Recommendations for Sub woofer with Polk 2.3s
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bem - along the lines of what @WLDock and @engie490 mentioned about the room, and what @Gardenstater suggested about flipping the setup - I am curious as to whether there are any spots in your room with the current setup that you do get the bass response you're after.
The reason I bring this up is because I (re)discovered by accident one day while experimenting with other gear a spot in my main space where I do get better bass.
Unfortunately, a setup to use this as a listening position doesn't work as well for the room layout since the gear covers the main window. It was the original listening position when I first set everything up in the beginning, though, and I since I'd always used a sub, I didn't really notice the change when I first shifted the space. It wasn't until I started exploring 2ch without the sub that I noticed that dead frequency range, and thought it my speakers and then that "bass suckout" effect.
You might be able to move around your room to different listening positions with test tracks playing to see if there's better bass response anywhere else before you start moving stuff.I disabled signatures. -
I know that it is a common phenomena to get better bass in the corners of a room, and it's my understanding that that is why bass traps are often placed there, but in a room deficient in bass it can be a plus.
George / NJ
Polk 7B main speakers, std. mods+ (1979, orig owner)
Martin Logan Dynamo sub w/6ft 14awg Power Cord
Crown D150 amp
Logitech Squeezebox Touch Streamer w/EDO applet
iFi nano iDSD DAC
iPurifier3
iDefender w/ iPower PS
Custom Steve Wilson 1m UPOCC Interconnect
iFi Mercury 0.5m OFHC continuous cast copper USB cable
Custom Ribbon Speaker Cables, 5ft long, 4N Copper, 14awg, ultra low inductance
Custom Vibration Isolation Speaker Stands and Sub Platform -
Well guys, I really appreciate all the help here. Unfortunately I’m limited in where I can place the speakers. The flip side of the room for speaker placement probably has the best shot at helping me out, but if it worked , room rearrangements would be difficult to for me to get past my wife. msg’s suggestion for room dividing panels is interesting but If it worked it would be hard sell aesthetically. Given the room layout and limited options, I just going to have to move forward with evaluating a sub woofer in the room. This is a great forum and I’m glad to be long time member.
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Well guys, I really appreciate all the help here. Unfortunately I’m limited in where I can place the speakers. The flip side of the room for speaker placement probably has the best shot at helping me out, but if it worked , room rearrangements would be difficult to for me to get past my wife.
You don't have a bass problem, but rather a wife problem... Hang this on the door and all your troubles will be solved.
The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
Yeaht, sometimes we have constraints.
That was actually Gardenstater who offered the room dividing panels.Well guys, I really appreciate all the help here. Unfortunately I’m limited in where I can place the speakers. The flip side of the room for speaker placement probably has the best shot at helping me out, but if it worked , room rearrangements would be difficult to for me to get past my wife. msg’s suggestion for room dividing panels is interesting but If it worked it would be hard sell aesthetically. Given the room layout and limited options, I just going to have to move forward with evaluating a sub woofer in the room. This is a great forum and I’m glad to be long time member.I disabled signatures. -
Be sure to report back with the results!nooshinjohn wrote: »Well guys, I really appreciate all the help here. Unfortunately I’m limited in where I can place the speakers. The flip side of the room for speaker placement probably has the best shot at helping me out, but if it worked , room rearrangements would be difficult to for me to get past my wife.
You don't have a bass problem, but rather a wife problem... Hang this on the door and all your troubles will be solved.I disabled signatures. -
Gardenstater/msg
Sorry about the mixup on the room panel idea. Again, I appreciate all the help. -
No worries! If you try it and it doesn't work, it was MSG's idea
George / NJ
Polk 7B main speakers, std. mods+ (1979, orig owner)
Martin Logan Dynamo sub w/6ft 14awg Power Cord
Crown D150 amp
Logitech Squeezebox Touch Streamer w/EDO applet
iFi nano iDSD DAC
iPurifier3
iDefender w/ iPower PS
Custom Steve Wilson 1m UPOCC Interconnect
iFi Mercury 0.5m OFHC continuous cast copper USB cable
Custom Ribbon Speaker Cables, 5ft long, 4N Copper, 14awg, ultra low inductance
Custom Vibration Isolation Speaker Stands and Sub Platform -
I read back through your replies and didn't see a mention of double checking the polarity of the wires. If you have not done that, please do.
Over the last eight years I've had about about 8 different sets of main speakers, 7 center channels, 4 surround speakers, etc. and moved to 3 different homes. I've mixed up polarity more than once in that time frame. Every time I say, "I can't believe I did that!"
The less than desirable sound stage and lack of bass is always the giveaway.2.2 Office Setup | LG 29UB55 21:9 UltraWide | HP Probook 630 G8 | Dell Latitude | Cabasse Stream Amp 100 | Boston Acoustics VS 240 | AUDIORAX Desk Stands | Mirage Omni S8 sub1 | Mirage Omni S8 Sub2 -
Yeah I'll second that and I'll add that after you Dynamat the speakers you cannot necessarily see the red dots that are placed by the positive terminals. I have two MW6500's that have the positive on opposite sides. The easy way to check for which is the positive is to remove the driver and disconnect the fastons and place a 9V battery momentarily against the terminals while noting the direction that the cone moves. Outward means positive to positive and negative to negative and inward means negative to positive and postive to negative. I'm sure different Polk speakers followed different wiring color codes but I wouldn't even rely upon that. Check the schematic and trace the wires back to the XO. In my 7B's black was positive and white was negative.George / NJ
Polk 7B main speakers, std. mods+ (1979, orig owner)
Martin Logan Dynamo sub w/6ft 14awg Power Cord
Crown D150 amp
Logitech Squeezebox Touch Streamer w/EDO applet
iFi nano iDSD DAC
iPurifier3
iDefender w/ iPower PS
Custom Steve Wilson 1m UPOCC Interconnect
iFi Mercury 0.5m OFHC continuous cast copper USB cable
Custom Ribbon Speaker Cables, 5ft long, 4N Copper, 14awg, ultra low inductance
Custom Vibration Isolation Speaker Stands and Sub Platform -
In vintage Polk speakers black or blue are positive. White or green are negative.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
It’s true, I haven’t checked the polarity. That’s a great idea. It may be a week or so before I can do it. I’ll report back after I do. I do remember that when I did The VR3 crossover upgrade that there were was a red dot on each speaker.
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Like others have said, your speakers should be producing plenty of bass after the mods are complete. How many hours do you have on the new caps and resistors? Mine took around 200 hours of break-in before really coming alive.
I dont have my 2.3's spiked. They are on granite slabs which rest on the carpet. Plenty of satisfying bass even though the speakers arent optimally placed.
For home theater, I run dual SVS PB13 Ultras. No lack of bass there and they compliment the speakers nicely in HT mode. Because I use a separate pre for music, I never have the SVS subs on for 2 channel listening. The 2.3s do so nicely I dont miss having subs for music.____________________________________________________________
polkaudio Fully Modded SDA SRS 1.2TLs + Dreadnaught, LSiM706c, 4 X Polk Surrounds + 4 X ATMOS, SVS PB13 Ultra X 2, Pass Labs X1, Marantz 7704, Bob Carver Crimson Beauty 350 Tube Mono Blocks, ADCOM GFA 7807 + 5400, Panasonic UB420, Moon 380D DAC, EPSON Pro Cinema 6050 -
Like others have said, your speakers should be producing plenty of bass after the mods are complete. How many hours do you have on the new caps and resistors? Mine took around 200 hours of break-in before really coming alive.
I dont have my 2.3's spiked. They are on granite slabs which rest on the carpet. Plenty of satisfying bass even though the speakers arent optimally placed.
For home theater, I run dual SVS PB13 Ultras. No lack of bass there and they compliment the speakers nicely in HT mode. Because I use a separate pre for music, I never have the SVS subs on for 2 channel listening. The 2.3s do so nicely I dont miss having subs for music.
dppowell
I’ve got about 230 hrs on my modded 2.3s. I believe that they are pretty well broken in and as I mentioned in an earlier post I had a lot more bass on the speakers before I moved them to a larger room with hardwood floors. I really suspect that I’ve got a room issue that caused the decrease in bass. Based on all the input from fellow members in this posting I’ve got 2 action items. One is to confirm wiring and polarity on my speakers. The second is to relocate the speakers to the opposite side of the room. The relocation, if successful, may be a tough sell (WAF), but I still want to pursue it in the interest of science.
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Just out of curiosity can you feel any vibration through your feet when playing heavy bass material at decent volume levels in this new room with the suspended hardwood floor? If so, then I would seriously look into vibration isolation. Cleans up the bass tremendously which effectively makes it punchier. You'd be surprised but it will clean up the midrange and treble too which I believe is because that vibration effects the motion of the voice coil/cone assemblies enough to be very audible.
For those who don't want to DIY like I did there are interesting products out there (which I haven't tried - disclaimer). These are a couple which, coupled with your bass braces, could have a noticeable effect:
https://www.solid-tech.net/disc-of-silence/
https://www.solid-tech.net/isoblack/
Now ducking for the tomatoes......George / NJ
Polk 7B main speakers, std. mods+ (1979, orig owner)
Martin Logan Dynamo sub w/6ft 14awg Power Cord
Crown D150 amp
Logitech Squeezebox Touch Streamer w/EDO applet
iFi nano iDSD DAC
iPurifier3
iDefender w/ iPower PS
Custom Steve Wilson 1m UPOCC Interconnect
iFi Mercury 0.5m OFHC continuous cast copper USB cable
Custom Ribbon Speaker Cables, 5ft long, 4N Copper, 14awg, ultra low inductance
Custom Vibration Isolation Speaker Stands and Sub Platform -
@bem have you tried removing the braces and changing the distance from the rear wall? Sometimes that can have an effect. Have you tried the sub crawl to be sure it is not the listening position? Another thought is to try a rug or heavy blanket over the railing. It might not do much, but I have heard of stranger things. You can't really cover the entire stair opening, but it might help. Another thought is if you have a small sub like an 8in or computer sub, you could try different locations to see how the room shape effects things. For rectangular rooms there are sub calculators, and it is amazing how much the placement can make a difference.
For subs, I have to agree with the Rythmik and Velodyne recommendations. Given the current room issues, a DSP will probably be a big help as well. -
@bem have you tried removing the braces and changing the distance from the rear wall? Sometimes that can have an effect. Have you tried the sub crawl to be sure it is not the listening position? Another thought is to try a rug or heavy blanket over the railing. It might not do much, but I have heard of stranger things. You can't really cover the entire stair opening, but it might help. Another thought is if you have a small sub like an 8in or computer sub, you could try different locations to see how the room shape effects things. For rectangular rooms there are sub calculators, and it is amazing how much the placement can make a difference.
For subs, I have to agree with the Rythmik and Velodyne recommendations. Given the current room issues, a DSP will probably be a big help as well.
piquant
I’ve tried changing the distance from the rear wall but with no success. Tried your suggestion with the heavy blanket but no luck there. I’m going have to bite the bullet and try flipping the speakers to the opposite side which has no stairway with a solid floor and walls. I’ll probably do that in the next few days. -
@bem have you tried removing the braces and changing the distance from the rear wall? Sometimes that can have an effect. Have you tried the sub crawl to be sure it is not the listening position? Another thought is to try a rug or heavy blanket over the railing. It might not do much, but I have heard of stranger things. You can't really cover the entire stair opening, but it might help. Another thought is if you have a small sub like an 8in or computer sub, you could try different locations to see how the room shape effects things. For rectangular rooms there are sub calculators, and it is amazing how much the placement can make a difference.
For subs, I have to agree with the Rythmik and Velodyne recommendations. Given the current room issues, a DSP will probably be a big help as well.
piquant
I’ve tried changing the distance from the rear wall but with no success. Tried your suggestion with the heavy blanket but no luck there. I’m going have to bite the bullet and try flipping the speakers to the opposite side which has no stairway with a solid floor and walls. I’ll probably do that in the next few days.
Sorry, I meant to say” pkquat” not piquant! -
Has anybody mentioned the battery test to make sure all the drivers are in phase?Mojo Audio Illuminati v3>>Quantum Byte w/LMS>>Rpi/PiCoreplayer>> Starlight 7 USB >> Mojo Audio Mystique v2 SE>>ModWright SWL 9.0 SE Signature>>Hafler DH-500 Amp+ (Musical Concepts Fully Modded)>>
SRS 2.3TL (Fully Modded)...Velodyne Optimum 8 subwoofer
1KVA Dreadnought
Marantz SA 8005
Pioneer PLX-1000 Turntable - Shure SC35C/N35X - V15III/VN35HE
Yamaha TX-540 Tuner...Sony BDP-S570
Sony PS4
Separate subpanel with four dedicated 20 amp circuits.
1. Amplification 2. Analog 3. Digital 4. Video
"All THAT IS LOST FROM THE SOURCE IS LOST FOREVER" -
BTW
I added a Velodyne sub to my 2.3TL's and the results in my room are very good.Mojo Audio Illuminati v3>>Quantum Byte w/LMS>>Rpi/PiCoreplayer>> Starlight 7 USB >> Mojo Audio Mystique v2 SE>>ModWright SWL 9.0 SE Signature>>Hafler DH-500 Amp+ (Musical Concepts Fully Modded)>>
SRS 2.3TL (Fully Modded)...Velodyne Optimum 8 subwoofer
1KVA Dreadnought
Marantz SA 8005
Pioneer PLX-1000 Turntable - Shure SC35C/N35X - V15III/VN35HE
Yamaha TX-540 Tuner...Sony BDP-S570
Sony PS4
Separate subpanel with four dedicated 20 amp circuits.
1. Amplification 2. Analog 3. Digital 4. Video
"All THAT IS LOST FROM THE SOURCE IS LOST FOREVER" -
Update!
BASS IS BACK!
Relocated speakers to the opposite side of the room and I'm happy to report that the bass on my modded 2.3s is back and as solid as ever. Those of you who suggested that my lack of bass problem might be related to the stairway to the side of my right speaker were right on. I switched the speakers to the opposite side of the room for about 2 days and gave them a thorough listening. Without question, the bass is much more pronounced and is now almost overwhelming. I actually had to move them further away from the back wall due to amount of bass that I was hearing. It's amazing how different they sound. The speakers were placed about 3.5 ft from the side walls and were the same distance apart as they were on the "problem" side of the room.
Unfortunately, I could only keep them there for a 2 day trial and they have been moved back to the original problem wall as I now need to begin planning the best way to move all of my components to the opposite side as well as negotiating with my wife on how to make the switch without causing issues with other furniture etc in the room. Hopefully these will be peaceful negotiations. The cash that I saved on not needing a subwoofer will probably go into other room mods associated with flipping to the other side.
Thanks for everyone's input on this post. -
Tell her you're redecorating then take her shopping.Gustard X26 Pro DAC
Belles 21A Pre modded with Mundorf Supreme caps
B&K M200 Sonata monoblocks refreshed and upgraded
Polk SDA 1C's modded / 1000Va Dreadnaught
Wireworld Silver Eclipse IC's and speaker cables
Harman Kardon T65C w/Grado Gold. (Don't laugh. It sounds great!)
There is about a 5% genetic difference between apes and men …but that difference is the difference between throwing your own poo when you are annoyed …and Einstein, Shakespeare and Miss January. by Dr. Sardonicus -
I currently use a Polk Audio PSW 650 subwoofer with my 2.3tl's. They sound great together to me. The 650 was said to be made to compliment music and tv. I had a surround system, but have gone back to just a 2 channel setup.
I HOPE once I get the crossovers rebuilt in the 2.3's that I can get rid of the subwoofer and still have the bass punch I like. If not, I will look into subwoofer alternatives to make the wife happy, like in-wall subs or similar. She hate this "ugly black box".
