Small speaker advice

boston1450boston1450 Posts: 6,634
Need a real small pair of speaker advice. They need to be 12-14 inch or less. They need to be able to run on small 2.5 wpc mini SS/tube amplifier OR I have a 50w mini amp. 200-350.00 range less/more. For a off grid camp. 12volt to inverter. Any suggestions ? I was using Klipsch Heresy-2's & it was great. Just too big to fit under a shelf I made with only 15in clearance. (Dont want to move shelf & speaker blocking window view) Any advice would be great. Ty
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Randy / Maine .... SDA-CRS+TL & RTA15TL

Comments

  • Tony MTony M Posts: 9,016
    edited March 23
    Any of the newer Klipsch little bookies are getting rave reviews. I've heard they are smooth sounding. I think they're efficient too.

    Maybe a used set from eBay or Craig's list. B)
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
  • boston1450boston1450 Posts: 6,634
    Thanks for suggestion. I've owned many of bigger Klipsch. I know nothing of smaller ones. I have been looking on Craigslist some. I should put more effort in search. I figured I'd ask & get suggestions & then maybe later look on Ebay or speaker manufacturer. Maybe a small outdoor speaker with brackets. I had a pair of Advent outdoor speakers. Good size. That sounded pretty good for what they were.
    ...
    ...
    Randy / Maine .... SDA-CRS+TL & RTA15TL
  • Tony MTony M Posts: 9,016
    edited March 23
    I've owned a lot of Klipsch's over the years. :p
    Still own about 4 of their subs and 2 PC speaker/sub systems maybe.

    I think if you liked the Heresy's, you'd like their bookies a lot too. BUT they have the older black woofer bookies, the copper woofer reg. bookies and then the copper woofer "Reference" bookies. Prices go up as the series progresses.

    I looked on eBay a minute ago and saw just what I thought I would. Just like above.

    Now I've seen on my local Craig's list Klipsch bookies about one set a month. Mostly the copper woofer ones. That's promising if you're looking.

    I have a set of Polk 3 something... They're small but man the sound was BIG. I'm going to look for them on the web now. I don't see them for sale on Craig's list at all for years now. I'll edit in a minute.
    I was going to sell my pair I got off of Craig's list which included a Polk PSW111 sub. I was just going to sell the speakers a year back to a friend so we took them out of the box. I hadn't heard them yet. I hooked them up for the buyer and...I changed my mind the second the sound came out of one. The buyer didn't hold it against me since I told him I haven't heard them myself yet.

    Their sound of BOTH owm3's was spacious and well balanced. I could imagine the bottom being filled by the PSW111 sub would've been awesome!

    Here they are...
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polk-Audio-OWM3-WHITE-2-Way-Multi-Application-Speakers/392681576988?epid=69609386&hash=item5b6da55a1c:g:JiMAAOSweF1eQwqH
    ixtahi64q33f.png

    Maybe somebody else will comment on these little gems. They aren't to big and might not be your style. But I thought I'd toss them into the arena.

    Good luck.
    Tony
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
  • TopperDudeTopperDude Posts: 100
    My favorite small speaker factoring price is the polk s10.

    If you can stretch your budget, look into the deftech demand d7.

    Both of these will really surprise you with their performance for the size.
  • mantismantis Posts: 15,898
    edited March 23
    https://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/190070/klh-albany-bookshelf-speakers#latest

    These might fit the bill. They are in brand new condition and only have about 350 hours on them or so. Box Manual etc. Ready for a new home.
    Dan
    My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.
  • mantismantis Posts: 15,898
    The Albany's are 12-15/16 inches tall.
    Dan
    My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 25,354
    edited March 23
    Not all reviews of all of the small Klipsch are glowing :#
    Take a look, e.g., at this fresh 'review' from the site everybody loves to hate ;)
    https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/klipsch-rp-600m-speaker-review.12138/
    You can skip everything but the FR curves if you want.
    Stereophile had reviewed these at some point and found similar crossover anomalies. When chatter at ASR suggested that maybe the tweeter was miswired, John Atkinson himself of Stereophile weighed in, de-archiving his test data to show that 'synthetically' flipping the polarity of the tweeter (i.e., using his separate measurements of the woofer and tweeter) made the dip even worse.

    6ctqyliklhfm.png
    https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/klipsch-rp-600m-speaker-review.12138/page-10#post-355775

    That said, some really like the rough & ready Klipsch sound -- I am not one of those folks, though (as all y'all know).

    That said, maybe (???) you'd like to take a look at the current small Fostex 'kits'? They're easy enough to drive and sensitive enough. They sound good, too (IMO), but of course if you want substantial bass -- that ain't happenin' :/

    Madisound's website is down at the moment :(
    but here's some info from Fostex on some of their small enclosures -- which Madisound sells with drivers as 'kits' of the simplest possible kind :)
    https://www.fostexinternational.com/docs/speaker_components/P1000-BH.shtml

    https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/2-way-speaker-kits/fostex-p1000e-diy-kanspea-4-full-range-speaker-kit-pair/ (link not working at the time I am posting it)

    These are the little "Kanspea" kits -- there are two flavors; these are the larger of the two, loaded with a current version of the legendary FE-103 driver.

    18273630709_b6366d05a3_b.jpg049 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr

    I actually have a pair of their ancient progenitors, too -- Radio Shack's "SOLO-103" speakers. These are small & light enough that I could mail 'em to you (in this age of social distancing) if you want to give 'em a try. I'd just ask you to send 'em back -- someday (assuming civilization survives the next few months!)... or... you could buy 'em cheap. ;)

    ghql8d20u8ty.png
    source: http://www.radioshackcatalogs.com/html/1970/hr048.html


    Does Tekton still make small bookshelf enclosures loaded with Fostex drivers? They, and a few others, did offer such things a few years back.

    Oh, I'll also mention one occasionally finds 'ordinary' loudspeakers that work well with fleapower. Some of the 1970s (and even 1980s) ads speakers, e.g. Another really amazing small loudspeaker was the IMF SuperCompact II, but these aren't common and they're also not inexpensive. They were/are superb, though. There was also a small IMF two-way called, IIRC, the "Compact". I've never seen nor heard those, though. I imagine they're excellent.

    HTH :p
  • boston1450boston1450 Posts: 6,634
    Great info Doc. I moved out the Klipsch & using Realistic 40-2030B. Small speaker fer sure. They sound good. But tad bit too small to pump out on some songs I like. Perfect background speaker. I'm gonna keep looking around so I make the right match. They need to be easy to power. I have 2 small amps. I like the little (i think its Dayton Audio 50w amp) but i really enjoy the 2.5 wpc amp. Not a powerhouse by far. But sounds pretty darn good & it doesnt drain the solar batteries as it doesnt need many amps.... On another note. I travel & it is a camp. So if I get broke into I wont be out much
    ...
    ...
    Randy / Maine .... SDA-CRS+TL & RTA15TL
  • boston1450boston1450 Posts: 6,634
    0hmf488cldr0.jpg
    5kwoww74tart.jpg
    This Qinpu 2.5 is only like Rubics Cube size. Went on a whim & bought it cheap. Run a cd player OR Pandora thru it. Cheap set up
    ...
    ...
    Randy / Maine .... SDA-CRS+TL & RTA15TL
  • steveinazsteveinaz Posts: 19,392
    edited March 23
    Elac Debut b5.2's? I have a pair in my shop, little turds sound good!
    https://www.elac.com/series/debut-2-0/b5-2/
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amplifier: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: PSB Imagine T2
  • krazypolkkrazypolk Posts: 698
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Elac Debut b5.2's? I have a pair in my shop, little turds sound good!
    https://www.elac.com/series/debut-2-0/b5-2/

    I've seen several good reviews for these plus their price won't break the bank.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 25,354
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Elac Debut b5.2's? I have a pair in my shop, little turds sound good!
    https://www.elac.com/series/debut-2-0/b5-2/


    Not very sensitive, though :/

    Well -- OK -- let me qualify that. The ELAC Debut 2.0 B6.2 isn't very sensitive. I don't know about the 5.2, but I doubt that it's an easier load than the 6.2(???).

  • steveinazsteveinaz Posts: 19,392
    edited March 23
    Would imagine the sensitivity would be about the same.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amplifier: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: PSB Imagine T2
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,738
    KEF Q150s come to mind, But they'd probably be as big as you can get. you can get them cheaply and if you like Klipsch, you'd probably like these as well. similar to the modern ones that I've heard but much more smooth, and a little less treble energy. They are, however, only 86 DB/watt sensitive, which may not be enough. You can get them for $300 on sale fairly frequently.

    Martin Logan LX16s are more sensitive at 90 DB/watt and to my ears sound better, but they are fairly warm and smooth. I got mine for $400 but I don't know if they can be had new anymore.

    If you want really small, I have some Teacs I really like, but I'm not sure what model. The Monitor Audio Radius 90s are also excellent. The Teacs are pretty efficient, and I think the Monitors are too but I can't really remember so they may not be. Both lean to the bright side.
    signature is in the spoiler window :)
    Not Tom or Trey or Jim just Micah
    Martin Logan LX16s, NAD 1155 preamp and 4155 tuner courtesy of DaddyJT, NAD C352 playing power amp, BJC Belden cables, Technics SL3200, Marantz CD6004 CD player and Audio Technica cartridge courtesy of Drew/Clipdat, Salamander Archetype rack
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 25,354
    edited March 23
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Would imagine the sensitivity would be about the same.

    Ditto -- it's testable :)
    Let's see.

    Here're the specs for the B6.2

    q31xe7yc302a.png

    and the B5.2

    skb9rl0wqohm.png

    Note that, for both of these, the sensitivity is referenced to 2.83 VAC and the nominal impedance is 6 ohm. The sensitivity expressed in dB SPL per watt at 1 meter for these speakers would even be 1.25 dB lower than the specified value. :|

    I don't think they'd be satisfying with a 2.5 watt amplifier -- 'cept maybe on a desktop, nearfield.
    boston1450 wrote: »
    ...using Realistic 40-2030B. Small speaker fer sure.
    They sound good. But tad bit too small to pump out on some songs I like. Perfect background speaker. I'm gonna keep looking around so I make the right match....

    So, yeah -- that lets out the SOLO-103 and its myriad kin :p
    Although the Minimus 7 is pretty short on bass anyway (and not one of my personal favorite small speakers, FWIW).

    Post edited by mhardy6647 on
  • steveinazsteveinaz Posts: 19,392
    It's tough, most bookies aren't very efficient. Maybe a small Klipsch.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amplifier: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: PSB Imagine T2
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 25,354
    steveinaz wrote: »
    It's tough, most bookies aren't very efficient. Maybe a small Klipsch.

    That's what the OP suggested in the, umm... OP. :)

    The problem with that is -- then ya gotta listen to 'em ;)

  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 25,354
    Fostex FE207E made for a nice sounding, small, reasonably sensitive and easy to drive speaker in a 1 ft^3 bass reflex cabinet -- but they're no longer in production. :(

    I am sure there are modern equivalents -- but I don't know which model would qualify .Many of the better Fostex 'fullrange' drivers have T/S parameters that pretty much require horn loaded enclosures for decent bass. Some of the Fostex drivers are kind of tizzy sounding, too. The FE207E (which was shielded for A/V applications in the days of CRTs) was smoother sounding than its unshielded cousin (FE206E), IMO, and had a Qts high enough (barely) to work in a BR enclosure.

    I do know that any current FE207E equivalent would probably be considerably 'spensiver than was the FE207E (which was about 90 bucks a pop, BITD). :/

    27239921531_7ab9ef50f1_c.jpgFE207E by Mark Hardy, on Flickr
    27034745700_0be0652deb_c.jpgFE207Erear by Mark Hardy, on Flickr


  • boston1450boston1450 Posts: 6,634
    Thanks for info everyone. Great help as always. Doc, As always we enjoy the pictures :)
    ...
    ...
    Randy / Maine .... SDA-CRS+TL & RTA15TL
  • txcoastal1txcoastal1 Posts: 11,213
    2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
    Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
    Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
    Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC

    erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a
  • vcwatkinsvcwatkins Posts: 1,975
    My default small-cheap-efficient-decent-on-a-shelf speaker has been DefTech Studio Monitor 45. Used with the little 15-watt Dared MP-5 tube hybrid integrated in my small studio, I love the balanced and clean but not sterile sound. Never gets old. But I never blast these, so I don't know about high volumes with these. My son, on the other hand, surely blasted his, and he always said he enjoyed them. I paid $185 for open box four years ago. They're still easily available even though discontinued. $70-$120 on ebay.
    https://definitivetechnology.com/products/studiomonitor-45
    https://stereophile.com/content/definitive-technology-studiomonitor-45-loudspeaker

    I really enjoyed my time with the LSA-1 Statements. 88db, 13.5" tall. Under $3000 new. For $950 used, I thought they were beautifully detailed and had excellent imaging. However, they were replaced by the $50 DIY Radio Shack - Brines, hehe.
    https://underwoodhifi.com/products/lsa-group
    stereomojo.com/LSA%20ONE%20MONITOR%20SPEAKER%20REVIEW/LSAONEMONITORSPEAKERREVIEW.htm (Reference, not Statement)

    I have a pair of the little Fostex speakers @mhardy6647 mentioned. I liked them in the brief testing I did with them last year, but I haven't had a chance to get to know them. I have their big brother - Fostex BK-12m Folded Horn with 4.5" #FE126En - and liked them enough to buy the Minimee's.
    Den: Roon (Sonic Transporter) * PS Audio DirectStream Jr. * Adcom GFP-750 * Sunfire Signature II * PSAudio PP3 * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 1.2
    Study: Roon * ProJect Stream Box Ultra & Pre Box S2 * Pass ACA * PSA Dectet * DH Labs Q10 * Brines Folded ML-TQWT RS 40-1354
    Studio: Roon * LG v30 phone * Dared MP-5 * DefTech SM45
    Beach: Rega RP6 * AT33PTGII * Budgie SUT * Jolida jd9 * Roon * Sonore UltraRendu (LPS-1, WW Plat7, Iso Regen, Lush) * Schiit Yggdrasil * Joule-Electra LA-100 mkIII * Pass Aleph 30 / First Watt F5 Clone * PSA Dectet * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 2.3tl
    Beach Den: Sonore microRendu * Dayens Menuetto * Fostex BK-12m Folded Horn / KEF LS50 / Dynaudio Audience 50 / Revel M22

  • txcoastal1txcoastal1 Posts: 11,213
    @voltz ..Darrel LSAF
    Here is the after hour party group at LSAF with Darrel's Omega speakers...we had a blast with these. In the room were some of the biggest audiophiles in Texas

    0mqq09yuem0h.jpg
    aykbeaece6iy.jpg
    2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
    Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
    Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
    Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC

    erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a
  • vcwatkinsvcwatkins Posts: 1,975
    Here's a Zero Fidelity review of the Klipsch RP600m in case you haven't seen it:
    https://youtu.be/jVheKhXuRNw
    And Stereophile review:
    https://stereophile.com/content/klipsch-reference-premiere-rp-600m-loudspeaker

    Also, there's the Polk RTi A3 (compared with DefTechs in Stereophile review). Pretty efficient IIRC, but may be a bit too large. I very much enjoyed my time with those too (study rig for about a year).
    Adorama on eBay
    Den: Roon (Sonic Transporter) * PS Audio DirectStream Jr. * Adcom GFP-750 * Sunfire Signature II * PSAudio PP3 * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 1.2
    Study: Roon * ProJect Stream Box Ultra & Pre Box S2 * Pass ACA * PSA Dectet * DH Labs Q10 * Brines Folded ML-TQWT RS 40-1354
    Studio: Roon * LG v30 phone * Dared MP-5 * DefTech SM45
    Beach: Rega RP6 * AT33PTGII * Budgie SUT * Jolida jd9 * Roon * Sonore UltraRendu (LPS-1, WW Plat7, Iso Regen, Lush) * Schiit Yggdrasil * Joule-Electra LA-100 mkIII * Pass Aleph 30 / First Watt F5 Clone * PSA Dectet * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 2.3tl
    Beach Den: Sonore microRendu * Dayens Menuetto * Fostex BK-12m Folded Horn / KEF LS50 / Dynaudio Audience 50 / Revel M22

  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 25,354
    txcoastal1 wrote: »

    Those are the ones I was trying to remember! :p
    Thanks!!!
  • vcwatkinsvcwatkins Posts: 1,975
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    @voltz ..Darrel LSAF
    Here is the after hour party group at LSAF with Darrel's Omega speakers...we had a blast with these. In the room were some of the biggest audiophiles in Texas

    0mqq09yuem0h.jpg
    So that's the Omega Super 7 Monitor MK2?
    https://omegaloudspeakers.com/collections/monitor-speakers/products/super-7-monitor-speaker?variant=32164679756
    Looks interesting.
    Sensitivity: 94.5 dB at 8 ohms
    Frequency Response: 45-20kHz
    Dimensions: 15"H x 9"W x 12.5"D
    May be a bit big for @boston1450.

    The (rear ported) Super 3 might work:
    Sensitivity: 94.5 dB at 8 ohms
    Impedance: 8 ohms
    Driver: Proprietary 4.5" RS5
    Frequency Response: 55-20kHz
    Dimensions: 14"H x 7.5"W x 11"D
    Power Requirements: as little as 2 watts
    Warranty: 10 years parts and labor for workmanship defects
    $695

    The Fostex kit that @tonyp063 mentions is a bit different from mine. I got my little BR guys when they were $149 and can say without hesitation, they are worth that. But I'm guessing @tonyp063's small horns would be a better fit and still an excellent value at $262.

    Tonyp063's - https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/full-range-speaker-kits/fostex-p1000-bh-4-full-range-back-loaded-horn-kit-pair/
    vcwatkins's - https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/2-way-speaker-kits/fostex-p1000e-diy-kanspea-4-full-range-speaker-kit-pair/

    Don't expect a lot of LF. My BR box is 82Hz. The horns will be lower, I imagine; but I cannot find it listed. The FE103En 4" driver:
    9i451dq6l14j.jpg
    Den: Roon (Sonic Transporter) * PS Audio DirectStream Jr. * Adcom GFP-750 * Sunfire Signature II * PSAudio PP3 * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 1.2
    Study: Roon * ProJect Stream Box Ultra & Pre Box S2 * Pass ACA * PSA Dectet * DH Labs Q10 * Brines Folded ML-TQWT RS 40-1354
    Studio: Roon * LG v30 phone * Dared MP-5 * DefTech SM45
    Beach: Rega RP6 * AT33PTGII * Budgie SUT * Jolida jd9 * Roon * Sonore UltraRendu (LPS-1, WW Plat7, Iso Regen, Lush) * Schiit Yggdrasil * Joule-Electra LA-100 mkIII * Pass Aleph 30 / First Watt F5 Clone * PSA Dectet * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 2.3tl
    Beach Den: Sonore microRendu * Dayens Menuetto * Fostex BK-12m Folded Horn / KEF LS50 / Dynaudio Audience 50 / Revel M22

  • rooftop59rooftop59 Posts: 6,424
    I second the def tech sm45s. I use them in a largish master bedroom that opens up to a bonus room and a deck and running full range with a sub to fill in below 50hz they can rock out and fill the large space. I agree with @vcwatkins they are pretty remarkable for the $$$. When I moved from the PSB imagine B to the def techs it was a MUCH smaller move than I anticipated...
    Living Room 2.1: Dynaudio Contour 1.3mkii; Martin Logan Grotto sub; Cambridge Azur 851A; Cambridge Azur 851D; Bryston BPD-1
    Game Room HT: Denon AVR-X4200w; Definitive Technology SM350; Definitive Technology LCR2000; Definitive Technology Procinema 800; Mirage Nanasats; Sub - HSU VTF-2 MK5
    Master Bedroom
    Cambridge Azur 551r; Definitive Technology SM45; ACI Titan Subwoofer; Squeezebox Touch
  • jeremymarcinkojeremymarcinko Posts: 3,560
    I am using the Klipsch R-51M in a small 2channel setup in the family room. I really like them, they don’t dig too deep but do great for their size. They are currently paired with an Onkyo A9150 integrated and a Project Carbon TT. The integrated is only 30wpc but you wouldn’t know it with the Klipsch.

    Oh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant
  • voltzvoltz Posts: 5,423
    edited March 24
    I power my Omega's with two 9 WPC Dared 300B monoblocks and a Dared Sl2000 preamp :)

    No crossovers, pretty fast. handles most music pretty good as I didn't get any complaints at LSAF :wink:

    Louis from Omega made me a matching subwoofer for it.

    That was a great little last night party we had :p
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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