1C's finally setup right, now for more questions

dpowell

Last night my brother helped me move some furniture around and get my 1C's set up much more appropriately than they were before. Due to length limitation of speaker cables on hand and electrical outlet locations, I am able to have them setup as follows:

4 feet from the side walls
1 foot out from the back wall
8 feet 9 inches apart inside measurement.

Ultimately, I will obtain longer speaker cables and have them setup 3 feet from the side walls which will put the distance apart at 10 feet, 9 inches.

My brother and I spent about 2 hours in awe last night at how these sound. Not everything sounds great on them but overall I can't believe what I'm hearing. The vocals are simply unbelievable and the SDA effect is really cool on a lot of tracks. There were several times we had 'what the heck was that?!' moments where instruments or sounds would appear coming from unexpected places.

One thing that bugged me was the bass response on some tracks. I know these can put out good deep bass because I've heard it but I'm thinking that a lot has to do with the final studio mix. My rig is as follows:

Denon 3910 using dedicated 2-channel out
B&K Reference 10 in dedicated stereo mode, no processing, no EQ (not even available)
Anthem Amp1

In this setup, I have no way of adjusting EQ to bring the bass up on tracks that lack it. I am curious as to what other forum members have done to fill in the bass gaps? Does this call for a pre with EQ controls, a sepatarate EQ box or adding a sub?

Pycroft

Hi there...

I'm further behind than you are. I have my 1C's setup for about 2 days now. I also noticed that on some tracks, the bass is amazing with just the speakers, and sometimes it's lacking. I figured it was due to the mixing fo the CD. Not sure if anyone else will have comments on the bass of the 1C's. I also have not put much into the setup...maybe that will improve also.

james

concealer404

If they're on carpet, spike those bad boys.

NJPOLKER

I'd move them to about 6-7" from back wall. Playing with positioning is generally always a good idea. Spikes are a no brainer, not that mine are spiked, yet, but they are in the mail. Buy yourself an Anthem PRE1 or 2L and a set of four NOS tubes.

dpowell

A tubed pre is definitely on the list. Where's the best place to buy spikes for the 1C's?

EDIT: found this thread: http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=93276

heiney9

If the bass is not in the recording, you're not going to hear it. I don't use any type of tone control. It is what it is................the recordings I listen to are pure and some have great bass and some don't.

Personally, I leave the recording as it is.

YMMV

H9

heiney9

Pycroft wrote: »

Hi there...

I'm further behind than you are. I have my 1C's setup for about 2 days now. I also noticed that on some tracks, the bass is amazing with just the speakers, and sometimes it's lacking. I figured it was due to the mixing fo the CD. Not sure if anyone else will have comments on the bass of the 1C's. I also have not put much into the setup...maybe that will improve also.

james

Yes, everyhting is dependent on the source. If sometimes you get really good bass and other times not, as long as you haven't moved them around, then it's all recording dependent.

H9

dpowell

heiney9 wrote: »

If the bass is not in the recording, you're not going to hear it. I don't use any type of tone control. It is what it is................the recordings I listen to are pure and some have great bass and some don't.

Personally, I leave the recording as it is.

YMMV

H9

The reason I ask about adding the sub (hopefully that is not SDA irreverance) is that if I play the same track on my HT setup I can hear bass on the recording. Of course I don't expect the 1C's to move enough air to make my pant legs flap around like the SVS will but it doesn't seem right that it should nearly disappear as it seems to in some cases.

heiney9

The bass you are hearing is most likely being emphasized and not naturally present on the recording. HT's have a tendency to exaggerate certain freq as well as many HT subs and it's usually by having a peak in bass response.

The 1C's dig really deep when set up properly and when the source material has the signal present. I notice it all the time in my rig.

comfortablycurt

You need to play around with placement some more from the sounds of it. SDA's are REAL picky with placement. It's taken me a long time to get my 2A's placed where I want them.

Moving them a little closer to the sidewalls will help some, as well as moving them back a little more.

Fongolio

I originally had my 1C's about a foot out from the wall but when I moved them to about 6" the bass really came alive. Because these are sealed (not ported) cabinets they can be closer to the back wall without excessive boomy bass. Experiment until you find the true sweet spot.

Also, the 1C's can handle a lot of power. A nice clean 200 watt plus solid state amp or a high quality tube amp (not as much power needed with tubes to achieve excellent results). The bass really comes alive with good power.

I personally use a pre with bass and treble control (Carver C-1). Which I will adjust a little from time to time. My room is not ideal and could desperatley use treatments. In the meantime I have tone control (commence flaming now). Many here object to the use of any equalization after source but I find with a less than ideal room and no treatments it helps to fiddle a little.

Have fun.

heiney9

http://www.polksda.com/sda1creview.shtml

As you can see the 1C's can dig deep and the bass is very linear and the distortion is extremely low. So first it's placment; second it's your components; third it depends on the recording (source).

Ron Temple

heiney9 wrote: »

If the bass is not in the recording, you're not going to hear it. I don't use any type of tone control. It is what it is................the recordings I listen to are pure and some have great bass and some don't.

Personally, I leave the recording as it is.

YMMV

H9

Dat's the way it is. If it's there, it's really there. If it's not, there's not much you can do except boost the bass on the pre which sometimes unbalances the presentation. I've got some recordings that even with a sub in play, just don't dig.

dpowell

I have a piece of granite from a sink cutout that, if cut in two would make great platforms for the speakers. How would placing them on a 1" thick piece of granite compare to spikes?

dbnh

dpowell wrote: »

I have a piece of granite from a sink cutout that, if cut in two would make great platforms for the speakers. How would placing them on a 1" thick piece of granite compare to spikes?

I answered in a related post with photo that granite worked better for me, with my gear in my room, to my and other ears.

Also, I remember reading in other posts on this topic that some persons preferred granite, some didn't. Why not listen to each and see what you like best?

EDIT: FYI - I have the studio version, and removed the MDF bottom piece prior to putting the speakers on granite.

dpowell

dbnh wrote: »

I answered in a related post with photo that granite worked better for me, with my gear in my room, to my and other ears.

Also, I remember reading in other posts on this topic that some persons preferred granite, some didn't. Why not listen to each and see what you like best?

EDIT: FYI - I have the studio version, and removed the MDF bottom piece prior to putting the speakers on granite.

Thanks, I'll give granite a try before spending the $90 for spikes. Did you remove the MDF bottoms for aesthetic or audio reasons?

heiney9

I have my 1C's sitting on 1/2" ceramic floor tiles. It certainly helped. I was too lazy to go thru the process for installing spikes.

H9

treitz3

What kind of tubes are you running in the Anthem? I ask because I basically had the same setup as you and I had no issues with the bass......unless it was recording dependent. The biggest change in bass came when I futzed around with placement. You'll know when you have found "the" spot.

dpowell

I currently have Mullard EL34's in the Anthem. I'm getting some sweet bass out of them on certain recordings. Sounds like placement is the easiest and cheapest way to start working on resolving the issue. I'm going to try moving them to about 8" off the back wall and placing them on the granite as my first two steps to see what that does.

treitz3

Can you have someone move the speakers whilst you are in the sweet spot? Play a track with a good recording of bass and find where the speakers make the frequencies shine the best [but not over accentuate]. Then try that for a while on different recordings and see how you like it then.

heiney9

dpowell wrote: »

I currently have Mullard EL34's in the Anthem. I'm getting some sweet bass out of them on certain recordings. Sounds like placement is the easiest and cheapest way to start working on resolving the issue. I'm going to try moving them to about 8" off the back wall and placing them on the granite as my first two steps to see what that does.

A difference of 2-4" off the back wall can make a difference. For my room, which is rectangular and the wall opposite the speakers is open on both ends, I've found 10" from the back wall to be the best.

Experiment in 2" increments and I use a tape measure in several spots to make sure.

H9

dpowell

Will do. I'm using a tape measure to get as close to the perfect equilateral triangle as possible. My room is perfectly square. It is a converted garage and I'm using the insulated garage door wall as the wall the speakers are facing away from. The two side walls are insulated and 5/8 drywall on them. The ceiling is also fully insulated and drywalled. I'm guessing based on what some have posted that the ultra plush pad and carpet are sucking the life out of some of the bass.

rlmacklin

dpowell,

I have my Polk SDA-SRS-2 speakers on granite kitchen sink cutouts,
but decoupled with speaker footers from Herbies Audio Lab.

These products really helped the SDA-SRS-2s dig out the extreme lowest bass they are capable of, and really upped the "feel it in your chest" factor, as well as achieving their most "lively" sound compared to any other arrangement I have tried. Excellent results from these in combination with the granite.

http://herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/spkrfeet.htm

Based on consultation with Steve Herbelin of Herbies Audio Lab,
for each speaker I used 4 Big Fat Dots at speaker corners and one Square Fat Dot in center.

For 2 speakers, the combination used above (8 Big Fat Dots and 2 Square Fat Dots) is sold as "Von Schweikert Special" on down the web page a bit, and you save a little money that way.

heiney9

rlmacklin wrote: »

dpowell,

I have my Polk SDA-SRS-2 speakers on granite kitchen sink cutouts,
but decoupled with speaker footers from Herbies Audio Lab.

These products really helped the SDA-SRS-2s dig out the extreme lowest bass they are capable of, and really upped the "feel it in your chest" factor, as well as achieving their most "lively" sound compared to any other arrangement I have tried. Excellent results from these in combination with the granite.

http://herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/spkrfeet.htm

Based on consultation with Steve Herbelin of Herbies Audio Lab,
for each speaker I used 4 Big Fat Dots at speaker corners and one Square Fat Dot in center.

For 2 speakers, the combination used above (8 Big Fat Dots and 2 Square Fat Dots) is sold as "Von Schweikert Special" on down the web page a bit, and you save a little money that way.

Sounds interesting.............is this on carpet of wood/concrete floor?

My brother did the granite/herbies for amp stands for his BAT VK60 mono's. Worked like a charm on a hardwood floor.

rlmacklin

heiney9,

In answer to your question,
the setup is on carpet.

JohnLocke88

dpowell wrote: »

Will do. I'm using a tape measure to get as close to the perfect equilateral triangle as possible. My room is perfectly square. It is a converted garage and I'm using the insulated garage door wall as the wall the speakers are facing away from. The two side walls are insulated and 5/8 drywall on them. The ceiling is also fully insulated and drywalled. I'm guessing based on what some have posted that the ultra plush pad and carpet are sucking the life out of some of the bass.

It sounds like you're looking at record dependent bass problems. If you like it in some tracks, but it is lacking in others, sounds like you're going to have to be careful not to overcompensate for the "bad-bass" tracks and thus take away from the experience on the "good-bass" tracks.

Also, when I demo'ed your speakers, the guy said (IIRC) that he hadn't done any modding/tweaking. You might do what others have done and do the whole mortite thing to ensure the cabinets are pressurized.

dbnh

rlmacklin wrote: »

dpowell,

I have my Polk SDA-SRS-2 speakers on granite kitchen sink cutouts,
but decoupled with speaker footers from Herbies Audio Lab.

These products really helped the SDA-SRS-2s dig out the extreme lowest bass they are capable of, and really upped the "feel it in your chest" factor, as well as achieving their most "lively" sound compared to any other arrangement I have tried. Excellent results from these in combination with the granite.

http://herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/spkrfeet.htm

Based on consultation with Steve Herbelin of Herbies Audio Lab,
for each speaker I used 4 Big Fat Dots at speaker corners and one Square Fat Dot in center.

For 2 speakers, the combination used above (8 Big Fat Dots and 2 Square Fat Dots) is sold as "Von Schweikert Special" on down the web page a bit, and you save a little money that way.

Heiney9,

I tried that setup for about a year, but used a combination of various Vibrapods (t'was fun doing the weight calculations and figuring which combination would work best!) instead of the Herbies product. I liked it, but ended up liking my 1Cs best when placed directly on the granite; they've been that was for at least a couple years.

I think sometimes it comes down to preference, your room, your gear, etc. It's funny but I recently thought about trying it again; earlier this year I had Ben redo my crossovers, and was wondering what the combo might sound like. However, it's not exactly one of those tweaks that's wicked easy to "A-B". :rolleyes: Then again, it could have been job-related stress and my mind craving a diversion!

hearingimpared

dpowell wrote: »

Last night my brother helped me move some furniture around and get my 1C's set up much more appropriately than they were before. Due to length limitation of speaker cables on hand and electrical outlet locations, I am able to have them setup as follows:

4 feet from the side walls
1 foot out from the back wall
8 feet 9 inches apart inside measurement.

Ultimately, I will obtain longer speaker cables and have them setup 3 feet from the side walls which will put the distance apart at 10 feet, 9 inches.

My brother and I spent about 2 hours in awe last night at how these sound. Not everything sounds great on them but overall I can't believe what I'm hearing. The vocals are simply unbelievable and the SDA effect is really cool on a lot of tracks. There were several times we had 'what the heck was that?!' moments where instruments or sounds would appear coming from unexpected places.

One thing that bugged me was the bass response on some tracks. I know these can put out good deep bass because I've heard it but I'm thinking that a lot has to do with the final studio mix. My rig is as follows:

Denon 3910 using dedicated 2-channel out
B&K Reference 10 in dedicated stereo mode, no processing, no EQ (not even available)
Anthem Amp1

In this setup, I have no way of adjusting EQ to bring the bass up on tracks that lack it. I am curious as to what other forum members have done to fill in the bass gaps? Does this call for a pre with EQ controls, a sepatarate EQ box or adding a sub?

How far away is the sweet spot. If you have them 8' 9" apart then your sweet spot will start at that distance. Also move them closer to the back wall. I had my 1.2 TLs 1 1/2" away from the back wall and the bass was less than desirable. I ended up with them 8" from the back wall and that made a world of difference.

zarrdoss

I have two set-ups, I have some 2.3's with all Rotel pre and mult-amp HT and some 2.3tl's in a 2 ch set up with a Carver M1.5t and I have sub-woofers on both. I have always used a sub no matter what speakers I use. Bass is amazing from the Polk's but some Cd's are definitely lacking. I used to play drums and have to feel them in order to enjoy the music. Oh BTW Merry Christmas everyone!

heiney9

Sometimes when I listen to my rig I am disappointed, but then I realize it's all in the recording I'm listening to and not an issue with the rig. I personally don;t believe in augmenting a simple/pure 2ch system with a sub or any kind of tone control. I enjoy each recording for what it is.................superbly recorded material is a real treat however.

H9

george daniel

heiney9 wrote: »

Sometimes when I listen to my rig I am disappointed, but then I realize it's all in the recording I'm listening to and not an issue with the rig. I personally don;t believe in augmenting a simple/pure 2ch system with a sub or any kind of tone control. I enjoy each recording for what it is.................superbly recorded material is a real treat however.

H9

Bam +1