Lsi 9's sounded fantastic, but

mikejl46 · January 2016

I purchased the Lsi 9 speaker a few years back, I remember listening to them with out a subwoofer, Lsi 9's speakers set to large, they sounded good, but still needed a subwoofer. So I have always had them set to small with the subwoofer. Now recently I was playing around with the speaker settings, so I set the Lsi 9's to large, for some reason they sound better then they ever did, more bass then ever, so I was going to turn off the subwoofer to see how they sounded on their own, then I find out the subwoofer was off the whole time. These Lsi 9's sounded fantastic on their own.

So what's going on, is that what happens when they break in?

The only problem with the speakers set a s large, when I go any higher then -10 on the Pioneer SC 25 pre outs into a Carver amp, they tend to want to snap, crackle, pop. I thought for sure I fried them. I guess I was lucky.

Would I have this problem with the RTi A7 or TSx550T? I would like to have good bass with out a subwoofer, and not have to worry about blowing them to shreds if I crank it up.

Nightfall · January 2016

mikejl46 wrote: »

they tend to want to snap, crackle, pop. I thought for sure I fried them. I guess I was lucky.

Yikes. Careful man.

Many things could have contributed to the increase in bass response. Have you re positioned the speakers at all? Has the room or your seating position changed at all?

[Deleted User] · January 2016

The LSI9 bookies are fun speakers. What size is your room?

If you are more into bass then having a subwoofer is the only way to go. If you are into sound quality and all that comes with it, cranking the volume to very high levels will diminish the quality that is everything two channel.

The RTI and TSX will have a more forward sound as compared to the LSI's. So I will assume your current preference is decibels and bass... Once again, a sub is the way to go.

Halen

mikejl46 · January 2016

They really do sound great set at large without the sub, even better with the sub, but set as small with the sub they sound weak.

One song will play fine, Next song at the same volume may have a little more bass in the song, then the unexpected pop. The room is 15 x 20 with open doorways to other areas of the house. The setup has not changed any. I guess I will just have to keep the volume down. Some songs just sound great turned up a bit.

mantis · January 2016

If you think they sound weak when set to small and with a subwoofer then you are not blending the subwoofer correctly with them.
I owned them as well and small was always the way to go as it cleaned up the mid range bass performance as I strongly felt when ran in large they where very muddy sounding.

mikejl46 · January 2016

Yes, I need to work on that, getting them to blend with the subwoofer. I just can't seem to get the sound I like.

I really like the Lsi 9 alone, no sub, but they give out with some volume, Maybe just need to go with a bigger speaker.

tonyb · January 2016

mikejl46 wrote: »

Yes, I need to work on that, getting them to blend with the subwoofer. I just can't seem to get the sound I like.

I really like the Lsi 9 alone, no sub, but they give out with some volume, Maybe just need to go with a bigger speaker.

They are not meant to play loud set to large, they are not full range speakers. Turning up the volume to -10 is entering dangerous territory to do damage.

You'll need a fairly good sized full range floor standing speaker if that's the sound you like and with no subwoofer. Many are out there, but for under 2k you can find a nice used pair.

EndersShadow · January 2016

What carver amp are you using?

F1nut · January 2016

What sub are you using?

Upstatemax · January 2016

A well blended sub should sound WAY better than the 9's on their own.

Play with the crossover settings and placement of speakers and sub.

A lot of people ignore how important sub placement can be.

For better advice from the forum, we are going to need more details though...

mikejl46 · January 2016

I have tried the different crossover setting. With the Lsi 9's set as small there just seem to be something missing. I have good bass, but seems like something missing in the middle when set to small. I'm kind of stuck to placement as is.

Pioneer SC 25

Adire Audio Rava Subwoofer

Specifications:
Drivers: One 12"
Amplifier: 250 Watts
MFR: 27 Hz - 160 Hz - 3 dB
THD: < 3% at 95 dB
Dimensions: 18" H x 18" W x 18" D
Weight: 65 Pounds
http://hometheaterhifi.com/volume_9_2/adire-audio-rava-subwoofer-6-2002.html

Carver A-400X stereo amplifier

8-ohm FTC rated power/ch 200 W
4-ohm FTC rated power/ch 300 W
Bridged mono power 500 W
4/8-ohm FTC rated THD <0.01%
Input Impedance (Line) 47 kohms
Input Sensitivity 1.4V
Gain 29dB
Rated full power bandwidth 20-20kHz
S/N-IHF A-Weighted,dB >115dB
Dimensions (HxWxD inches) 4.5x19x15.7 (with handles)
http://www.carversound.com/carver-amplifiers/a-400x/

honestaquarian · January 2016

The other issue at hand is the size of your listening room. It's rather large and small speakers and/or small subs-no matter how capable they are in the bass department-are GOING TO have trouble filling such a large space. One possible solution that may help is to get a second subwoofer
Preferably identical to the one you already have.

tonyb · January 2016

mikejl46 wrote: »

I have tried the different crossover setting. With the Lsi 9's set as small there just seem to be something missing. I have good bass, but seems like something missing in the middle when set to small. I'm kind of stuck to placement as is.

/

I hear ya, I'm the same way. Small setting seems to sound too thin to my ears on any speaker. It's ok to set them to large, you just have to watch that volume. Go bigger speakers if you like that full range sound.

mikejl46 · January 2016

I guess everything sounds great with the LSI 9's set to large, even better when sub is set to plus also, but just need to stay below the -10 volume.

I can't seem to get the sub to make up for what is missing when I set the LSi 9's to small. Hard to explain, but goes from powerful to weak, setting the LSI 9's to small.

I guess I will just keep playing around, to get it to where I need it to be. Maybe get some full range speakers.

erniejade · January 2016

When I had the lsi9 full range with the sub crossover set to 40 sounded fantastic. On your receiver, can you set the speakers to large but have them low pass at 50 or 60? Then set the sub to 50 or 60. See if that helps with the thin sound

mikejl46 · January 2016

erniejade , I checked it out. With the LSI9's set to large, and sub set to Yes, I get nothing out of the sub. But if I set the sub to Plus, I do have control over the crossover setting, I'm not really sure what is going on here. It has a whole different effect on the sound then it would if the speakers were set to small and you switch through the different cross over settings. I have 50 - 200 and it seems like the LSI' 9's have trouble with the 200 setting, and that would be opposite effect if the speakers were set to small with a 200 crossover setting, I think. It seems more bass is going to the LSI 9's with the crossover set a 200. I guess I don't understand how this Plus thing works on this receiver. Hope that makes sense, what I'm trying to say here.

For me it sounds the best at 100. I will give that a try and see how that works out.

Thanks everyone for the help.

deronb1 · January 2016

You can set on large AND still use the sub ya know.

tonyb · January 2016

The "plus" setting is like a double bass setting. Normally when speakers are set to large, the sub is taken out of the equation. The Plus setting brings the sub back in when speakers are set to large.

The crossover setting....way too high at 200. Whatever number you set it at, your asking the sub to take up that choir below that number. If you set it at 200, the sub is doing everything and that high of a number is usually reserved for small satellite speakers that can't produce those frequencies.

You have a few choices, but first I'd recommend you read the manual to the receiver cover to cover.

Set them to small, crossover at 80 in the receiver. Then turn the crossover on the sub all the way up. You don't want to use both the one in the receiver and the one on the sub at the same time.

Set them to large....Plus setting, and use the crossover in the receiver.

Wire them up with speaker cable to the speaker level inputs on the sub. from the receiver to the sub, then out from the sub to the speakers. You then set them to Large, subwoofer set to no or none, and you now use the crossover on the sub set to around 70-80 for starters and see how it sounds. That gives you more control and the sub and speakers will act as one. Don't think I'd go any higher than 100 on the crossover setting either, lower if anything. Also make sure the volume on the sub is around the 12-1 o:clock position and adjust from there.

erniejade · January 2016

Your getting close. Do what Tony says and check your manual for what the crossover settings mean. If you set to 200 on the 9's, that means nothing under 200 goes to them and that is way to high. 50-100 is right depending on your room. Its funny, for HT I like my RTI12 + sub set to small but, for music, I like them set to large and crossover at 40-60 depending. So when its crossed at 60 that means nothing under 60 hz goes to the mains.

Again, where its crossed over and sounds right in your room depends on your room acoustics, speaker position, sub position.... you get the picture. Don't be afraid to experiment with it.

One of the reasons I recommend you not running your 9's at full without having a crossover is you stated you got one to pop. ( btw I have cranked the ones I had and Never got them to pop but, my 2 channel room is small) So by setting that bottom between 50-100 it takes the extra pressure off the 9's and might allow you to hit the levels you want and not robing them of the watts / current they need and play a little cleaner.

mikejl46 · January 2016

Thanks everyone, Sound really good, the LSI 9's set to large, sub set to Plus, 100 crossover, Still have to pay attention the volume, I set the receiver not to go over -10.

Still thinking about full range speakers, just because I like to buy new things, For now I'm looking t the RTiA7 or TSx 550T, My system is 100% for music.
Not sure which one would be better for music, or maybe there is something better, or maybe I already have it with the LSI'9's.

F1nut · January 2016

For music stick with the LSi9's or move to the LSiM 705's.

tonyb · January 2016

mikejl46 wrote: »

Thanks everyone, Sound really good, the LSI 9's set to large, sub set to Plus, 100 crossover, Still have to pay attention the volume, I set the receiver not to go over -10.

Still thinking about full range speakers, just because I like to buy new things, For now I'm looking t the RTiA7 or TSx 550T, My system is 100% for music.
Not sure which one would be better for music, or maybe there is something better, or maybe I already have it with the LSI'9's.

Neither of those choices would be an improvement over the LSI9's imho, plus they are not full range speakers either. Just because they are floor standers doesn't make them full range speakers.

The LSIM 705 already suggested is your best option for music from Polk without going vintage. Otherwise you'd have to start looking at other Brands.

mikejl46 · January 2016

Could you give me an example of a full range speaker from another brand, in the $800 a pair range, if there is such a thing. LSIM 705 would be way over my budget.

Thanks

tonyb · January 2016

New or used ? Even used that's going to be tough with that budget.

If you want to keep using a subwoofer in the mix, you really don't need a full range speaker. If your goal is to listen to music without a sub though, you would. Depends on your goals, and budget obviously.

These come close, and are in your budget.....

http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649247707-polk-audio-lsi15-with-vr3-fortress-mods/

The V3 mods are from a member here who does outstanding work and takes these speakers up a few notches.

mikejl46 · January 2016

I would like new. I guess what I'm looking for is something that would give me the same full sound I get with the LSI 9's set to large, I just can't get the sound I like set to small. I would also still use a sub. I want something I don't have to worry about blowing up if I crank it a little to loud.

I hope i'm not being a nuisance.

mikejl46 · January 2016

One example, One song just finished played fine, next song up, a little to much bass in the song, started popping had to hurry up and turn it down. Another song, started out slow, instruments kicked in bam, pop.

Maybe I just have a bad pair of LSI 9's.

Upstatemax · January 2016

I would start by looking at more efficient speakers...

They will get loud quicker and take less power to get there.

Once I moved from my LSi 9's to my Focal's, I noticed that I could keep the volume knob a few clicks lower.

I would check if Mantis is still selling his 807v's. A LOT of speaker for the $$.

http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/comment/2184534#Comment_2184534

jwb0007 · January 2016

tonyb wrote: »

mikejl46 wrote: »

Thanks everyone, Sound really good, the LSI 9's set to large, sub set to Plus, 100 crossover, Still have to pay attention the volume, I set the receiver not to go over -10.

Still thinking about full range speakers, just because I like to buy new things, For now I'm looking t the RTiA7 or TSx 550T, My system is 100% for music.
Not sure which one would be better for music, or maybe there is something better, or maybe I already have it with the LSI'9's.

Neither of those choices would be an improvement over the LSI9's imho, plus they are not full range speakers either. Just because they are floor standers doesn't make them full range speakers.

The LSIM 705 already suggested is your best option for music from Polk without going vintage. Otherwise you'd have to start looking at other Brands.

Tony, question, please:

What do you mean by "full-range speaker"--or not, in the case of the RTiA7? I mean, a 3-way tower, going down to about 35Hz (+/- 3db)? Wouldn't that translate to "full-range", or maybe there are additional criteria that factor in to the definition?

Thanks.

F1nut · January 2016

Full range technically would be 20Hz to 20kHz.

jwb0007 · January 2016

Thanks, F1. Guess there are not many of those around which meet that 20Hz level. Kinda makes me wonder why even have the concept/term/discussion if the reality is that 99.99%(?) of speakers fail to meet the standard (for HT sound, I presume, not music).

tonyb · January 2016

F1nut wrote: »

Full range technically would be 20Hz to 20kHz.

This....^^^

Mike,

You have the 9's turned up too loud then. The thing with better speakers is they play cleaner at higher volumes. It doesn't sound loud, but it is. You won't get that fatiguing ear piercing sound from lessor speakers played at the same level.

If you like real loud, look for a speaker that can handle loud better, like Pro speakers. You may not get the same quality of sound, but you will get loud.

800 bucks ...new, can't do it of all that I'm aware of. Running the 9's full range and turning up the volume real loud is asking them to do things they were not designed to do....hence the pops.

You can try some RTIA9's, but you'd have to go used as new would be over budget I believe. They are not as refined on the top end as the LSI's or LSIM's, but will have that full sound your looking for.

Lsi 9's sounded fantastic, but

Comments