Sub Connection Question

sk1939

Alright, as per your suggestions, and as per my budget, I picked up a new PSW10 from the big box store down the street. Now my amp is an ageing but good (it was top of the line in 92, only the ES's were better, before you bash me for having a Non -ES Sony) 120Wpc Sony STR-D1090. Now this sub is old enough that it doesn't have an LFE out (for better or worse considering the PSW10 doesn't have a dedicated LFE in), so I connected it to the Tape 1 Rec Out. It worked, it was amazing, it was....overpowering so I tweaked it and picked things that had fallen over. Now doing it that way doesn't allow me to control the volume of the sub (really do not want to have to reach for the little knob every time I change a source). So I used the subs speaker in - speaker out, so far so good, powered er up, and was this time, underwhelmed. Nada, zip, zero, heard nothing, in fact, I had to turn the sub volume to almost max and the crossover to 120Hz, and then it was audible, and all was right with the universe, except I view it as there's something wrong. Now I can turn down the subs volume level by turning up the receivers, but then the speakers get louder than normal listening level as well.

So basically, whats wrong with the speakers in on the sub or my amp, and what is the best way to fix it. Note that I am a fan of the barely there to noticeable sub presence and in no means want to emulate the low rider down the street.

kawizx9r

Does the receiver have any other set of outputs other than the Tape Rec out?

I should assume that it doesn't considering you had to use such a connection.

As for using the speaker terminal out, that's what I would've suggested you use. Now I'm not sure how this would affect things but, are the speakers you're using 8ohm? This can cause issues with the high-pass filter built into the subwoofers speaker terminal outs if it's like the micropro series. As for the sub in itself sounding really low, I'd say double check your wiring and make sure there aren't any shorts...as well as making sure the speaker wire is secured properly in the sub itself.

One last thing, since you just bought it you'll need to give it plenty of play-time before it fully breaks in.

Note: Micropro sub's speaker terminal out's have a high-pass that cuts out frequencies 120hz and below, which is why I asked about your speakers.

sk1939

kawizx9r wrote: »

Does the receiver have any other set of outputs other than the Tape Rec out?

I should assume that it doesn't considering you had to use such a connection.

As for using the speaker terminal out, that's what I would've suggested you use. Now I'm not sure how this would affect things but, are the speakers you're using 8ohm? This can cause issues with the high-pass filter built into the subwoofers speaker terminal outs if it's like the micropro series. As for the sub in itself sounding really low, I'd say double check your wiring and make sure there aren't any shorts...as well as making sure the speaker wire is secured properly in the sub itself.

One last thing, since you just bought it you'll need to give it plenty of play-time before it fully breaks in.

Note: Micropro sub's speaker terminal out's have a high-pass that cuts out frequencies 120hz and below, which is why I asked about your speakers.

Um, it has a variac that controls the filter (high or low pass I can't tell you), but it ranges from 80-160Hz. I'm using 16AWG wire, and I did indeed check that there were no shorts. They are indeed 8 Ohm speakers (TSi 100's) and the wiring in the sub itself looks fine. I understand that it needs a break in period, but I still don't think that it should affect the volume levels from the same source when connected to different inputs (not at the same time obviously). The receiver has In's and Outs for 2 Tape Decks, a video input, and a DAT. Oh, and audio processing is set to off, so no Pro Logic is on to interfere with things.

RCA In/Outs on the Receiver


Speaker Connections I use Front Speakers A


Better Sizes:
RCA Connections
Speaker Connections

kawizx9r

When utilizing the speaker terminals, you get normal output from your tsi's as you did without the sub in place right?

Try using the front B's for the sub itself and see if it sounds louder/better as opposed to A. Just make sure your B outs are enabled on your AVR's settings. Another thing that I can think of is whether or not your sub is out of phase or not with your tsi's, but I don't think the bookshelves would put out enough bass to cancel out the bass from the PSW10. Never know but its all worth a try!

sk1939

kawizx9r wrote: »

When utilizing the speaker terminals, you get normal output from your tsi's as you did without the sub in place right?

Try using the front B's for the sub itself and see if it sounds louder/better as opposed to A. Just make sure your B outs are enabled on your AVR's settings. Another thing that I can think of is whether or not your sub is out of phase or not with your tsi's, but I don't think the bookshelves would put out enough bass to cancel out the bass from the PSW10. Never know but its all worth a try!

Yeah, it's the same output, nothing changed, no decrease in volume or anything.
I enabled speaker B, and with the sub, it's the same result, and if it's just the sub connected on B, there's just the sub quietly pounding away, at 9 o clock it has but not alot if it at normally listenable levels (playing Coldplay's X&Y). If I select speaker A+B, there's nothing. No, the bookshelves don't put out enough bass, hence the subwoofer lol...

I think I'll try vinyl this time because my Toshiba HDCD/CD/DVD seems to not like to output bass all that much (you know it's off when Tocatta and Fugue sounds flat).

kawizx9r

sk1939 wrote: »

Yeah, it's the same output, nothing changed, no decrease in volume or anything.
I enabled speaker B, and with the sub, it's the same result, and if it's just the sub connected on B, there's just the sub quietly pounding away, at 9 o clock it has but not alot if it at normally listenable levels (playing Coldplay's X&Y). If I select speaker A+B, there's nothing. No, the bookshelves don't put out enough bass, hence the subwoofer lol...

I think I'll try vinyl this time because my Toshiba HDCD/CD/DVD seems to not like to output bass all that much (you know it's off when Tocatta and Fugue sounds flat).

Yea, I know about the TSi's not putting out much bass. It's just that they can put out bass in the higher frequencies where it's much more noticeable whether or not bass-frequencies are being cancelled out or not.

Well, can you try this setup on a different stereo IE a neighbor/friends? I temporarily owned a PSW10 and never had problems with it utilizing speaker terminal ins/outs, daisy chaining subwoofers, using preamp outs on a receiver, on different preamps, everything.

What's the chance that you can get a better receiver/integrated/separates? It's a buyers market out there! Especially in the used section.

sk1939

kawizx9r wrote: »

Yea, I know about the TSi's not putting out much bass. It's just that they can put out bass in the higher frequencies where it's much more noticeable whether or not bass-frequencies are being cancelled out or not.

Well, can you try this setup on a different stereo IE a neighbor/friends? I temporarily owned a PSW10 and never had problems with it utilizing speaker terminal ins/outs, daisy chaining subwoofers, using preamp outs on a receiver, on different preamps, everything.

What's the chance that you can get a better receiver/integrated/separates? It's a buyers market out there! Especially in the used section.

Slim of getting a better receiver, my budget is now $0 since the subwoofer purchase. I have another Sony connected now, a Sony STR-DE597 (nothing particularly remarkable about an entry level 6.1 reciever), although my turntable doesn't like this receiver (needs a preamp + ground), and using the LFE output of the receiver it sounds fine. Using the speaker in/outs the speakers are again drowning out the sub, I'm starting to think it's because the sub isn't as efficient as the speakers or so. I haven't tried my behemoth Onkyo TX-6500 yet (100Wpc (real watts) :eek:[puts the Sonys to utter shame, and laughs at the TSi's]), but I think it will be the same result.

I may consider a new amp, but it would probably an integrated rather than separates or a receiver since I don't listen to radio much and don't use these for movies.

packetjones

glad to hear that you were able to get a sub to compliment those tsi100's. If you got it at a big box down the street you may have over paid. Just sayin. You could have gotten a good deal off of polk direct, but either way.....

there used to be a sticky about different ways to connect the psw10 but i can not seem to find it now. you could always give polk a call and ask them. They have great customer service and would be able to give other advice over the phone as well.

Good luck.

sk1939

packetjones wrote: »

glad to hear that you were able to get a sub to compliment those tsi100's. If you got it at a big box down the street you may have over paid. Just sayin. You could have gotten a good deal off of polk direct, but either way.....

there used to be a sticky about different ways to connect the psw10 but i can not seem to find it now. you could always give polk a call and ask them. They have great customer service and would be able to give other advice over the phone as well.

Good luck.

Yeah, I got it on sale for $106 (6% Tax included), I thought it was a good deal at least.

As far as the issue, I brought the sub home with me (was with me at college), and I connected it to my STR-DE597. There was a drop in quality (it IS a cheap receiver), but it also has an LFE out. I had to tweak the settings otherwise it was muddy, but otherwise it works, except it seems when the volume is low (8 of 75)(stays in standby mode, fixed with RCA Y adaptor to both inputs on the sub). It seems the subs biggest problem is being audible in small rooms or, more accurately, at low volume.