My DIY 2 channel: Next component

jinjuku
jinjuku Posts: 1,523
edited May 2011 in DIY, Mods & Tweaks
With the Parts Express RS225 8" woofer now 1/2 off I just pulled the trigger on the Jim Holtz Mission Statements. They are a WMTMW speaker. This speaker is a quasi-dipole or transmission line since the mid's are in enclosed in an open back tunnel.

The discount knocked the cost of electronics down about 15%.

I think I will be able to to the entire project for ~$800-50'ish.

I already have the Parasound HCA1000A for amplification and to keep the signal path a clean as possible just go direct from a source to amp. Looking at the Logitech Squeeze Box.
Post edited by jinjuku on
· Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
«1

Comments

  • zingo
    zingo Posts: 11,258
    edited October 2010
    Great looking speakers and nice combo of drivers. How are you going to finish the cabinets? Good luck on the project.

    StatementsPic080107-385x531.jpg
    Jake
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    For the cabinet I am thinking oak veneered cabinet ply. For the baffle 1 1/4" inch mdf with a black semi-gloss paint job (have to practice with the Wagner CS that I have).


    My only wish is that Jim would have offered a design with the Dayton RS28F-4 when it hit. An incredibly high value tweeter. But the Fountek ribbon isn't a slouch either. Just that it most likely doesn't out perform at $35 more a pop.

    I was considering the new Dennis Murphy MTM with the Seas ER18RNX and either the RS28F-4 or the Fountek ribbon. But with the cost of two RS225's being $20 LESS than a single ER18... It made the Statements a no brainer since the cost is only about $60 more in total for the speakers and x-over components:eek::D
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    You have to love living with in a 1-2 day ground delivery distance of Part-Express and Erse.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    xcapri79 wrote: »
    Looks awesome.

    I hope it is so. I believe Dennis over at d-sonic (ampliers) uses a pair for his reference setup.

    Some people that have heard these guys say the play in the $10K + realm.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited October 2010
    Rumour has it those Statements are very good.;)The braces in the link to DM's MTM design are a work of art,too bad they will be unseen.

    btw.Where are you seeing the discount pricing on the Dayton RS's?I looked on PE's sight but am not seeing it.:(
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    That would becuase (Glad I hopped on these):
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    BTW I forgot to mention Curt Cambell and Wayne Wendel who were also instrumental in this design. Thanks to all.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited October 2010
    jinjuku wrote: »
    That would becuase (Glad I hopped on these):

    Oh:( were they deals of the day?
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    FTGV wrote: »
    Oh:( were they deals of the day?

    I don't know. I just saw an email from them with a bunch of their much vaunted RS line on sale and didn't think twice about pulling the trigger.

    They weren't blowing the non-sheilded RS's out so I don't know what to make of the current sale. I'm hoping that they aren't being discontinued:eek: The RS180S are also not available.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited October 2010
    I have heard rumblings that they are updating the RS designs so maybe they are clearing out stock of the current units?
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    FTGV wrote: »
    I have heard rumblings that they are updating the RS designs so maybe they are clearing out stock of the current units?

    My thoughts exactly. The RS line has been around a long time. It will interesting to see how they improve an already over achieving line up of drivers.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited October 2010
    jinjuku wrote: »
    It will interesting to see how they improve an already over achieving line up of drivers.

    There is no such thing as over achieving anything especially that of Dayton line. :D;) I like some of their Drivers from SPECs too but I have not bought anything yet so far.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    megasat16 wrote: »
    There is no such thing as over achieving anything especially that of Dayton line. :D;) I like some of their Drivers from SPECs too but I have not bought anything yet so far.

    I have no idea if you are saying that tounge-in-cheek or if you meant it:confused: :eek:

    John 'Zaph' Krutke, Roman Bednarek, Curt Cambell, Jim Holtz, Jon Marsh, Dennis Murphy I beleive would all be in disagreement with you.

    Look at all the different designs using the RS180. The one I would look at if want want to try a DIY design is one of the MTM's based on the RS180 and the RS28. That Natalie P seems to be the most prevelant (there is the Jon Marsh Modula and RJB has a 2 and 2.5 way).

    Given the recent discounts you could have built a pair of the Natalie P's for less than $300 that can hang with commercial offerings in the $800-$1000 space.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited October 2010
    jinjuku wrote: »
    I have no idea if you are saying that tounge-in-cheek or if you meant it:confused: :eek:

    John 'Zaph' Krutke, Roman Bednarek, Curt Cambell, Jim Holtz, Jon Marsh, Dennis Murphy I beleive would all be in disagreement with you.

    Look at all the different designs using the RS180. The one I would look at if want want to try a DIY design is one of the MTM's based on the RS180 and the RS28. That Natalie P seems to be the most prevelant (there is the Jon Marsh Modula and RJB has a 2 and 2.5 way).

    Given the recent discounts you could have built a pair of the Natalie P's for less than $300 that can hang with commercial offerings in the $800-$1000 space.

    I meant it. Let me know if any of them says that the Dayton driver RS180 is over achieved driver and does not require further refining coz that's what you were saying before?

    You can tell them that I said there is no such thing as over achieving driver. :)

    Yes! I meant I haven't bought any of the Dayton driver yet. I might consider buying them but they are not what I need too.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    megasat16 wrote: »
    I meant it. Let me know if any of them says that the Dayton driver RS180 is over achieved driver and does not require further refining coz that's what you were saying before?

    You can tell them that I said there is no such thing as over achieving driver. :)

    Yes! I meant I haven't bought any of the Dayton driver yet. I might consider buying them but they are not what I need too.



    1. I didn't say they are perfect
    2. I didn't say they couldn't use 'further refining'. Could you maybe point to a post of mine where I infered either?

    There really aren't any drivers that couldn't be improved upon in one way or another.

    From Zaph "Comments: This Parts Express woofer has an anodized aluminum cone and black phase plug. It gives this woofer stealth fighter looks, but it does have the performance to back it up. Respectable harmonic distortion for this price range, and a very clean sounding low end. The response curve is very smooth, but the breakup has twin peaks that may be harder to manage in the crossover depending on how high you cross over. The low price, build quality and level of performance put this driver near the top of the value chart.

    Jon Marsh "Regarding the returns, it's hard to tell- but the RS's would be an improvement- they really do have remarkable distortion performance, even if they cost 2X or 3X their nominal price."

    I've built speakers using the RS180, the RS52, the RS28a, the RS150's and soon to be the RS225's along with the ZA14W08 and TC Sounds DB500. So far so good.

    Now if you want to see a REAL over achiever of a driver look at the ZA14W08. I built a center channel on that and a Vifa Tweeter and it beat my ZDT3.5 center channel in the area of resolution and detail. Not by much but it did edge it out for a lot less $$. That thing definately competes with some of the $100 + Seas/Excel drivers out there for $40.

    This tangent should be in it's own thread if it is to continue. I'm more than happy with the RS line-up and all those guys can't be wrong.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited October 2010
    jinjuku wrote: »
    1. I didn't say they are perfect
    2. I didn't say they couldn't use 'further refining'. Could you maybe point to a post of mine where I infered either?

    I was under the impression that's what you meant but I might be nikpicking over a few words.
    jinjuku wrote: »
    My thoughts exactly. The RS line has been around a long time. It will interesting to see how they improve an already over achieving line up of drivers.
    megasat16 wrote: »
    There is no such thing as over achieving anything especially that of Dayton line. :D;) I like some of their Drivers from SPECs too but I have not bought anything yet so far.

    There really aren't any drivers that couldn't be improved upon in one way or another.

    Exactly my point!

    From Zaph "Comments: This Parts Express woofer has an anodized aluminum cone and black phase plug. It gives this woofer stealth fighter looks, but it does have the performance to back it up. Respectable harmonic distortion for this price range, and a very clean sounding low end. The response curve is very smooth, but the breakup has twin peaks that may be harder to manage in the crossover depending on how high you cross over. The low price, build quality and level of performance put this driver near the top of the value chart.

    Jon Marsh "Regarding the returns, it's hard to tell- but the RS's would be an improvement- they really do have remarkable distortion performance, even if they cost 2X or 3X their nominal price."

    I've built speakers using the RS180, the RS52, the RS28a, the RS150's and soon to be the RS225's along with the ZA14W08 and TC Sounds DB500. So far so good.

    Now if you want to see a REAL over achiever of a driver look at the ZA14W08. I built a center channel on that and a Vifa Tweeter and it beat my ZDT3.5 center channel in the area of resolution and detail. Not by much but it did edge it out for a lot less $$. That thing definately competes with some of the $100 + Seas/Excel drivers out there for $40.

    This tangent should be in it's own thread if it is to continue. I'm more than happy with the RS line-up and all those guys can't be wrong.

    Nah, I don't disagree with that. Dayton line is good for the bucks and may be comparable to higher end brands but I have no personal experience. So, no commenting on how Dayton Drivers perform but I am sure it could still improve a little here and there.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    The tweeters just hit...

    5076169105_5c278a6362.jpg
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited October 2010
    jinjuku wrote: »
    The tweeters just hit...

    5076169105_5c278a6362.jpg
    I'll be interested knowing your impressions of that ribbon when you finally get to hear it.:)
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2010
    The problem with Dayton drivers is the consistency and QC, I have some of their woofers here that look as they should have been scrapped instead of sold to a customer. You won't find that with ScanSpeak or SEAS.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    Face wrote: »
    The problem with Dayton drivers is the consistency and QC, I have some of their woofers here that look as they should have been scrapped instead of sold to a customer. You won't find that with ScanSpeak or SEAS.

    I test all my drivers regardless of manufacturer. With that said, you are correct that with Seas/Excel there is much better QC.

    So far the sweeps from my RTA show the RS225's to be spec.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited October 2010
    Looks like a cool under taking. Do you build the cabinets yourself, or do they come as a kit?
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Looks like a cool under taking. Do you build the cabinets yourself, or do they come as a kit?

    No the cabinets are built from scratch. I made two cross cut sleds for my table saw. One 90 degree and one 45 degree.

    I just redid one of my sealed sub enclosures and the 45's came off perfectly. If you are using 3/4 inch stock you simply add 1.5 inches to your outside length to achieve your inside diameter. So my sub for instance is 3.5 cubic foot internal volume. My outside is 19.5X19.5X19.5 so all my inside 45's are 18.

    With the cross cut sled you make a test cut and then simply use a clamp and block of wood to set your stop. After that it is simply throw your stock on and cut away. It's faster, its more accurate than even a fence, and it is safer since you are pushing all along the piece that you are cutting and you keep your hands away from the blade.

    The added bonus with a sled is that it is zero clearance so you get a clean cut edge (no tear/chip out!).
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited October 2010
    Nice, wish I had those kind of skills (and tools). I'm missing the tip of my right index to a table saw---1974'ish.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Nice, wish I had those kind of skills (and tools). I'm missing the tip of my right index to a table saw---1974'ish.

    Ouch... That is why I made the cross cut sleds. Also less chance of kick back.

    Skills wise? It cost me about $400 in wood to get decent:D. Fortunately the guy that I had do my kitchen is now keeping me in decent enough size 3/4 and 5/8's that I don't have to purchase much now days.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited October 2010
    I like the cross cut sled idea,I should build one for cutting the MDF for my next project.As birthday gift to myself I purchased a shiny new Freud 80 tooth thin kerf blade.I suspect it could rid me of body parts in short order should they accidently get in its path.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    FTGV wrote: »
    I like the cross cut sled idea,I should build one for cutting the MDF for my next project.As birthday gift to myself I purchased a shiny new Freud 80 tooth thin kerf blade.I suspect it could rid me of body parts in short order should they accidently get in its path.

    That is a nice blade. I put the Woodworker II in and wow what a difference. The crosscut sled is a 1 hour project which keeps paying off.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited October 2010
    Keep your body parts safe! I got this for panel cutting system and I couldn't be happier. It can also be used for routing neat cabinets.

    http://eurekazone.com/
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited October 2010
    megasat16 wrote: »
    Keep your body parts safe! I got this for panel cutting system and I couldn't be happier. It can also be used for routing neat cabinets.

    http://eurekazone.com/

    Find a great new sight everyday. A hinged track saw is my next DIY project.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2010
    It's hard to cut off any digits with one of these.

    561174riving20knife.jpg
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Ricardo
    Ricardo Posts: 10,636
    edited October 2010
    I built this crosscut sled. HIGHLY recommended, and you can cut at any angle.

    http://www.eaglelakewoodworking.com/post/Super-Sled-Crosscut-and-Miter-Sled.aspx


    DSC_0002-5.jpg
    _________________________________________________
    ***\\\\\........................... My Audio Journey ............................./////***

    2008 & 2010 Football Pool WINNER
    SOPA
    Thank God for different opinions. Imagine the world if we all wanted the same woman
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter