Amplifier for L800s

Options
gdontu
gdontu Posts: 2
in 2 Channel Audio
Hello,

Does anyone know if Mark Levinson 533H would work with the Polk L800s. They advertise it as fully-differential.

Thank you for your help.
· Share on FacebookShare on Twitter

Answers

  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,832
    Options
    Fully-differential amps will not work with the L800.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • gdontu
    gdontu Posts: 2
    Options
    Thank you for your quick response. Any recommendations for high end amplifiers that would work with the L800s?
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • SeleniumFalcon
    SeleniumFalcon Posts: 3,515
    Options
    From the speaker's designer, Scott Orth:

    "The L800 will not provide full SDA with a differential/balanced output amplifier. This is because the Dimensional Array is driven off of the positive leads only. So, half of the signal from a differential/balanced amplifier is on the negative leads. Hence the Dimensional Array only gets half of what it need to be fully functional. We have not had any amp issues using these types of amps."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • malo2464
    malo2464 Posts: 3
    Options
    I am an owners of Yamaha AS-1200 integrated amplifier. Now I am looking for new speakers. The polks L800 speakers have a special required for SDA mode. They are need to have an amplifier with single-ended circuit. I know the AS-1200 is floating of normal ground, It's not necessary mean is it don't have a 0 like Vref or not single-ended. Can you tell me if then Yamaha AS-1200 is compatible with Polks L1800? Thanks
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • SeleniumFalcon
    SeleniumFalcon Posts: 3,515
    edited February 24
    Options
    I found this in the owner's manual:

    wle383papq1b.png

    This would reduce the amount of SDA signal produced by the speakers, so probably not a good match with the L800.
    This is from Scott Orth, the designer of the speakers:


    "The L800 will not provide full SDA with a differential/balanced output amplifier. This is because the Dimensional Array is driven off of the positive leads only. So, half of the signal from a differential/balanced amplifier is on the negative leads. Hence the Dimensional Array only gets half of what it need to be fully functional."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • pitdogg2
    pitdogg2 Posts: 24,610
    Options
    Step down to the L600's problem solved.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • skipshot12
    skipshot12 Posts: 1,016
    Options
    Find yourself a complete WOPL converted Phase Linear 700.
    Personal preference… I like the Series II myself.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • skipshot12
    skipshot12 Posts: 1,016
    Options
    Once the complete conversion’s done they test out in the 500w per channel range and the best part is, the crazy high damping factor they posses.

    I have two Clair bros converted amps. Was going to biamp my SDA SRS’s but only one is needed.

    Good luck with your search.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,832
    Options
    the crazy high damping factor they posses.

    Fun audio facts.

    To obtain that requires tons of negative feedback, which is not a good thing.

    In addition, the difference between a damping factor of 50 and 1000 is so, so tiny that it is a total and complete non-factor.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • invalid
    invalid Posts: 1,286
    Options
    F1nut wrote: »
    the crazy high damping factor they posses.

    Fun audio facts.

    To obtain that requires tons of negative feedback, which is not a good thing.

    In addition, the difference between a damping factor of 50 and 1000 is so, so tiny that it is a total and complete non-factor.

    I would rather have an overbuilt big power supply than a high damping factor.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • audioluvr
    audioluvr Posts: 5,457
    Options
    Since I never get positive feedback, I've learned to like negative feedback...
    Gustard X26 Pro DAC
    Belles 21A Pre modded with Mundorf Supreme caps
    B&K M200 Sonata monoblocks refreshed and upgraded
    Polk SDA 1C's modded / 1000Va Dreadnaught
    Wireworld Silver Eclipse IC's and speaker cables
    Harman Kardon T65C w/Grado Gold. (Don't laugh. It sounds great!)

    There is about a 5% genetic difference between apes and men …but that difference is the difference between throwing your own poo when you are annoyed …and Einstein, Shakespeare and Miss January. by Dr. Sardonicus
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 25,115
    Options
    audioluvr wrote: »
    Since I never get positive feedback, I've learned to like negative feedback...

    Would you like a participation trophy to make you feel better?
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD

    “When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • audioluvr
    audioluvr Posts: 5,457
    Options
    nooshinjohn wrote: »
    audioluvr wrote: »
    Since I never get positive feedback, I've learned to like negative feedback...

    Would you like a participation trophy to make you feel better?

    Oh John, you tease!
    Gustard X26 Pro DAC
    Belles 21A Pre modded with Mundorf Supreme caps
    B&K M200 Sonata monoblocks refreshed and upgraded
    Polk SDA 1C's modded / 1000Va Dreadnaught
    Wireworld Silver Eclipse IC's and speaker cables
    Harman Kardon T65C w/Grado Gold. (Don't laugh. It sounds great!)

    There is about a 5% genetic difference between apes and men …but that difference is the difference between throwing your own poo when you are annoyed …and Einstein, Shakespeare and Miss January. by Dr. Sardonicus
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • skipshot12
    skipshot12 Posts: 1,016
    Options
    Y’all should really give one of those WOPL amps a go……
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • malo2464
    malo2464 Posts: 3
    Options
    Thanks for all your comments. I was already on the brakes with some bad reviews. Now I'm going to change direction.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • malo2464
    malo2464 Posts: 3
    Options
    The Polk salesman and representative are not aware of the compatibility problem with the differential amplifier. This may be a case of wilful blindness.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • skipshot12
    skipshot12 Posts: 1,016
    Options
    F1nut wrote: »
    the crazy high damping factor they posses.

    Fun audio facts.

    To obtain that requires tons of negative feedback, which is not a good thing.

    In addition, the difference between a damping factor of 50 and 1000 is so, so tiny that it is a total and complete non-factor.

    Ok….. is negative feedback on an ss amp bad?
    If so, why?
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • invalid
    invalid Posts: 1,286
    Options
    All solid state amplifiers have negative feedback, otherwise they wouldn't work. It depends on how the feedback is applied and what type of amp it is.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,066
    edited March 19
    Options
    There is no need for negative feedback per se -- ss or vacuum tube, direct, capacitor, or transformer coupled, class A, B or AB.
    Nelson Pass's famous (or infamous, depending on one's bent) and ultra-simple solid state "Amp Camp Amp" uses no negative feedback, for example...

    (EDIT: oops. :blush:)

    Negative feedback is used to broaden and flatten frequency response, decrease harmonic distortion, and reduce output impedance (i.e., "increase damping factor"). These are all Good Things.
    The trick is for the cure not to get worse than the disease. Think of Autotune. ;)
    Poorly implemented NFB can lead to many ills, some audible, some potentially disastrous (i.e., amplifier instability resulting in high frequency amplification and the rapid unscheduled disassembly, functionally speaking, of the amplifier when presented with a non-ideal (reactive) load -- such as the famous (or infamous, depending on one's bent) Polk Audio Cobra Cables -- or a QUAD ESL-57 electrostatic loudspeaker (which is nearly a short-circuit at 20 kHz).

    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • invalid
    invalid Posts: 1,286
    edited March 20
    Options
    Can you Name one solid state amplifier that has zero feedback? The amp camp amp has local feedback. Even triode tube amps have feedback, the tube itself has feedback.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,832
    Options
    skipshot12 wrote: »
    F1nut wrote: »
    the crazy high damping factor they posses.

    Fun audio facts.

    To obtain that requires tons of negative feedback, which is not a good thing.

    In addition, the difference between a damping factor of 50 and 1000 is so, so tiny that it is a total and complete non-factor.

    Ok….. is negative feedback on an ss amp bad?
    If so, why?

    I didn't say that. I said to obtain a crazy high damping factor requires tons of negative feedback, which tends to result in a lot of noise.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • skipshot12
    skipshot12 Posts: 1,016
    Options
    Thank you for the explanation.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • mpitogo
    mpitogo Posts: 478
    Options
    I spoke to Scott Orth about this topic way way back Nov 2019 as I bought the first pair. Try Rotel RB-1590. Or Parasound, they have some really good single-ended power amps. I went a different route, single-ended on top end and balanced on the low end. It’s a shame it doesn’t work with the PM-10. I’ve seen Polk demo the L800 with PM-KI Ruby.
    • Living Room Music-2.0 Polk Legend L800 | McIntosh C70 | McIntosh MA5200 (Treble) | McIntosh MC452 (Bass) | Sublimeacoustic K231 Active xover | Denon DP-2500A | Denafrips Ares II | Belkin Soundform Connect | iPad Air USB to DAC
    • Media Room Ht-7.2.6/13.1 (Atmos/Auro-3D) Polk LSiM707, LSiM706c, LSiM702 F/X [x4], height LSiM703 [x6], HSU VTF-15H MK2 Dual | Marantz AV8805A | Rotel RB-1590 (L/R) | Appollon NC500 11ch | Sony UBP-X800 | AppleTV 4K | JVC RS2100 | 150” Elite Screen Acoustic Pro UHD
    • Game Room-5.1 Polk LSi25, LSiC, LSiF/X | Marantz SR7009 | AppleTV 4K | Xbox One S | Sony PS2, PS3 | Nintendo Wii | Gaming PC | Sony 75" LCD
    • Master Bedroom Music-2.0 Totem Hawk | Marantz PM-10 | Marantz SA-10 | SONY PS-HX500
    • Office-2.0 Ascend Acoustics Sierra LX, DSW microPRO3000 | Rotel RA-1570 | Marantz HD-CD1
    • Daughter's Bedroom 1-2.0 TBD Martin Logan Forte | Roku TV
    • Guest Room 2-2.0 Klipsch RP-600M | Martin Logan Forte
    • Guest Room 3-3.0 Martin Logan Motion 40, 50XT | Onkyo TX-SR705 | Apple TV | Samsung 55" TV
    • Guest Room 4-2.0 QAcoustics 3030i | Sansui AU-6900 | Topping DX7s | Sansui FR-1080 | Fire TV
    • Maintenance: Pro-Ject VC-S Record Cleaning Machine
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter