RD0-194 upgrade in SDA SRS2 was a big disappointment

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jmardy
jmardy Posts: 27
edited February 10 in Vintage Speakers
Installed the pair in one speaker first, played some stuff in mono. Sounded dull and lacking high end. "Interesting..." I thought. So I installed the other pair in the other speaker. Definitely dull and rolled off.
So I installed one of the original SL2000's in each speaker (so I had a 194 and an SL2000) and it seems damn near perfect now. Have I committed (another) Polk Audio sin?
I don't care. I'm happy with my speakers now.

If anyone wants a practically new pair of 194's let me know.

Comments

  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 29,751
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    Don't take this the wrong way, but you may have high frequency hearing loss that makes the sl2000 sound more pleasing

    I think it's like plus 8db at 13khz which is a significant bump
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
  • jmardy
    jmardy Posts: 27
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    I definitely have high frequency hearing loss. It starts to go away at 12k.
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 52,406
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    I suggest you hold onto the RD0194-1 tweeters and install all of them. Listen to your speakers with them installed for a week or so, then put the SL2000's back in. Report back then.
  • Tony M
    Tony M Posts: 12,017
    edited February 10
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    @jmardy

    I'm 68 years young, and I have the same speakers you have. This is my second pair. I reluctantly had to sell my first pair. :s I've replaced all 8 tweeters with RD-0194s.

    I also can't hear above 11khz on a normal flat hearing test. I'm not sure if turning the equalizer/tone controls up around those higher frequencies allows me to hear above 11khz or not. I worked around loud trucks a lot in my life.

    Now, I agree with you that the RD-0194s sounded DULL when first installed. Too dulled, I THOUGHT but...

    MANY years ago, Polk Forum members here told me to give them a week or more, and they'd liven up. THEY DID, or I got used to them. The second pair, after quickly replacing them too, sounded a little dull, but quickly sounded just fine. REAL FINE in fact.

    Let them break in. B)

    Take the SL2000s back out. Break the 4 new ones in at the same time. In a month or less, you'll probably like the sound those beautiful speakers will be putting out. A lot of us have lived your experience. We all now agree the RD-0194s sound very nice, and better than the old SL2000s. ;)

    If you still prefer the older tweeters, we won't scorn you. We all hear differently. ;)


    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.

    “Anger is an acid that can do more harm to the vessel in which it is stored than to anything on which it is poured.”
    --Mark Twain.

    “If at first you don't succeed, then skydiving definitely isn't for you.” - Steven Wright
  • jmardy
    jmardy Posts: 27
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    Thank for the comments and suggestions.
    I'll give them another try.
  • gmcman
    gmcman Posts: 1,880
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    Are those the original crossovers? Maybe a fresh recap and possible a slight resistor value tweak to give the 194's a little air. I would think that's feasible....I would think the 194 would be a smoother tweeter all around and maybe you can give it that touch of sparkle....I'll let others chime in on that.
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,710
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    Make sure they have 50-75 hours of music to break in. They will sound much different after break in.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • audioluvr
    audioluvr Posts: 6,079
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    I'm betting your crossovers have not been upgraded. My 1C's sounded dull and muffled until I upgraded them.
    Gustard X26 Pro DAC
    Belles 21A Pre Upgraded with Mundorf Supremes
    B&K M200 Sonata monoblocks refreshed and upgraded
    Polk SDA 1C's modded / 1000Va Dreadnaught
    Wireworld Silver Eclipse IC's and speaker cables
    Harman Kardon T65C w/Grado Gold. (Don't laugh. It sounds great!)


    There is about a 5% genetic difference between apes and men …but that difference is the difference between throwing your own poo when you are annoyed …and Einstein, Shakespeare and Miss January. by Dr. Sardonicus
  • Emlyn
    Emlyn Posts: 4,905
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    In which tweeter position (top or bottom) did the 194 tweeters make the speakers sound better than original? Although I'm not certain about the SRS 2, I suspect the tweeters have different crossover frequencies and don't produce the same spectrum top and bottom because the SRS models are supposed to be progressive point source. Could be the remaining SL2000s are only producing frequencies in the less offensive position in the speakers and the 194s have fixed the offensive sparkly high frequency spike.

    Big disappointment seems to be an overstatement if the 194s did make a positive impact. But it's also true that some listeners have liked the less than accurate SL2000s and stuck with them. I thought they were awful and harsh sounding with modern equipment driving them.

    Being happy with the speakers the way they perform in one's own system is all that really matters.
  • jmardy
    jmardy Posts: 27
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    Well I can't quite explain it. Maybe I had the 194's connected out of phase the first time?
    I followed the advice to give them another try a day or two later and they sound fantastic. Especially when they're loud (Fletcher Munson is my friend!).

    My 24 year-old son listened to them and his reaction was "Holy ****".
    So thanks again for all the great input and advice.
  • Tony M
    Tony M Posts: 12,017
    edited February 12
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    I'm glad they now sound right to you, too. B)

    Try playing some "YELLO" music on them.

    I listened to Pocket Universe not long ago. I was amazed for about 60 minutes. ;)

    https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.

    “Anger is an acid that can do more harm to the vessel in which it is stored than to anything on which it is poured.”
    --Mark Twain.

    “If at first you don't succeed, then skydiving definitely isn't for you.” - Steven Wright
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 52,406
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    jmardy wrote: »
    Well I can't quite explain it. Maybe I had the 194's connected out of phase the first time?
    I followed the advice to give them another try a day or two later and they sound fantastic. Especially when they're loud (Fletcher Munson is my friend!).

    My 24 year-old son listened to them and his reaction was "Holy ****".
    So thanks again for all the great input and advice.

    👍👍👍
  • skipshot12
    skipshot12 Posts: 2,156
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    Awesome, glad you found the sound.
  • xllr8
    xllr8 Posts: 25
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    VR3 wrote: »
    Don't take this the wrong way, but you may have high frequency hearing loss that makes the sl2000 sound more pleasing

    I think it's like plus 8db at 13khz which is a significant bump

    Even before my high-frequency hearing loss, I preferred the SL2000, and I still do—largely for its particular textural character, especially since I listen at relatively low levels. The RD0194 is clearly smoother, yet it still strikes me as somewhat hot in its own way, almost as though there's a sustained lift above 10 kHz.

    Even with stoooopid amounts of treble attenuation (EQ + tone controls), I find the SL2000 produces a more engaging presentation right out of the box. I could probably sculpt some excitement into the RD0194 with EQ, but during the one day I could tolerate listening to it, I was disappointed by how much smaller everything seemed. For reference, I connected black/blue to red tab.

    What struck me most was the apparent lack of integration between the tweeters and midwoofers. There seemed to be a sharp spatial transition: the SDA effect remained wide, but the treble sounded narrow and close-in. With the SL2000, the presentation feels much more uniform in width and overall scale, even with substantial treble attenuation.

    The RD0194 genuinely seemed to shrink the SDA presentation and the soundstage as a whole. It became reminiscent of the more restrained, "polite" presentation of my 3.1TLs, rather than the enormous, continuous spatial presentation I enjoy from the older Polks.

    The RD0194s did, however, teach me something valuable: what people mean when they describe treble as "grainy." And yes, the SL2000 is noticeably grainy on vocals. But that wispy, papery, slightly scratchy high-frequency texture gives music an almost ASMR-like quality.

    I suspect that's part of what made me fall in love with Polk SDA speakers in the first place. That peculiar sense of texture, combined with their otherwise smooth, relaxed, warm, almost liquid presentation, creates something I find extraordinarily engaging. My first pair was the SDA 2B, and that combination left quite an impression.

  • xllr8
    xllr8 Posts: 25
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    @Tony M ... what would you say happened to the sound with extended listening that made the 194s favorable? funny that you mention Yello, that's my goto check for SDA/treble (all that sax & reverbs...). one sl2000 sound seems enormous and scaled to room... with 194 smaller almost in between speakers, and very "conventional" speaker sounding... I wonder what I'm missing...
  • Tony M
    Tony M Posts: 12,017
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    I worked around a lot of loud machinery and equipment in my life.

    I was one who liked the SL2000s because of the pronounced midrange volume. I've owned enough Polk monitors to know that some of the SL2000s would come unglued, and the sound was raspier with those. You can see the delamination around the fisheye rim where some is black, and some becomes clear.

    I saw and heard what people on this forum talked about and paid the 200.00 for 4 of the RD-0194s.

    I knew the sound would be lacking in the mids, per what everybody said would happen. I knew the new tweeters would get louder after a week or a month. AND they did. The new RD-0194s got louder and fill in the sound range pretty darn well now. I don't notice a lack in the mids through the highs at all.

    Playing Yello's Pocket Universe through my SDA-SRS2s was a musical experience I think I'll never forget. It lacked nothing. The sound seemed PERFECTLY rendered.

    I don't know why you would change the wire hook-ups.

    I don't hear above 11 kHz. But below that, the RD-0194s DO smooth out the output. Not as loud, but still, the music seems to be there without the HORN-blaring volume the SL2000s are known for.

    Remember, I liked the SL2000s that weren't coming unglued in some of my Polk speakers. But after replacing all of my SL2000s, I don't need to think I maybe should go back to them.
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.

    “Anger is an acid that can do more harm to the vessel in which it is stored than to anything on which it is poured.”
    --Mark Twain.

    “If at first you don't succeed, then skydiving definitely isn't for you.” - Steven Wright