, undertaken a surprise offensive extending throughout the Pacific area. The facts of yesterday and today speak for themselves. The people of the United States have already formed their opinions and well understand the implications to the very life and safety of our nation.

As Commander-in-Chief of the Army and Navy, I have directed that all measures be taken for our defense.

But always will our whole nation remember the character of the onslaught against us. No matter how long it may take us to overcome this premeditated invasion, the American people in their righteous might will win through to absolute victory.

I believe that I interpret the will of the Congress and of the people when I assert that we will not only defend ourselves to the uttermost but will make it very certain that this form of treachery shall never again endanger us.

Hostilities exist. There is no blinking at the fact that our people, our territory and our interests are in grave danger.

With confidence in our armed forces—with the unbounding determination of our people—we will gain the inevitable triumph—so help us God.

I ask that the Congress declare that since the unprovoked and dastardly attack by Japan on Sunday, December 7th, 1941, a state of war has existed between the United States and the Japanese Empire.

Most are only familiar with the ONE line (if at all). It is well worth reading the whole thing.

dkg999

Thanks Shack!

Polkie2009

Thank you shack, people need to remember the importance of this address.

Jstas

shack wrote: »

Just case your teachers in school never bothered to expose you to this...

This is the address given by President Franklin Delano Roosevelt at the United States Capitol, Washington, D.C., on December 8, 1941, in response to the Attack on Pearl Harbor.



Most are only familiar with the ONE line (if at all). It is well worth reading the whole thing.

The other popular line "All I fear we have done is awaken a sleeping giant and filled him with determined resolve." has no real proof that it was ever uttered in anything but movies.

However, in The Reluctant Admiral, Hiroyuki Agawa does give a quotation from a reply by Admiral Yamamoto to Ogata Taketora on January 9, 1942. It's very similar but not quite the same.

A military man can scarcely pride himself on having 'smitten a sleeping enemy'; it is more a matter of shame, simply, for the one smitten. I would rather you made your appraisal after seeing what the enemy does, since it is certain that, angered and outraged, he will soon launch a determined counterattack.

The only issue with it is that it's not cited. Probably because the original document was lost or damaged and can't be verified. I dunno, didn't look that far in to it.

The false quote has more dramatic punch and panache but doesn't really make as complete of a thought or statement as the above.

If you can find them, there are a bunch of books on the Japanese perspective of the attack. The flip side of the history is compelling. The propaganda books are just as bad as the pro-American stuff you can find here. But there are several studies that are critical and raw in the depiction of the Japanese position/condition before, during and after the attack and the war. Even Japan's allies were critical of Japan at the time. Seems like they jumped the gun and acted before everyone was ready. The perspective from the opposite side is very compelling stuff. If you can find the stuff that is critical of the U.S. as well, they make for a very complete and not so rosy view of either side but probably the most honest depiction of the war.

Honestly, Wikipedia has good collection of sources, if anything, on the subject. Several books and papers in the citations were listed as required reading in the history classes I took for elective credits in college.

Here's the page on the quote: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isoroku_Yamamoto's_sleeping_giant_quote

Here's the page on the aftermath of the attack:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Results_of_the_attack_on_Pearl_Harbor#Japanese_views

And here's the page on the attack itself:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attack_on_Pearl_Harbor#Aftermath

The lists of references at the bottom of each one is fairly long but worth a look.

George Grand

reeltrouble1 wrote: »

Yes another day of infamy.

President Kennedy we gathered outside the school around the Flag I remember very clearly Mrs. Kinsella crying, never saw my teacher cry before, the tears ran down her face, I remember how her make-up ran, she had a small white tissue balled in her hand.

I have stood on the deck of the Pearl Harbor memorial, it was a very moving thing, the oil still bilges from her tanks, its real, very real, men died, women died, they still do.

God Bless our soldiers.

RT1

I was in 6th grade, late in the afternoon, twoish, another female teacher came into our classroom and whispered into Miss Rosen's ear. She burst into tears and the other went along with her. They dismissed us very shortly after that, and as we left it seemed every member of the faculty was crying their eyes out. JFK was gone.

Not only at Pearl, but Hickam Air Force Base has buildings that have been left the way they were 10 minutes after the attack. I think PACAF HQ's was one of them. You can clearly tell the difference between small caliber machine gun bullet holes/gouges and the small cannon that some of the Japanese aircraft carried in the concrete walls (BIG gouges).

jflail2

Nat Geo has put up a rather neat interactive map chronicling the attack on Pearl Harbor.

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/pearlharbor/ax/frameset.html

Amherst

George Grand wrote: »

The 9/11 of his generation.

The Kennedy assassination was it for my age group (10-11). You can't help but remember where you were. It's burned in.

Yes came home from school that afternoon to find my mom staring at the TV, tears streaming down her face. A most unforgettable moment.

Honor to all those injured and lost at Pearl.

ohskigod

I know a gentleman who joined the Navy at the age of 17 (some shenanigans were involved to get away with doing so)

he arrived at Pearl Harbor the day after the attack.

He had some stories.

jflail2

My grandfather joined at 16 b/c my great grandmother signed for him so she'd have 1 less mouth to feed. He turned 18 in the Panama Canal, and was all over the Pacific in the Navy during WW2. Hats off to him and all other old timers that put it on the line for us back then.

tonyb

Had many relatives that came here, right off the boat, and had to fight and die for something they never had a chance to experience....freedom. God bless those who gave the ultimate sacrifice.

gdb

Yeah, and those sneaky little **** were surprised when the Doolittle Raid "returned the favor"18 April 1942
!!!:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=doolittle+raid&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=f&oq=dool&gs_rfai=CtQQXNIb-TNyzGIbgzgSqn4y0DgAAAKoEBU_Q7WqW

Fireman32

A fried of mine is out in Pearl Harbor today for the ceremony. I asked to give all the vets a salute for me.

Polkersince85

My Dad left the farm and joined the Navy in Jan 1942 at the age of 17. He turned 18 at the end of Feb. Still have his Hawaii dollar bill where he wrote all the POC around the border on his carrier the USS Cabot. God Bless America.

I was in second grade when our princpal, Mr. Brookshire, came in right after lunch and told us about Kennedy.

Another permanent memory was the Moon Landing. The world shut down to watch that one.

cfrizz

Thanks for that post Shack.

schwarcw

Thanks to all service men and women for your service to our Country. We'll never forget Pearl Harbor, it was a moment of change for all the world that still resonates today. The Americans that went through the Great Depression and WWII were part of "the greatest generation". They pulled America from the brink of financial devastation and a massive with their sweat and blood. My mother and father among them RIP. My dad served in Europe and Korea. Purple Heart in Korea.

I was in 4th grade when Kennedy was shot. Our Principal announced the news just as we were about to be dismissed from school. We put in a lot of hours in front of the TV set for the next five days. My brother and I saw Oswald get shot on live TV. Talk about moments that you won"t forget!!!

I was in my father's car listening to the lunar landing in 1969. It was late on a Sunday afternoon.

God Bless America!

warren

I retired at Pearl Harbor, spent some wonderful years there,I had the best job in the world...

dorokusai

I saw a dude in a old Dodge Aries station wagon that was decorated with remember Pearl Harbor signs all over it yesterday, flags and a searchlight on top for some weird reason. He looked older than George Grand, if that's even possible.

Talk about a day that changed the world.