3.1TL's before and after

TrashyTrucker

Hey everyone,

Just wanted to show some proof (since I am the Newb here) that I am a fellow Polkie too. Here is my virgin speakers which still sound great BTW.
However I am starting this thread to show progress on upgrades on my 3.1's. Enclosed is some pics to show you nothing has been done so far.

Check the pic of my cd collection, Is that enough proof and do you think that entitles me to be somewhat of a true "audiophile" yet? Or do I keep the Newb sign for a while? :eek: LOL.
I will post more pics as I build...
Thanks,
Matt

Tony M

Nice speakers for sure. You must be loving your music every time you play something.

But you have to fill that bottom row with CD's to advance past newbie..:D

JK

nooshinjohn

tony millard wrote: »

But you have to fill that CD cabinet with VINYL to advance past newbie..:D

JK

Fixed!:p

And I am not kidding.;)

inspiredsports

nooshinjohn wrote: »

Fixed!:p

And I am not kidding.;)

So John, How is it you fixed TrashyTrucker's CD problem ??

TT: Nice Speakers, and Nice CD Collection!

TrashyTrucker

Ok all....
Just installed the RDO's and well:
Im not sure Im initally impressed to say the least, they compared to the SL3000 are not as "bright" they do seem "soft".
Is this due to some sort of break in period? I hope so.
I HAVE NOT done any other mods at this time. Perhaps the RDO's are NOT matched to my exsisting XO's? Perhaps I need to do the XO mod next to match the RDO's?

Thanks for help guys,
Matt

F1nut

In audio everything needs to break in, why would tweeters be any different?

Give them 48 hours as they will sound kinda hollow at first.

Tony M

I thought mine were subdued to at first but they did brighten up a little and then sounded great to me. About 40 hrs. is correct.;)

They will sound bright if you turn up the treble but I rarely do it.

fishbones

ABSOLUTELY it's because they need to break-in! You will be shocked when you let it run for 48 hours straight. To give an example, I replaced a tweeter in my left speaker, because of being pushed in by my son when he was younger. When I first fired it up, the whole left side of the soundstage sounded like it had collapsed - no space, no air, no life. It was boxy, and the sound stuck to the speaker cabinets. In the right channel, instruments floated freely from the cabinets, they had space and life to them.

I was expecting it to be different, but at first I thought....Did I hook it up backwards? Cause it sounds TERRIBLE! I thought...No, I double checked everything. It just needs to burn in Troy, It just needs to burn in. After 12 hours, I noticed good improvement. After 24, I noticed a major improvement. And after 48 hours, I noticed a huge improvement. By 2 weeks, it matched the other side perfectly and everything was beautiful again.

TrashyTrucker

F1nut wrote: »

In audio everything needs to break in, why would tweeters be any different?

Give them 48 hours as they will sound kinda hollow at first.

tony millard wrote: »

I thought mine were subdued to at first but they did brighten up a little and then sounded great to me. About 40 hrs. is correct.;)

They will sound bright if you turn up the treble but I rarely do it.

fishbones wrote: »

ABSOLUTELY it's because they need to break-in! You will be shocked when you let it run for 48 hours straight. To give an example, I replaced a tweeter in my left speaker, because of being pushed in by my son when he was younger. When I first fired it up, the whole left side of the soundstage sounded like it had collapsed - no space, no air, no life. It was boxy, and the sound stuck to the speaker cabinets. In the right channel, instruments floated freely from the cabinets, they had space and life to them.

I was expecting it to be different, but at first I thought....Did I hook it up backwards? Cause it sounds TERRIBLE! I thought...No, I double checked everything. It just needs to burn in Troy, It just needs to burn in. After 12 hours, I noticed good improvement. After 24, I noticed a major improvement. And after 48 hours, I noticed a huge improvement. By 2 weeks, it matched the other side perfectly and everything was beautiful again.

Thanks guys,
Thats real good news! I thought maybe since I have been listening to the
SL3000's for almost twenty years that my ears have come accustomed to their sound. I also purchased some dynamat from my favorite retailer today as well... I believe I will affix that on the spokes of the cages that will be next on the aggenda.

But check this idea I have. I spent several hundred dollars back in the 90's (Its more like a grand today/google XLO trust me!)on speaker wire and came up with this idea what if I used 8gauge wire that is used for power applications? Ie... car amps etc. (nice and fat wire but real flexible) I found some reasonable priced stranded oxygen-free 8gauge from my retailer and here is a picture of it below.
It comes in both brown and red, I will let you know if this experiment works or not. Might be overkill but should allow less resistance between A to B. Since I biamp this should be a great match.

Thanks for reading,

Matt


Matt

F1nut

If you mean as replacement chassis wire, some have tried that and reported no difference, but by all means, knock yourself out.

I see that you haven't upgraded your crossovers. Do that next and I believe you'll forget all about the chassis wire.

dorokusai

I agree. If you're bored, worry about chassis wire, otherwise hit the more important...obvious stuff first.

TrashyTrucker

F1nut wrote: »

If you mean as replacement chassis wire, some have tried that and reported no difference, but by all means, knock yourself out.

I see that you haven't upgraded your crossovers. Do that next and I believe you'll forget all about the chassis wire.

dorokusai wrote: »

I agree. If you're bored, worry about chassis wire, otherwise hit the more important...obvious stuff first.

Ok guys,

I will get on the horn wed and call soniccraft. Ricardo left me with a very detailed version of his build, wish me luck.

Matt

headrott

You will be happy when you are done and the capacitors are fully "burned-in". The 3.1's sound phenominal after the upgrade/replacement.

Greg

dorokusai

The RD0's will be a bit softer, as you put it....I get that statement. Just give them some time but the overall timbre will be a bit different from the SL3000 that you're used to hearing.

Relax, as after you upgrade the xover assemblies, the whole picture will shift for the better, again. Even before, just realize that you're hearing something new and different...it's normal to critique obvious changes, just don't get wrapped up in it for now. Enjoy the music, evaluate much later.

Loud & Clear

TrashyTrucker wrote: »

Ok guys,

Ricardo left me with a very detailed version of his build, wish me luck.

Matt

Man, does that sound hot.

TrashyTrucker

Ok guys couple of questions,

First in Ricardo's post:
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47929&highlight=crossover

He used the Mills resistors 2.5 and 2.7 in parallel-(Mills MRA12)
1)Who or where do I get the resistors? (mills)
2)When I order caps (sonicap)I guess I should copy Ricardo's formula?
3)Are those foil caps? I noticed one of the previous 12uf caps says MYLAR... what is mylar? and I suspect that is a lower grade cap? than the new replacement?
4)Ricardo used a 0.1uF bypass capacitor (Sonicap Platinum) did he run that in paralell with the 12uf in the middle of the board? please use the link and photo's as reference. UPDATE: I read the post again and he stated he REMOVED the bypass cap...now I think Im confused


BTW also somewhere in one of Headrott's older post of his XO upgrade of the 3.1's he used, and I cant remember the value...
5) Headrott used a resistor in place of jumper(s) there is two on this board
a. why replace jumper wire...?
b. should I replace both...?

I appologize for sounding like the nerdy school boy...but remember I am the new resident NewB here!
Thanks for looking,
Matt

headrott

Hi again Matt,

You can get the 12W mills resistors (2.5 ohm and 2.7 ohm) at Sonic Craft along with the Sonicraft capacitors. They are film capacitors but I am not sure anyone knows what type of film they are made from. Any fellow Polkie know? I found nothing about what they are manufactured from (other than a type of film). Mylar film capacitors are typically OK, but not outstanding (in most cases). Mylar is a type of film, made from polyethylene terephthalate (a plastic basically). I don't remember the values of capacitors that Ricardo used, but stick with the original values on the crossover and when you need to combine values (parallel capacitors) you should divide the total capacitance as evenly as possible between the two capacitors.

It has been decided that you should not use a bypass cap when high quality caps are used to replace the originals.

As far as me replacing the jumper in the s1 slot with a 0.5 ohm resistor it is a matter of taste and system set up, but I preferred it to only the jumper only. I recommend it, but it's up to your ears.

I think that covers everthing, but let me know if I missed anything or messed up on something.

Greg

F1nut

Parts list, total.

Caps;
(4) 12uF
(2) 24uF
(2) 55uF

Resistors;
(2) 1.3 ohm, 12 watt

Remove and disgard the 750pF bypass cap. Do not replace with a jumper.

All parts are available from Sonic Craft

TrashyTrucker

headrott wrote: »

Hi again Matt,

You can get the 12W mills resistors (2.5 ohm and 2.7 ohm) at Sonic Craft along with the Sonicraft capacitors.
It has been decided that you should not use a bypass cap when high quality caps are used to replace the originals.

As far as me replacing the jumper in the s1 slot with a 0.5 ohm resistor it is a matter of taste and system set up, but I preferred it to only the jumper only. I recommend it, but it's up to your ears.

I think that covers everthing, but let me know if I missed anything or messed up on something.

Greg

Thanks Greg for the help!

Matt

F1nut wrote: »

Parts list, total.

Caps;
(4) 12uF
(2) 24uF
(2) 55uF

Resistors;
(2) 1.3 ohm, 12 watt

Remove and disgard the 750pF bypass cap. Do not replace with a jumper.

All parts are available from Sonic Craft

Thanks Jesse! I will order next week. They have been off the last couple of days due to the holiday and all.
Matt

Ricardo

Matt,

Don't waste your time/money. Forget about the bypass. As you read, I removed mine a few days later.

TrashyTrucker

Hey all,
Just sent payment to Sonicraft and sent payment to Larry last week! While I think I know what "spikes" do. But would someone educate me or point me in the right direction as to the following:
1)Why I need them?
2)I have threaded inserts and already have "feet" for lack of better term from a NewB!
3)What was the standard size threads in the SRS series? do Stubby or Headrott or Ricardo know? are they 1/4 inch?
4)What would be a good starter set for mine?
5)If you want me to research on my own thats ok and fine! ha ha LOL!

Thanks in advance,

Matt
total spent so far:
331.00 Sonicraft
110.00 Larry's rings - complete kit (mw+Pr + rdo)
96.00 RDO 198's
100.00 spkr wire 8 guage

Whew! are we there yet?

TrashyTrucker

TrashyTrucker wrote: »

Hey all,
Just sent payment to Sonicraft and sent payment to Larry last week! While I think I know what "spikes" do. But would someone educate me or point me in the right direction as to the following:
1)Why I need them?
2)I have threaded inserts and already have "feet" for lack of better term from a NewB!
3)What was the standard size threads in the SRS series? do Stubby or Headrott or Ricardo know? are they 1/4 inch?
4)What would be a good starter set for mine?
5)If you want me to research on my own thats ok and fine! ha ha LOL!

Thanks in advance,

Matt
total spent so far:
331.00 Sonicraft
110.00 Larry's rings - complete kit (mw+Pr + rdo)
96.00 RDO 198's
100.00 spkr wire 8 guage
26.00 Dynamat extreme

Whew! are we there yet?

Alright guys! read some older post on what spikes do....! Done the research and searched for spikes but I have yet another question?
1)If I use spikes on carpet, would someone suggest shouldnt I use pads?

Mye sound says No! in this. Thanks hearingimpaired!

http://www.myesound.com/Points_n_pads.html



These wont hurt the carpet?
Can I get buy the ones for 10.00? or spurlge on the heavy ones?
If so I guess I need to ask them if I can get the big ones at 1/4-20 :rolleyes:
My SRS little brother 3.1's - weigh in at 101lbs a piece.

Thanks for looking,
The New generation of NewB(s)
Matt

F1nut

Get the big ones and yes, you can get them with 1/4-20 thread. Do not use the pads on carpet.

Who cares if they "hurt" the carpet!?!

Joe08867

Spikes will do no more harm to your carpet than a couch sitting in the same spot for several years. Probably less.

Don't use a pad on carpet. It negates the effect the spikes would have in the first place.

TrashyTrucker

Hey all,

Mye sound emailed me back and said:

http://www.myesound.com/Points_n_pads.html


They dont make the larger ones (1/2UNC) in 1/4-20. :mad:
1) what now? redrill to accept the larger ones? Put new inserts in?
If I do that, the spike will have to stay on there always. I could appreciate the flexability to switch back to what is on there now if I wanted to! Whats wrong with the smaller one (spike) of the two? See pic in link, 1st from the left! will that small one work too?
I am also waiting to hear from Mye sound as well as to his suggestions.

Thanks for looking guys,
Matt

dorokusai

I believe what F1Nut meant is simply get the biggest spike you are able from MyeSound. If I'm mistaken, he'll snap my neck. Stick w/ 1/4 20" thread as its the Polk standard.

TrashyTrucker

dorokusai wrote: »

I believe what F1Nut meant is simply get the biggest spike you are able from MyeSound. If I'm mistaken, he'll snap my neck. Stick w/ 1/4 20" thread as its the Polk standard.

Ok! thanks dorokusai. I thought he too (Jesse) was talking about that same way but wasnt quite sure.
I did NOT want to change the thread size if I could help it.

Matt

F1nut

Sorry for the confusion, Matt. Grant use to sell two sizes in 1/4-20. It appears that he is only selling one size now.

dorokusai

Jesse - I believe he will do other sizes but you have to ask and it depends on if he has other orders to justify the cost. It's not cheap for him to make them and the back end isn't all that much.

TrashyTrucker

Hey all,

Finshed the mods... I did dynamat, rings, and XO's all at the same time.
I would like to take this time and my thanks goes out to EVERYONE who was involved. Thanks again for your pics and tips and most of all your support.

It was a little tricky as Greg (headrott) explained in his post. You almost
have to "carve" the braces to install the rings. I found it easier to use a dremel
and to carve away at the braces a little at a time untill the rings fit. The rings
fit like a glove, I am very impressed with Larry's work on them. I am very pleased with the overall and integrity of this build, the rings allowed me to snug the bolts up real tight. Something that was not possible with the original standard screws that were factory.

The dynamat was a snap, however it was messy... LOL

The XO's were not that bad either. Like I stated earlier, I had much help with the other members supplying pics of their builds (Ricardo)
I had one problem with my cross over which I will post next.

Thanks for supporting me (Stubby) and especially (F1nut) who gave me the idea of and the confidence to tackle on these upgrades. Much appreciated

Here is some pics of the build(s),


Matt

TrashyTrucker

Here are some more pics

Matt