Question: why Hurricane nuts instead of Tee Nuts

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Comments

  • F1nutF1nut Posts: 39,478
    Guys, he's not using Mortite. He's using a permanently flexible bedding compound, butyl rubber.

    The problem with that, and I am familiar with butyl rubber, is it is too spongy. While it can make a good gasket it will prevent a solid coupling of the driver basket and the mounting bezel, IMO.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


  • pitdogg2pitdogg2 Posts: 9,657
    Yes i knew he was not using mortite, but butyl rubber comes many different ways.
    As you are well aware of the backside of dynamat stuff is also a butyl type it sticks pretty good to stuff.

    Anyhoots carry on
  • Rrusse11Rrusse11 Posts: 116
    pitdogg2 wrote: »
    STOP !!!! There is a reason mortite is no longer advocated. At some point you will want to take a driver out. Not only will that be very hard with mortite but it very well may take chunks of the cabinet with it.
    Armacell pipe tape works very well and will allow you to remove the driver if need be EASY.

    If that stuff you're using is anything like mortite do not use it

    Well, I don't know what "mortite" is. But I have used butyl rubber. In my experience it is removable. The answer is to seal the rebate. I'll use some shellac. Couple quick coats will seal the particle board surface. That will prevent the mastic from potentially pulling the board apart. I certainly take your point as to make the driver/speaker serviceable without pulling the substrate apart.

    Lol, this ain't my first rodeo bedding stuff down. AND having to remove it later.
    Just my first expedition with speakers.
    SDA SRS 2.3s
    Pair of Carver TFM 35s
    Carver C-1 Preamp
    CAL Icon MkII CD
    RTA 12s, need major work
  • Rrusse11Rrusse11 Posts: 116
    Tennma,
    If I could get Imgur to load a pic, I can show you my little pair of Gilbow snips that
    clip off part of the ring. Wiggling/fatiguing the Hnut will work, but by the time you've got one in the vise, I'll have clipped half a dozen. I'm not convinced yet that clipping them at all is needed. I'll have a go tomorrow at setting my PRs, and see if I can get some pics uploaded.
    Verb has the right idea, just more snip than needed.
    SDA SRS 2.3s
    Pair of Carver TFM 35s
    Carver C-1 Preamp
    CAL Icon MkII CD
    RTA 12s, need major work
  • Rrusse11Rrusse11 Posts: 116
    z32yesikrv2t.jpg
    SDA SRS 2.3s
    Pair of Carver TFM 35s
    Carver C-1 Preamp
    CAL Icon MkII CD
    RTA 12s, need major work
  • TennManTennMan Posts: 994
    Rrusse11 wrote: »
    Tennma,
    I'm not convinced yet that clipping them at all is needed.
    I think you are probably right that it's not "needed". It's been a few years since I did it so I don't remember for sure. But if you care about the way the h-nut installation looks when you're finished you will be glad you took the time to do it.

    SDA 2BTL · Sonicaps · Mills resistors · RDO-198s · New gaskets · H-nuts · Erse inductors · BH5 · Dynamat · Crossover upgrades by westmassguy
    Marantz 1504 AVR (front speaker pre-outs to Adcom 555)
    Adcom GFA-555 amp · Upgrades & speaker protection added by OldmanSRS
    Pioneer DV-610AV DVD/CD player
    SDA CRS+ · Hidden away in the closet
  • Rrusse11Rrusse11 Posts: 116
    TennMan,
    I can appreciate "how it looks", the only thing is, once done, it can't be seen, soooooo?
    On my PR's it's a deep rebate, and there's not a lot of material thickness left. Several of the screws are already stripped. Mention has been made of spinning the Hnut, ie. it looses it's grip on the particle board and strips.
    I'm wondering whether to leave the full ring and have a little ledge to put a bead of the
    loctite in to help lock the nut in place, provided it's not interfering with the speaker.
    Unlikely by the looks of things.
    My point is, clipping the Hnuts may be much ado about nothing, and there may be an advantage, from a mechanical view, for leaving them complete.

    Pittdogg,
    Alrightey, I had a look at "Mortite", almost undoubtedly a butyl rubber variant. And also the Armacell foam tape. If the point of either/both is get an airtight seal, I'm thinking of the PR press test, my bet is the butyl will give a more positive seal.
    I may well be tempted to seal the entire inside of the cabinet, particle board is notorious for being a hydroscopic material. I realise it has acoustic advantages,
    being relatively "dead", but as a building material it leaves a lot to be desired.
    MDF is better structurally, but I know too many people who've become sensitized to
    the formaldehydes in it. Most of the furniture/cabinetmaking industry never seals the inside of things. Good boatbuilders do.
    SDA SRS 2.3s
    Pair of Carver TFM 35s
    Carver C-1 Preamp
    CAL Icon MkII CD
    RTA 12s, need major work
  • Rrusse11Rrusse11 Posts: 116
    F1nut wrote: »
    Guys, he's not using Mortite. He's using a permanently flexible bedding compound, butyl rubber.

    The problem with that, and I am familiar with butyl rubber, is it is too spongy. While it can make a good gasket it will prevent a solid coupling of the driver basket and the mounting bezel, IMO.

    Dang,
    You guys are posting a lot faster than me! Lol, anyway thanks F1 for the point of having too much of a "cushion". Thin gasket bed is going to be the goal. Minimal
    material and the Hnut should allow me to torque 'em down tight. A good seal on the board should prevent the potential for porosity grabbing, and pulling apart the material for the eventual/inevitable need for disassembly.
    SDA SRS 2.3s
    Pair of Carver TFM 35s
    Carver C-1 Preamp
    CAL Icon MkII CD
    RTA 12s, need major work
  • audioluvraudioluvr Posts: 381
    This is what I used. I cleaned off the old gasket material from the baskets and stuck this on. Crushed down flat like the stock gasket and easy removal later down the road.

    bakfbx8so6s2.jpg
    SDA 1C's
    B&K Reference 50 Pre
    B&K M200 Sonata Monoblocks
    Cambridge Audio DVD 99
  • Rrusse11Rrusse11 Posts: 116
    audioluvr,
    Hey, that looks good, just the right size.
    Cheers!
    SDA SRS 2.3s
    Pair of Carver TFM 35s
    Carver C-1 Preamp
    CAL Icon MkII CD
    RTA 12s, need major work
  • JayMXJayMX Posts: 73
    edited February 10
    audioluvr wrote: »
    This is what I used. I cleaned off the old gasket material from the baskets and stuck this on. Crushed down flat like the stock gasket and easy removal later down the road.

    bakfbx8so6s2.jpg

    @audioluvr
    I copied you today as my modded 7’s don’t seal up too great, so I figured what the heck, I’ll give it a shot. Bought a roll for $4.50 at Home Depot. I tested the adhesive to make sure it didn’t screw with the MDF and it’s not strong enough to pull the wood away, so I laid just it in for a test and wow! The tape is perfect size and really easy to handle. H-nuts are on their way, but for now the seal is tons better and kick drum attack is tighter! Thanks for the lead.

    iq8zytou576i.jpeg

    3003fbe9z0bw.jpeg
    Upstairs 5.1.2:
    Marantz NR1607
    L/R - Modified Monitor 7C (194’s, Dynamat, Sonicaps, Mills, H-nuts)
    Center - Yamaha NS-C310
    Surrounds/height/Atmos - (4x) Proficient in-ceiling
    Sub - RBH TS10AN
    Marantz DV7600

    Downstairs 5.1.4:
    Marantz SR6011
    B&K ST-1430 feeding L/R
    L/R - SDA SRS 2, RTA12C (194's)
    Center - RBH 700-CX
    Surrounds - Monitor 5b (SL1000)
    Height/Atmos - (4x) Polk RC60i
    Sub - JBL 12” frankenspeaker
    Samsung bluray

    Office:
    Cambridge Soundworks Amp
    Monitor 4b (Peerless)

    Spares:
    Monitor 10a, Monitor 7b (Peerless), Monitor 5c
    ...and more to come, it’s a sickness.
  • F1nutF1nut Posts: 39,478
    edited February 10
    You may have a tight seal, but there's no way the baskets are coupled to mounting bezel. You want a gasket that is paper thin.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


  • JayMXJayMX Posts: 73
    F1nut wrote: »
    You may have a tight seal, but there's no way the baskets are coupled to mounting bezel. You want a gasket that is paper thin.

    I agree. This was just a $5 test. The gasket material does compress very well. When the h-nuts arrive I will redo with Armacell on the baskets.
    Upstairs 5.1.2:
    Marantz NR1607
    L/R - Modified Monitor 7C (194’s, Dynamat, Sonicaps, Mills, H-nuts)
    Center - Yamaha NS-C310
    Surrounds/height/Atmos - (4x) Proficient in-ceiling
    Sub - RBH TS10AN
    Marantz DV7600

    Downstairs 5.1.4:
    Marantz SR6011
    B&K ST-1430 feeding L/R
    L/R - SDA SRS 2, RTA12C (194's)
    Center - RBH 700-CX
    Surrounds - Monitor 5b (SL1000)
    Height/Atmos - (4x) Polk RC60i
    Sub - JBL 12” frankenspeaker
    Samsung bluray

    Office:
    Cambridge Soundworks Amp
    Monitor 4b (Peerless)

    Spares:
    Monitor 10a, Monitor 7b (Peerless), Monitor 5c
    ...and more to come, it’s a sickness.
  • I'm with Jesse on this, the MWs should be coupled with the front baffle, I think you will end up with either or both loose screws or deformed screw holes on the MWs
    Yamaha RXA1030, Yamaha CD
    Polk SDA2btl highly modded
    Polk SDA 1C
    Polk CS350 LS x2
    Polk m5jr
    Kimber 8TC
    Sony 55" Bravia
    Wish list SVS sub

  • Rrusse11Rrusse11 Posts: 116
    I'll be doing the PR's on my RTA 12s tomorrow. Hnuts and then I'll have a look at the back of the speaker. It's been mentioned that some have removed the old foam gaskets, perhaps the seal as above, there, rather than in the rebate in the cabinet, may ensure a metal to "wood" contact.
    SDA SRS 2.3s
    Pair of Carver TFM 35s
    Carver C-1 Preamp
    CAL Icon MkII CD
    RTA 12s, need major work
  • Rrusse11Rrusse11 Posts: 116
    Well I've installed about a 150 hurricane nuts now, and feel I'm getting it down, lol.
    My RTA 12s are very much particle board, I stuck with the recommended 13/64" bit.
    I did clip the "wings" around the binding posts, but left the lip, everywhere else. No problems. I'm putting a dab of Titebond on them prior to install, they seat well and I get a good visual on the seat as the glue squeezes out on the exposed flange lip.
    My 2.3s are a better grade of board, closer to MDF, and I went up on the drill size to a
    .208" bit, seated firmly without stripping the philips head of the installation screw.
    I only clipped a couple of the nuts on the tweaters where the internal braces were fouling the back of the nut. Again, the minor intrusion into the hole is of no consequence for mounting the speakers.
    I used some butyl well rolled out to about a 4mm string/boot lace and laid it into the juncture of the speaker flange and the basket, NOT into the cabinet rebate. Now you're just catching the critical corner with the sealant. Scraped the remnants of the tape off the metal bezel, and have a solid metal to board contact. Coupled with the back flange of the hnut, I've got excellent baffle/speaker unification. They sound better, and louder!
    Less is more with the butyl seal, don't overdo it. It doesn't take much if you've got it placed at the critcal juncture. Using the clutch on my battery drill, the drivers torqued in well. Be careful with the plastic tweeter flanges. Now my speakers pass the PR press test.
    Your Mileage WILL Vary
    SDA SRS 2.3s
    Pair of Carver TFM 35s
    Carver C-1 Preamp
    CAL Icon MkII CD
    RTA 12s, need major work
  • JayMXJayMX Posts: 73
    So I disassembled my 7's fo install H-Nuts, found that the brown MD rubber window seal does compress down very thin... Definitely thicker than OEM gasket but seemed to work fine for me, so I decided to leave it. Drilled through the gasket, installed the H-Nuts and reassembled. Holy cow they are sealed up tight now. Very pleased with the improvements in low end response.
    uoenyns4c2qg.jpeg
    Upstairs 5.1.2:
    Marantz NR1607
    L/R - Modified Monitor 7C (194’s, Dynamat, Sonicaps, Mills, H-nuts)
    Center - Yamaha NS-C310
    Surrounds/height/Atmos - (4x) Proficient in-ceiling
    Sub - RBH TS10AN
    Marantz DV7600

    Downstairs 5.1.4:
    Marantz SR6011
    B&K ST-1430 feeding L/R
    L/R - SDA SRS 2, RTA12C (194's)
    Center - RBH 700-CX
    Surrounds - Monitor 5b (SL1000)
    Height/Atmos - (4x) Polk RC60i
    Sub - JBL 12” frankenspeaker
    Samsung bluray

    Office:
    Cambridge Soundworks Amp
    Monitor 4b (Peerless)

    Spares:
    Monitor 10a, Monitor 7b (Peerless), Monitor 5c
    ...and more to come, it’s a sickness.
  • gp4jesusgp4jesus Posts: 1,129
    I will file this thread under "next time I open one of my speakers*."

    I followed Jesse w/H-nuts as above*.

    Right now I have more pressing "bought-house-less-than-a-year-ago (honey do)" projects keeping me busy till year's end.

    Rock on & enjoy. Tony
    Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED
    Outlaw Audio 975 Pre/Pro
    Samsung BDP, DirecTV Rcvr, Xbox 360, Dennon LDP, Phillips CD chgr

    Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside; CC outside
    BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside & out
    8 ga Powerline - LR woofers, inside & out

    LR: tri-amped RTi A7. Woofers, Rotel 98X amp; M & T, P'sound HCA-1000
    CC: Rotel RB985 -> tri-amped CSi A6
    5 Audio Pro Subs: 1 B1.39: 1 Evidence at each corner
    Surrounds: Hafler XL280 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3*
    Power Conditioning & Distribution:
    3 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 4 Furman Miniport 20s
    *Bi-amped by years end
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