Soldering Banana Plugs

2

Comments

  • messiah
    messiah Posts: 1,790
    edited September 2009
    F1nut wrote: »
    Ummm.....ya'll do realize that the all the better cable manufacturers solder their terminations, right?

    Talk about making a mountain out of molehill.

    Yep, sure do. They aren't using signal cable, nakamichi plugs (that aren't ment to be soldered) or random solder either. I'm sure he can find out what solder is currently on his wires, but I doubt it is what MIT uses on there 26000 dollar cables. Soldering makes it perminent, and ruins the nanners. If he wants to upgrade cables in the future, or just plain hates them now, that's just an added expense.
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    Benjamin Franklin, February 17th, 1775.

    "The day that I have to give up my constitutional rights AND let some dude rub my junk...well, let's just say that it's gonna be a real bad day for the dude trying to rub my junk!!"
    messiah, November 23rd, 2010
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,731
    edited September 2009
    Soldering makes it perminent, and ruins the nanners. If he wants to upgrade cables in the future, or just plain hates them now, that's just an added expense.

    I'm sorry, but that makes no sense. Solder is not permanent, nor will it ruin a banana plug.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    Solder wont ruin a nanner plug. But too much heat will. If you apply too much heat, you can warp, degrade, F up a connector.
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  • messiah
    messiah Posts: 1,790
    edited September 2009
    I guess it might not ruin it (the banana plug) depending on how this guy dumps a bunch of molten lead into a plug that was never ment to receive molten lead, but cleaning it might suck.
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    Benjamin Franklin, February 17th, 1775.

    "The day that I have to give up my constitutional rights AND let some dude rub my junk...well, let's just say that it's gonna be a real bad day for the dude trying to rub my junk!!"
    messiah, November 23rd, 2010
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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    messiah wrote: »
    I guess it might not ruin it (the banana plug) depending on how this guy dumps a bunch of molten lead into a plug that was never ment to receive molten lead, but cleaning it might suck.
    True. It takes a steady hand. A dab'll do ya.
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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    Whoa, I missed alot. I accidentally fell asleep at 8pm. The solder I'm using is Cardas Tri Eutectic (lead free). So basically it comes down to doing it right?

    As ShinAce indicates, "Gold as in Gold Plated" is solderable, according to the ebay listening I bought the nanners from, its 24k gold plated.

    If I chose not to solder it, I would be using the double screws. So I would need to take the existing solder off (came in the mail like that, Frank must've did it). I would need to take the existing solder off because the double screws don't screw in all the way because the wire is too thick and the solder doesn't make it flexible for much bend.

    Solder vs Double Screws. F1Nut says solder, while majority says don't?
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,731
    edited September 2009
    Ok, Messiah and I were discussing this. His point was to use the screws first before using solder to see if you like the cable/nanner combo. If you do, you can always solder them later.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    messiah wrote: »
    Why dont you just get gid of the solder, try the plugs, and see if you like it. I highly doubt the solder is going to improve the sound quality. It might actually do the opposite. That, and you wont be able to re-use your nanners.

    I'm not doing it to improve the sound quality. I just want a stable connection, and I don't want my wires to be falling out of the banana connectors.

    My co-worker suggested it to me and said he knows how to do it, so I'm relying on him to do a good job. He seems to know what he's doing.
    Samsung LN52A850 (52" 1080P LCD TV) | RTi A9's (Fronts) | Csi A6(Center) | FXi A6 (Rear Surrounds) | SVS PB12-NSD (Sub) | Oppo BDP-103 | Panamax M5300-PM

    Pre-Amp: Marantz AV7005 | Amp: Emotiva XPA-5 | Speaker wires: Signal Cables | Interconnects: Signal Cables
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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    solder
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  • messiah
    messiah Posts: 1,790
    edited September 2009
    FittyFieFo wrote: »
    Whoa, I missed alot. I accidentally fell asleep at 8pm. The solder I'm using is Cardas Tri Eutectic (lead free). So basically it comes down to doing it right?

    As ShinAce indicates, "Gold as in Gold Plated" is solderable, according to the ebay listening I bought the nanners from, its 24k gold plated.

    If I chose not to solder it, I would be using the double screws. So I would need to take the existing solder off (came in the mail like that, Frank must've did it). I would need to take the existing solder off because the double screws don't screw in all the way because the wire is too thick and the solder doesn't make it flexible for much bend.

    Solder vs Double Screws. F1Nut says solder, while majority says don't?

    I'm not going against F1, he has much more experience than I do. What I'm suggesting is that you connect your wires to the nanners without using solder. If you like them, keep them. If you dont, grab different wires. In other words, keep it flexible. Synergy can be a **** :D
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    Benjamin Franklin, February 17th, 1775.

    "The day that I have to give up my constitutional rights AND let some dude rub my junk...well, let's just say that it's gonna be a real bad day for the dude trying to rub my junk!!"
    messiah, November 23rd, 2010
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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    F1nut wrote: »
    Ok, Messiah and I were discussing this. His point was to use the screws first before using solder to see if you like the cable/nanner combo. If you do, you can always solder them later.

    I would need to take off the existing solder then. Should I just use a solder gun to melt off the solder? (I know little about soldering, so I would for sure ask my co-worker to do this for me). Cause once he found out his solder gun wouldn't work (he ordered a solder torch), we tried just using the double screws. It didn't "fit" because the wire was too thick.
    Samsung LN52A850 (52" 1080P LCD TV) | RTi A9's (Fronts) | Csi A6(Center) | FXi A6 (Rear Surrounds) | SVS PB12-NSD (Sub) | Oppo BDP-103 | Panamax M5300-PM

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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,731
    edited September 2009
    Yes, simply plug that sucker in and when it gets hot hold it to the soldered cable end. When the solder melts, simply tap the end against an edge, the bulk of the solder will come right off. A 2 year old can do it. :)
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • messiah
    messiah Posts: 1,790
    edited September 2009
    You could cut off the soldered wire and start fresh. Probably would cost you 3/4 of an inch.
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    Benjamin Franklin, February 17th, 1775.

    "The day that I have to give up my constitutional rights AND let some dude rub my junk...well, let's just say that it's gonna be a real bad day for the dude trying to rub my junk!!"
    messiah, November 23rd, 2010
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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    I'll be posting pictures on how the wires look now. I don't think I should cut the wires
    Samsung LN52A850 (52" 1080P LCD TV) | RTi A9's (Fronts) | Csi A6(Center) | FXi A6 (Rear Surrounds) | SVS PB12-NSD (Sub) | Oppo BDP-103 | Panamax M5300-PM

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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/6964/cable001.jpg

    http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/9836/cable002.jpg

    http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/1622/cable003.jpg
    Samsung LN52A850 (52" 1080P LCD TV) | RTi A9's (Fronts) | Csi A6(Center) | FXi A6 (Rear Surrounds) | SVS PB12-NSD (Sub) | Oppo BDP-103 | Panamax M5300-PM

    Pre-Amp: Marantz AV7005 | Amp: Emotiva XPA-5 | Speaker wires: Signal Cables | Interconnects: Signal Cables
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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    Just a thought...once the nanners are clean and you are ready to set the cable to connects. "Tin" the raw cable ends and set to the them connectors, apply heat to the connectors until you see the tinned end START to melt. Then place a small amount of raw solder between connector and wire end while under heat.
    That should give you a nice, solid connection.
    Not eloquent in my description, but it's the best I can do.
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  • messiah
    messiah Posts: 1,790
    edited September 2009
    Ok, not much room to work there. You'll probably want to follow F1's recomendations.
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    Benjamin Franklin, February 17th, 1775.

    "The day that I have to give up my constitutional rights AND let some dude rub my junk...well, let's just say that it's gonna be a real bad day for the dude trying to rub my junk!!"
    messiah, November 23rd, 2010
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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    FittyFieFo wrote: »
    http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/6964/cable001.jpg

    http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/9836/cable002.jpg

    http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/1622/cable003.jpg

    Well that throws a wrench into the works. The ends are already tinned.
    Use compression terminations.
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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    messiah wrote: »
    Ok, not much room to work there. You'll probably want to follow F1's recomendations.

    That's for taking the solder off the wires. If I decide to solder, would it be wise to take off the existing solder FIRST, then to solder with the Cardas
    Samsung LN52A850 (52" 1080P LCD TV) | RTi A9's (Fronts) | Csi A6(Center) | FXi A6 (Rear Surrounds) | SVS PB12-NSD (Sub) | Oppo BDP-103 | Panamax M5300-PM

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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    FittyFieFo wrote: »
    That's for taking the solder off the wires. If I decide to solder, would it be wise to take off the existing solder FIRST, then to solder with the Cardas
    Depends on what the OEM solder contents is. Any info on what they used at the factory?
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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    http://www.soniccraft.com/products/connections/solder/cardas.htm
    Diameter = 8mm (20awg) (.032in)

    RoHS, European directive 2002/95/EC, compliant. Lead free, ultra pure, tin/silver/ copper,

    Tri Eutectic .032 solder, activated rosin core flux

    This solder contains no Lead.


    The resin core flux is gentle on precious metal surfaces
    and the melting temperature is (430°F/221°C).
    Samsung LN52A850 (52" 1080P LCD TV) | RTi A9's (Fronts) | Csi A6(Center) | FXi A6 (Rear Surrounds) | SVS PB12-NSD (Sub) | Oppo BDP-103 | Panamax M5300-PM

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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    I may as well solder since I have all the things coming in the mail (Solder Torch, Solder). The wires seem pretty decently heavy too.
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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    FittyFieFo wrote: »
    http://www.soniccraft.com/products/connections/solder/cardas.htm
    Allright. If you are going to go through the trouble of de-soldering the ends of the cable and then hopefully getting all the original material from the substrate. Why not just cut off the factory ends as discussed before and start fresh with bare copper and and some NEW, CLEAN and FRESH Nak connectors? Sounds like you're trying to de-solder some older wires and connectors in hopes it may sound like new to new soldered joints.
    No telling what elements the used materials have been exposed to.
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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    lightman1 wrote: »
    Allright. If you are going to go through the trouble of de-soldering the ends of the cable and then hopefully getting all the original material from the substrate. Why not just cut off the factory ends as discussed before and start fresh with bare copper and and some NEW, CLEAN and FRESH Nak connectors? Sounds like you're trying to de-solder some older wires and connectors in hopes it may sound like new to new soldered joints.
    No telling what elements the used materials have been exposed to.

    Well, I didn't really want to desolder the ends. I was asking if it would be wise to get rid of the existing solder. My co-worker's plan was to just leave it as is and just solder using his solder torch and my solder that's in the mail.
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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    Getting rid of existing solder is known as de-soldering, with heat and and an extractor of sorts.;)
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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    lightman1 wrote: »
    Getting rid of existing solder is known as de-soldering, with heat and and an extractor of sorts.;)

    Well I mean, would you leave the existing solder on and go on with the normal procedure of soldering the speaker wire into the banana plug?
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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    Will the Nak nanners accept the Cardas solder to near the same specs that the solder presents? Refresh my memeory. Are the Nak nanners new?
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  • FittyFieFo
    FittyFieFo Posts: 482
    edited September 2009
    I bought the Nakamichi Nanners from Ebay as new.

    http://cgi.ebay.com/24-PCS-Nakamichi-Speaker-banana-plug-connector-24k-Gold_W0QQitemZ320411531230QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item4a9a03f7de&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
    1. 24k Gold plated

    2. Made of Pure Copper.

    3. Double screws locking .

    4. Easy fit for wire size up to 4mm .

    5. Color coded:black and red.

    6. High Quality 100% Brand new!

    Not sure if the nanners will accept the cardas solder to near same specs. Not sure how to find that out.
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,731
    edited September 2009
    Dude, you are making a much bigger deal out of this than you have a right to. Either solder or screw the effing wires, your choice. It's not rocket science.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,794
    edited September 2009
    Cool. Cut of the soldered ends of your cables and strip back the insulation to the required length for the nanners. Re-twist each bare conductor of the speaker cable. Check the fit of new conductor to the connector. A little room to wiggle is OK. Heat the fresh conductor up until you get the solder to soak into the bare wire. Put on a baking rack until cool to the touch(kidding):D
    Depnding on the heat range of the NAK connector, put that much plus a little more to it while placing the "tinned" end of the wire on the solder point while placing the end of the solder itself next to it while applying heat. When the tinned end and the solder element start to melt(meld) to the connection point. Immediately remove heat from both. If you do not see any syrupy residue, you will have made a di-electrically sound connection.
    Hope this helps.
    And if you tell ANYBODY here I discussed anything audio related or offered any help to anyone...I will deny it with impunity.
    Dig it?
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