OPINIONS SOUGHT: Ashly XR-4001 parametric crossover

TNRabbit
TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
edited June 2010 in Electronics
I'm thinking about buying an Ashly crossover that's currently on ebay; does anyone have any experience with Ashly professional products? Thanks for any USEFUL opinions~ :D

XR-4001:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200478843165&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Also looking at this XR-1001:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ASHLY-XR-1001-2-WAY-STEREO-CROSSOVER-NR-PERFECT_W0QQitemZ150450481619QQcategoryZ168303QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp4340.m8QQ_trkparmsZalgo%3DMW%26its%3DC%26itu%3DUCC%26otn%3D16%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D7988880108200380227
TNRabbit
NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
Sunfire TG-IV
Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
Carver AL-III Speakers
Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
Post edited by TNRabbit on
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Comments

  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,650
    edited June 2010
    The 1001 looks like a nice unit for a 2 way application having the desirable LR4 slopes.The TRS/XLR only connecton might be a pain,you'll need adaptors if your not already running balanced cables.
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  • HB27
    HB27 Posts: 1,518
    edited June 2010
    Hey Rabbit,
    I used one on my Altec 604 super Es for a couple of months. I didn't have dividing networks for them at the time. I still don't have the correct ones.
    The Ashley did it's job well. It did NOT match up with the 604s but I had no complaints at all with this unit.
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    HB27 wrote: »
    Hey Rabbit,
    I used one on my Altec 604 super Es for a couple of months. I didn't have dividing networks for them at the time. I still don't have the correct ones.
    The Ashley did it's job well. It did NOT match up with the 604s but I had no complaints at all with this unit.

    Thanks for that info. What exactly didn't match up?
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    FTGV wrote: »
    The 1001 looks like a nice unit for a 2 way application having the desirable LR4 slopes.The TRS/XLR only connecton might be a pain,you'll need adaptors if your not already running balanced cables.

    XLR is not a problem with my setup~ :cool:
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    I'm concerned about phase adjustment; I need to be able to delay the ribbons on my AL-IIIs--many crossovers only allow delay of the lower end (woofers). I know a few folks have gone in & reversed the internal phase adjustments wiring (simple solder job) on Rane crossovers to accomplish this...



    Also, please DISREGARD the "parametric" in the thread title; brain ****~
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • HB27
    HB27 Posts: 1,518
    edited June 2010
    TNRabbit wrote: »
    Thanks for that info. What exactly didn't match up?

    I've got a pair of 604 B models also with the correct dividing network and they sounded much nicer with the Altec network than they did with the Ashley.

    The Ashley sounded "fine" but not like the Altec. Then again, it's all a matter of what we like to hear.

    One of our fellow Polk members possesses it now and it's being used in one of our "Fostex" 168 projects with Bigger is Better cabinets. There's no clarity loss with the Ashley at all. IF there were noise problems the Fostex would show it immediately.
    What I do like with the Ashley is the versatility. It's very handy to have around. We do a lot of speaker tinkering and it does a great job saving time and keeping the "K.I.S.S." alive.
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2010
    Are those the fostex sigma BIB that I made? Been wondering what happened to them. In any case, fostex single-drivers will show any flaws fast.
    Gallo Ref 3.1 : Bryston 4b SST : Musical fidelity CD Pre : VPI HW-19
    Gallo Ref AV, Frankengallo Ref 3, LC60i : Bryston 9b SST : Meridian 565
    Jordan JX92s : MF X-T100 : Xray v8
    Backburner:Krell KAV-300i
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    HB27: Do you know what, if any, phase adjustment is possible for the high end?
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    Pics show no phase adjustment:

    xr1001-f.jpg

    xr1001-b.jpg
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2010
    What are your plans for this? I haven't used that exact one, but I have used some analog crossovers with a number fixed crossover points. I've found that unless your drivers happen to work out where the fixed crossover points happen to fall and really match the slope available, you're better off using something like the DCX2496. Some stuff gets lost in the analog to digital to analog, but the ease of use and additional phase, boost, slope and other options more than make up for it.
    Gallo Ref 3.1 : Bryston 4b SST : Musical fidelity CD Pre : VPI HW-19
    Gallo Ref AV, Frankengallo Ref 3, LC60i : Bryston 9b SST : Meridian 565
    Jordan JX92s : MF X-T100 : Xray v8
    Backburner:Krell KAV-300i
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,650
    edited June 2010
    TNRabbit wrote: »
    HB27: Do you know what, if any, phase adjustment is possible for the high end?
    Do you need pure time delay or 180 deg.phase reversal?They are different things and it doesn't appear the Ashly gives you control of either.Not sure why you require it but time delay can be accomplished with physical offset and phase reversal can be done at the speaker or amplifer binding posts.
    unc2701 wrote: »
    I've found that unless your drivers happen to work out where the fixed crossover points happen to fall and really match the slope available, you're better off using something like the DCX2496.
    True the drivers would need an approximate one octave of overlap for the filters to sum correctly.The Ashly has variable xover frequency.Aswell it has a damping control(labeled response) that will give some adjustability of the response at the xover point, but for accurate results frequency response measurements would be necessary.
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    unc2701 wrote: »
    What are your plans for this? I haven't used that exact one, but I have used some analog crossovers with a number fixed crossover points. I've found that unless your drivers happen to work out where the fixed crossover points happen to fall and really match the slope available, you're better off using something like the DCX2496. Some stuff gets lost in the analog to digital to analog, but the ease of use and additional phase, boost, slope and other options more than make up for it.

    But this has variably adjustable slope AND crossover points....??

    I'm going to actively bi-amp a pair of Carver AL-III speakers. Crossover point will be 200 hz (woofer to ribbon).
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    FTGV wrote: »
    Do you need pure time delay or 180 deg.phase reversal?They are different things and it doesn't appear the Ashly gives you control of either.Not sure why you require it but time delay can be accomplished with physical offset and phase reversal can be done at the speaker or amplifer binding posts.

    True the drivers would need an approximate one octave of overlap for the filters to sum correctly.The Ashly has variable xover frequency.Aswell it has a damping control(labeled response) that will give some adjustability of the response at the xover point, but for accurate results frequency response measurements would be necessary.

    I'm going to be actively biamping a pair of Carver AL-III speakers with down-firing woofer (ported), so I want to ensure whatever phase alignment built into the passive crossover doesn't get lost in this active application.

    Thanks for the comments, guys~
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2010
    TNRabbit wrote: »
    But this has variably adjustable slope AND crossover points....??

    I'm going to actively bi-amp a pair of Carver AL-III speakers. Crossover point will be 200 hz (woofer to ribbon).

    Sorry- you said that above & I missed it. Ok, are you planning on pulling out the existing passive crossover?

    Here's the issue: when you have both a passive and active crossover in place with an identical crossover point, the signal gets "double filtered" around that crossover point and you can get hole in your frequency response. So if you leave the existing crossover, you can still get some benefit from active biamping, but you need to extend the point a bit beyond the crossover point on each side to keep the double filtering from happening. The SRS1.2 manual actually discusses this; see:
    http://www.polksda.com/pdfs/SRSAddendum.pdf
    That Ashly does not allow you to have the wide overlap necessary for something like this.

    Now, if you bypass the existing passive crossover, you're correct; you can probably dial that active crossover in to replicate the passive one fairly closely- assuming that the crossover is ONLY a crossover. There could be impedance stabilization in there, baffle correction, things to iron out response that are very specific to the drivers in question. So when you yank the passive crossover, you may lose something that the original designer put in there and you won't be able to get back with a simple active crossover.
    Gallo Ref 3.1 : Bryston 4b SST : Musical fidelity CD Pre : VPI HW-19
    Gallo Ref AV, Frankengallo Ref 3, LC60i : Bryston 9b SST : Meridian 565
    Jordan JX92s : MF X-T100 : Xray v8
    Backburner:Krell KAV-300i
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    I have no intentions of leaving the passive crossovers; that's why I'm going active. There is a HUGE power-sucking passive crossover. I'm planning to run sweeps & use a spectrum analyzer tool to flatten the response. I'm planning on a good parametric equalizer in the mix as well.

    Well, I bid prematurely so I'm now the proud owner of that crossover. The Rane AC-22S would have been my preference. In fact, one sold on ebay a while back for $5.00!! It makes me sick to my stomach~

    So, I'll try to do what I can with the Ashly, and if it's not sufficient I'm going to hunt down an AC-22.

    Thanks to all for your comments & suggestions!
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2010
    Makes sense- I'd just do one speaker, and perform the sweep on each (swapping the speakers to be in the same spot in the room) and compare. You want to be sure that you're measuring the speaker and not the room.

    I still think that the DCX2496 would do more of what you're looking to accomplish, but half the fun is playing around with gear to see what you can accomplish :D
    Gallo Ref 3.1 : Bryston 4b SST : Musical fidelity CD Pre : VPI HW-19
    Gallo Ref AV, Frankengallo Ref 3, LC60i : Bryston 9b SST : Meridian 565
    Jordan JX92s : MF X-T100 : Xray v8
    Backburner:Krell KAV-300i
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    I've never found Behringer stuff to be made all that well, but that one does have a lot of options for the $$$.
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2010
    TNRabbit wrote: »
    I've never found Behringer stuff to be made all that well, but that one does have a lot of options for the $$$.

    Oh, absolutely. It's held together with toothpaste and scotch tape, and the pro guys that I know always carry a spare, but for home use it's pretty killer for the cost. Just don't drop it more than 6". Or put it in a hot rack. Or yank on any cords plugged into it.

    If you want to go up the price range a little the DBX DriveRack units are a lot more solid, but the ones I played with actually had a few _less_ options than the Behringer- this may have changed with the newer models.
    Gallo Ref 3.1 : Bryston 4b SST : Musical fidelity CD Pre : VPI HW-19
    Gallo Ref AV, Frankengallo Ref 3, LC60i : Bryston 9b SST : Meridian 565
    Jordan JX92s : MF X-T100 : Xray v8
    Backburner:Krell KAV-300i
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • HB27
    HB27 Posts: 1,518
    edited June 2010
    unc2701 wrote: »
    Are those the fostex sigma BIB that I made? Been wondering what happened to them. In any case, fostex single-drivers will show any flaws fast.

    I bought the 168 Fostex off Craigslist and my buddy decided to build the very simple "BIB" cabinets for them.

    He's no carpenter and the leaking joints on the homemade BiB cabinets killed the bass response.

    The Fostex is full of potential. Unfortunately we haven't been able to get it to reach that potential.
    We're getting closer but still lacking in bass. IMHO part of the issue is the leaking cabs.
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  • HB27
    HB27 Posts: 1,518
    edited June 2010
    TNRabbit wrote: »
    HB27: Do you know what, if any, phase adjustment is possible for the high end?

    I just called my buddy on the Ashley about the phasing. I didn't remember it having any but honestly I'm not that good at these crossover systems.
    He thought it had a small white button to reverse the phase where necessary but couldn't find it when he looked.
    He did notice on the DBX234 that it does have the phase button. We used it also along with Rane and Behringer. I don't like Behringer but it did the job well with just a little white noise noticable at idle.
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited June 2010
    Why not just upgrade the original passive components?
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    Face wrote: »
    Why not just upgrade the original passive components?

    They are power hogs. Active bi-amping frees up a TON of headroom, & is easier on the amp.
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2010
    HB27 wrote: »
    I bought the 168 Fostex off Craigslist and my buddy decided to build the very simple "BIB" cabinets for them.

    He's no carpenter and the leaking joints on the homemade BiB cabinets killed the bass response.

    The Fostex is full of potential. Unfortunately we haven't been able to get it to reach that potential.
    We're getting closer but still lacking in bass. IMHO part of the issue is the leaking cabs.

    Appologies for the derail: coat them on truckbedliner... Worked for me. My issue was that I had 'em in a room with high ceilings that sucked the bass out of the top. Once you get the leaks under control, try putting a piece of plywood at the top angled to bounce the bass back to the listening position.
    Gallo Ref 3.1 : Bryston 4b SST : Musical fidelity CD Pre : VPI HW-19
    Gallo Ref AV, Frankengallo Ref 3, LC60i : Bryston 9b SST : Meridian 565
    Jordan JX92s : MF X-T100 : Xray v8
    Backburner:Krell KAV-300i
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    HB27 wrote: »
    I just called my buddy on the Ashley about the phasing. I didn't remember it having any but honestly I'm not that good at these crossover systems.
    He thought it had a small white button to reverse the phase where necessary but couldn't find it when he looked.
    He did notice on the DBX234 that it does have the phase button. We used it also along with Rane and Behringer. I don't like Behringer but it did the job well with just a little white noise noticable at idle.

    I'm interested in a continuously adjustable phase control; probably will require something like 90 degrees-ish adjustment to get it completely right. I may end up selling this for a Rane if I can't get it to work properly...

    We'll see in 7-10 business days!
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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  • HB27
    HB27 Posts: 1,518
    edited June 2010
    TNRabbit wrote: »
    I'm interested in a continuously adjustable phase control; probably will require something like 90 degrees-ish adjustment to get it completely right. I may end up selling this for a Rane if I can't get it to work properly...

    We'll see in 7-10 business days!

    It's nice having a selection of crossovers to play with. When I see one at a garage sale, auction, or corporate sell off I grab all the gear I can find. I build a lot of speakers, buy every "different" hig end speaker or driver I can find just to play with or learn about the different personalities of them.
    You can't have enough options laying around for this stuff.
    I think you'll like the Ashley. It's a clear crossover with a lot of adjustments on it.
    With the Fostex 168 project we're playing with additional Fostex 6" woofers in the Bigger is Better cabinets.
    The 168 jumps around a lot in the cabinets IF the signal is not perfectly clean.
    Right now we're driving them with the Denon POA 1500. They'd shoot in and out close to a half inch at idle without shielded IC and wires. We changed out to good wires and ICs and they're barely moving even playing hard now. The Ashley didn't affect travel in the Fostex and that alone showed me how clean they are in the signal path.
    Phasing I don't know about. Low hz adjustments are plentiful and should hit your target mark.
    Keep us in the loop on your findings. I always like to throw a little knowledge in the books.
    My buddy is a new Polk Member and I'm sure would be glad to help out. We've also got Rane, Altec, Crown, xovers we'll be using in the mix eventually. Like I stated before, I'm not that experienced with this type xover but learning more each time something new is tried.
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  • TNRabbit
    TNRabbit Posts: 2,168
    edited June 2010
    Started a new thread on bi-amping:

    http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1368088#post1368088
    TNRabbit
    NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
    Sunfire TG-IV
    Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
    Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
    Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
    Carver AL-III Speakers
    Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer
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