5.1 or bad*ss 2 channel?

rcrook317 · January 2010

curious to everyones opinion on which way to go w/ my stereo.
i have about 7-800 to spend and was pretty much set on buying 200+watt 2 channel amp,ive narrowed it down to either adcom 5802(used) or a new xpa-2

That was until i borrowed a kenwood m2a basic amp(220x28ohm).
I can get this amp for 150,while this amp truly rocks my rti12s.My main concern is that it is 25 yrs old and could **** on me anyday,but on the other hand it does sound great and by saving the extra money i could get 2 cherry monitor 70s and finally have 5.1 setup.

So if you were me what would you do?
of course everyone feels different about ht/2ch but i respect your guys opinion and am curious

Knucklehead · January 2010

Im not a critical listener to music, my 5.1 does well enough for me for music. One of these days Im going to hook up with one of these guys that has a "true" 2 channel system to see what Im missing.

rcrook317 · January 2010

xcapri79 wrote: »

I don't see why you can't have both for reasonable money. That's what led be to getting the Pioneer SC-07 as my pre-pro and adding pair of XPA-5's for my amps. I essentially split the system into left side and right side halves with more than enough channels for a 7 channel system.
For 2 channel use, I power my front LSi25's each with a separate XPA-5 amp and they sound sweet.

well the adcom is 500+ while the xpa-2(il wait for their sale) is 700+
for 550 i can get rear speakers(monitor 70s) plus keep this kenwood.just need to decide,im on the fence on this 1.
but for what youre saying to get both id have to spend 12-1300 which isnt possible rite now

concealer404 · January 2010

2-channel. Get the Adcom.

Serendipity · January 2010

2 Channel, although I run both.

Hawkeye · January 2010

One has to make up their mind if they want a 2 or 5 channel rig. If you have the room, do both but concentrate on the one that gives you the most enjoyment. I gave up several years ago trying to have one system pull double duty.

Gordon

Conradicles · January 2010

Keep the Kenwood and get the Monitor 70's. Then in the future upgrade the center if you so wish.
Nice system by the way. The RTi12's are some big bad speakers!

cfrizz · January 2010

Hawkeye wrote: »

One has to make up their mind if they want a 2 or 5 channel rig. If you have the room, do both but concentrate on the one that gives you the most enjoyment. I gave up several years ago trying to have one system pull double duty.

Gordon

No, one does not have to make up their mind between 2 or 5-7 channel rigs. If you buy solid gear, you can enjoy BOTH on ONE system.

In your case Rcrook, finish getting your speakers first & enjoy the full effects. Continue to save money, & watch Audiogon for a 5 channel amp or wait for Emotiva to put a sale on an XPA-5.

Hawkeye · January 2010

cfrizz wrote: »

No, one does not have to make up their mind between 2 or 5-7 channel rigs. If you buy solid gear, you can enjoy BOTH on ONE system.

In your case Rcrook, finish getting your speakers first & enjoy the full effects. Continue to save money, & watch Audiogon for a 5 channel amp or wait for Emotiva to put a sale on an XPA-5.

Can we agree to disagree?:D

Gordon

concealer404 · January 2010

Because an AVR is not up to the task of doing 2-channel duty as well as a dedicated 2-channel preamp/integrated.

For the simple matter that it wasn't designed FOR that.

You wouldn't try to use a 2-channel preamp in a surround sound HT setup, would you?

Keep an open mind that your definition of "working well" is probably vastly different from some other people. Myself included.

pearsall001 · January 2010

concealer404 wrote: »

Because an AVR is not up to the task of doing 2-channel duty as well as a dedicated 2-channel preamp/integrated.

For the simple matter that it wasn't designed FOR that.

You wouldn't try to use a 2-channel preamp in a surround sound HT setup, would you?

Keep an open mind that your definition of "working well" is probably vastly different from some other people. Myself included.

Who died & left you audio boss???? Pretty bold statement there regarding an AVR pulling double duty. A combo system can be very satisfying for both venues. I think a lot has to do with the actual room...mine is exceptional for pulling this off.

But I do acknowledge that some folks just like to keep them separated...nothing wrong with that either.

Face · January 2010

Having tried multi-channel processors from Onkyo to McIntosh, I keep going back to 2 channel for music.

Hawkeye · January 2010

It comes down to a matter of priorities to me. I enjoy a movie once or twice a week while the 2 channel rig is on 5-6 hours per day. An AVR or HT prepro is tasked with doing multiple tasks, some better than others. There is something that is not going to be up to speed, either HT or 2 channel. There is going to be a compromise which I'm not prepared to make.

Cost. If a speaker budget is say $500, split among 5 speakers does not leave room for an accurate piece. Now buy a pair of $500 mains, and your accuracy goes up tremendously. This applies not only to speakers but amps and wires.

I tried the all in one system and felt it lacking in both ends. That is not to say it sounded bad, but there was that "something" missing. Buying a strictly 2 channel rig with pieces that were made to do just 2 channel was what I was looking for. I'm fortunate enough to be able to do both, but it has been a 25 year journey. I've been in a 1 million dollar HT. It was fabulous for HT, but I thought the 2 channel presentation was not at the same level.

If one thinks their all in one system is working well, good for them. I'll never talk it down. But a well designed and planned 2 channel rig will far exceed the performance of it in most cases.

Gordon

pearsall001 · January 2010

Face wrote: »

Having tried multi-channel processors from Onkyo to McIntosh, I keep going back to 2 channel for music.

I've done it both ways myself. I doubt that I'll go back to a separate pre.

pearsall001 · January 2010

Hawkeye wrote: »

It comes down to a matter of priorities to me. I enjoy a movie once or twice a week while the 2 channel rig is on 5-6 hours per day. An AVR or HT prepro is tasked with doing multiple tasks, some better than others. There is something that is not going to be up to speed, either HT or 2 channel. There is going to be a compromise which I'm not prepared to make.

Cost. If a speaker budget is say $500, split among 5 speakers does not leave room for an accurate piece. Now buy a pair of $500 mains, and your accuracy goes up tremendously. This applies not only to speakers but amps and wires.

I tried the all in one system and felt it lacking in both ends. That is not to say it sounded bad, but there was that "something" missing. Buying a strictly 2 channel rig with pieces that were made to do just 2 channel was what I was looking for. I'm fortunate enough to be able to do both, but it has been a 25 year journey. I've been in a 1 million dollar HT. It was fabulous for HT, but I thought the 2 channel presentation was not at the same level.

If one thinks their all in one system is working well, good for them. I'll never talk it down. But a well designed and planned 2 channel rig will far exceed the performance of it in most cases.

Gordon

I think a lot hinges on the quality of one's mains...the center & surrounds are out of the picture when it comes to 2 channel. But like all things audio...proceed with caution & do what best suits one's needs & pleasure level.

Hawkeye · January 2010

Phil, I'm sure your gear sounds wonderful! My intent was not to disparage anyone's method. I was not successful blending the two, you are, and on reflection, a tip of the hat to you.

Just putting in my 2 cents worth and personal opinion, right or wrong. There are very few things in this hobby that are right or wrong. No offense intended to anyone.

Gordon

megasat16 · January 2010

It's not wrong to have both badA$$ HT system and bad$$ 2 channel system.

I could watch and listen to DVD-A and multi-channel SACD in my HT system. I didn't make a lot of compromises on the HT gears and I have carefully matched all gears for HT. But when I listen to CDs, I prefer to listen to dedicated stereo setup.

pearsall001 · January 2010

Hawkeye wrote: »

Phil, I'm sure your gear sounds wonderful! My intent was not to disparage anyone's method. I was not successful blending the two, you are, and on reflection, a tip of the hat to you.

Just putting in my 2 cents worth and personal opinion, right or wrong. There are very few things in this hobby that are right or wrong. No offense intended to anyone.

Gordon

Gordon, never any offense taken. Your posts are always well written & you always offer great advice & insight. I admire your dedication that you've put into achieving your goal. You found that magic elixir that puts a smile on your face when you listen to your system. That's always the end game...we all strive to achieve the same result, we just get there in different ways.

I still can't believe you're thinking of letting the 501's go & moving up to the 1.2K's...you could launch the space shuttle with those things!!!

Phil

Hawkeye · January 2010

Phil there is only one reason why I'll go with the 1.2k's. Do I need them today, no. But, I'm going to retire in five years and won't be able to afford them then. Thinking of the future, my 401 tanked and I can only afford to buy them now and not on my retirement. At least I'll be prepared for any speaker I may want to get at that time.

Getting old sucks, but the toys sure get nicer!

Gordon

PS: Are you near Tom's River or Lakehurst Naval Air Station?

tonyb · January 2010

Have to agree with Phil, no reason you can't get quality sound from a dual purpose system. I ditched the seperate 2 channel stuff along time ago when kids came into the picture. Now that the kids are gone,I still see no reason to have 2 seperate systems. Would a seperate 2 channel sound better ? Maybe, but given the amount I would have to invest to surpass the other system, I would say not worth it. Some may disagree with that and thats OK, comes down to how much are you willing to spend for x amount of improvment to SQ. I would have to invest something equal to a new compact car, can't see it.

mmadden28 · January 2010

xcapri79 wrote: »

Did you know that you can get an Adcom GFA-5500 2 channel amp new at K-Mart on-line?

http://www.kmart.com/shc/s/p_10151_10104_25000000GFA-5500P?vName=Computers+%26+Electronics&keyword=adcom

Now it isn't exactly the same as the Adcom 5802, but it is worth considering especially since you can get special financing on it too.

Good luck with that.
I've tried about 6 times since November, and every one of my orders keeps getting canceled. They get canceled because they are out of stock. Yet every time I turn around the web site say's they're in stock. Haven't they ever heard of a BackOrder?
Not only that but their cancellation notice doesn't provide any indication as why it was canceled, just that it was. You have to call CS and talk to 3 people just to get their opinion on why it was canceled.
Dealing with KMart/Sears CS is enough to pull your hair out.
That's about all I have to say about it right now as I'm just getting myself pissed off again.

Also note, although its no different from buying used, apparently Kmart/Sears are not authorized dealers for Adcom, and so they come with no warranty. I got that right from Adcom.

If you buy a used Adcom (or any used amp for that matter), just keep in mind if its a really old amp it might need recapping.

concealer404 · January 2010

pearsall001 wrote: »

Who died & left you audio boss???? Pretty bold statement there regarding an AVR pulling double duty. A combo system can be very satisfying for both venues. I think a lot has to do with the actual room...mine is exceptional for pulling this off.

But I do acknowledge that some folks just like to keep them separated...nothing wrong with that either.

Whoa whoa... it wasn't meant as an official decree or anything.

Audio forum, opinions, etc etc etc. All i'm saying is that after building a dedicated 2-channel setup, i would never be satisfied with listening to stereo music through an AVR. Me personally. I guess i could have elaborated a bit.

If other people are happy with it, far be it from me to put them down for it.

BTW, my post was a reply to X, not really to anyone else.

devani · January 2010

tonyb wrote: »

Have to agree with Phil, no reason you can't get quality sound from a dual purpose system. I ditched the seperate 2 channel stuff along time ago when kids came into the picture. Now that the kids are gone,I still see no reason to have 2 seperate systems. Would a seperate 2 channel sound better ? Maybe, but given the amount I would have to invest to surpass the other system, I would say not worth it. Some may disagree with that and thats OK, comes down to how much are you willing to spend for x amount of improvment to SQ. I would have to invest something equal to a new compact car, can't see it.

kids come, priority changes but you certainly can enjoy HT and 2ch from dual purpose system...

rcrook317 · January 2010

Conradicles wrote: »

Nice system by the way. The RTi12's are some big bad speakers!

rite on!they sound and look great.
i appreciate everyones responses,but it seems this thread has turned into a debate instead of offering advice on which direction to go...

concealer404 · January 2010

rcrook317 wrote: »

rite on!they sound and look great.
i appreciate everyones responses,but it seems this thread has turned into a debate instead of offering advice on which direction to go...

My advice if you were to concentrate on HT would be to get speakers in the same line as your RTi12s instead of the M70s.

If you enjoy HT more, then go with the HT route, there's nothing wrong with that.

That Kenwood is a decent, adequate amp. Nothing crazy, but not terrible either. If you like it, then use it. I had a Basic M1 for a short while, and i was impressed with what it offered for the low price.

rcrook317 · January 2010

well heres the deal.....i listen to music almost daily but can only truly crank it when wife/son are out of the house.
that being said i just got netflix setup thru the ps3 and wife and i plan on watching alot of movies.the kenwood does do a good job,i just know a bigger,newer amp would make those rti12s shine!plus its as old as me so im worried it could die on me w/ no where to get service for it.

also,concealer....what speaks would be a good match for rti12s?

concealer404 · January 2010

rcrook317 wrote: »

well heres the deal.....i listen to music almost daily but can only truly crank it when wife/son are out of the house.
that being said i just got netflix setup thru the ps3 and wife and i plan on watching alot of movies.the kenwood does do a good job,i just know a bigger,newer amp would make those rti12s shine!plus its as old as me so im worried it could die on me w/ no where to get service for it.

also,concealer....what speaks would be a good match for rti12s?

RTi8s. A bit bigger than i'm accustomed to running as surrounds, but you've got some big **** as your mains, so i'd say if you can, go for it.

On the Kenwood... meh. It's cheap. If it dies, buy something else. Or if you're really worried about it, then shell out for something newer. If it means anything to you, i don't think i've had an amp newer than 20 years old in a long time, and i haven't had any problems.

If you're not a weirdo axe murderer or anything

, you're more than welcome to take the short drive to my place and see if the 2-channel bug bites you. It's definitely not the last word in 2-channel fidelity or anything, but it sounds far better playing music than any HT setup i've ever had. (Which may not be saying much, but you get what i mean.)

rcrook317 · January 2010

thanks for the offer concealer.....yeah the kenwood looks like its from back to the future if ya know what i mean....lol!i really want to gget that xpa-2 but im leaning towards getting rear speakers and just buying this kenwood for the mean time.maybe get the xpa-5 when i get cash saved up.
i dont know.....but i am building a awesome audio rack rite now(google flexi audio rack)and a new amp would look sweet in it!

concealer404 · January 2010

rcrook317 wrote: »

thanks for the offer concealer.....yeah the kenwood looks like its from back to the future if ya know what i mean....lol!i really want to gget that xpa-2 but im leaning towards getting rear speakers and just buying this kenwood for the mean time.maybe get the xpa-5 when i get cash saved up.
i dont know.....but i am building a awesome audio rack rite now(google flexi audio rack)and a new amp would look sweet in it!

If you want to complete your HT, then just get the Kenwood and get the rear speakers. If you want me to be blatantly honest, i'd probably rather have the Kenwood than the XPA-2, anyways.

I had an XPA-2, i was hoping to replace my Onkyo M-5150 with it. If you notice my signature, i still have my M-5150.

But seriously, PM me if you want to take a listen. I can't guarantee that my speakers are on the same level as your RTi12s or anything, they're just baby 2-way towers, but it'll be pretty apparently pretty quick if you'll be hooked on 2-channel or not. I personally prefer 2-channel, it's more involving. For my HT setups, i just look for 3 things:

1) Can i hear the dialogue?
2) Do i have a metric buttload of impact?
3) Can i hear crap behind me?

If all three of those things are present, i consider the venture a success.

rcrook317 · January 2010

yea everyone has their own opinion,but ive read too many great things about the xpa-2,id be hard pressed to think a 250-300 watt amp wont blow me away but if im not happy w/ it i can return it........probably will go w/ rear speakers and upgrade the amp down the road.
since my home is not big enough for 2 separate rigs and i couldnt afford it any way,my living room is gonna pull double duty

also do you think the monitor series will be that big of an audible difference w/ the rti series?
the rti8s are hard to find in cherry

concealer404 · January 2010

Well, if you're just looking at the power, look at it the other way... is that extra 30wpc worth the $450+ price increase?

But yeah, definitely, get YOUR ears on it to make your own decision. If you like it, then that's great.

Double duty, a lot of us live with it. Maybe get the rears now, and the Kenwood, then grab a 2-channel preamp later with HT bypass, so you can truly do both at once without have two full sets of gear.

5.1 or bad*ss 2 channel?

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