2-way vs 3-way Component Systems

jay27

I've never run a 3-way system before, but am considering it. The thought is that more of the frequency range would be coming from around the dash instead of near the floor. Does anyone have any input on going 3-way instead of 2-way?

Kinetic

I dont run it, but i recently heard the CDT and the Morel, and they sound more clear than the 2 way, and its more close to a home audio.

cadenceclipse

jay27 wrote: »

I've never run a 3-way system before, but am considering it. The thought is that more of the frequency range would be coming from around the dash instead of near the floor. Does anyone have any input on going 3-way instead of 2-way?

why around dash more? cause of placement(where speakers r located)? can't really see the need 4 it specially considering price and power requirements over something like sr 2-way or even something like MM6501s. most 3-ways r probably in the $1000 range...lotta dough

jay27

Well, when I finally placed the SR tweeters on the sail panels, it made the biggest difference to date as far as better sound from my speakers. So my thinking was that if I played more of the frequencies up around the dash, the sound might improve further. It would make the install more complicated for sure, though. And I imagine tuning might be that much more difficult as well.

MacLeod

The SR tweeter biggest negative is that they are EXTREMELY directional so having them down low doesnt work well at all unless theyre pointed right at you. So dash locations for these tweets (and most tweets in my experience) is the best spot for them.

Now are you talking about a true 3 way? As in tweeter, midrange, midbass and subwoofer? If so then I suggest sticking to a 2 way. The more speakers you have the more complicated things become and the harder they are to fix. Getting the midbass to play in phase with the mids and getting all the time correction right is a pain and since the only real gain to a 3 way is better midbass ala the dedicated midbass speakers, Ill do without. A 2 way system will almost always sound better with less work.

jay27

Thanks for the input. Instead of the true 3-way, what do you think about running a subwoofer, midbass, and full range speakers that can play from about 500-20khz?

arun1963

+1 to what Mac said.

A good friend got caught up in the 3way hype and installed 3way rainbow comps running off the rainbow preamp+power amp off a 9887. He spent close to the equvalent of $3k and asked me if I could help with the tunning cause his setup sounded like crap.

To cut a long story short I spent 9 hrs over 3 days trying to set the tunning and I failed. I tried everyting to get coherence between the drivers but it just didnt work. Trying to manage 3 xover points (he also runs a sub), and trying to time align the 7 drivers was just too much.

Get good 2ways biamped off a 4ch amp with a good sub running off a monoblock.

cadenceclipse

500-20k? what kinda full-ranges r those? 3 1/2" kenwoods? so u have SR components but want more midbass?? what sub u running?

arun1963

if I played more of the frequencies up around the dash, the sound might improve further.

No. You only need the highs (tweets) at close to ear level. This sets the height from which your ears percieve the sound. Thats just the way your mind and ears process sound.

You need the lows/mids down low and forward on your door panel. Lesser pathlength variation. This setup would give you better coherence and sound stage height.

The fact that the sr tweets are highly directional, like mac pointed out, makes it even more imp to mount the the sr tweets closer to ear level.

Honestly, if you have the sr's, mount them properly and then focus on tuning them. Don't over think and over complicate the issue by thinking 3 ways or additional drivers. You will kill the coherence in your sound.

jay27

Thanks for all of the advice!

jay27

cadenceclipse wrote: »

500-20k? what kinda full-ranges r those? 3 1/2" kenwoods? so u have SR components but want more midbass?? what sub u running?

I was actually thinking of something more like this:
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=264-844

I would have put this somewhere on the dash.

Kinetic

arun1963 wrote: »

+1 to what Mac said.

A good friend got caught up in the 3way hype and installed 3way rainbow comps running off the rainbow preamp+power amp off a 9887. He spent close to the equvalent of $3k and asked me if I could help with the tunning cause his setup sounded like crap.

To cut a long story short I spent 9 hrs over 3 days trying to set the tunning and I failed. I tried everyting to get coherence between the drivers but it just didnt work. Trying to manage 3 xover points (he also runs a sub), and trying to time align the 7 drivers was just too much.

Get good 2ways biamped off a 4ch amp with a good sub running off a monoblock.

if he has the 9887 why didnt try the Imprint Module?
its amazing if you do it right, i have the doc that an alpine tech guy release with all the tricks, and it is amazing really..

its close to a profesional human tuning..

arun1963

why didnt try the Imprint Module?

cause he ran out of $$$

doing it manually though is really tough.

Kinetic

i can borrow mine, but I live in Mexico City..

although if he buy it, just ask me for the Alpine document, it will make a huge difference

arun1963

Kinetic wrote: »

i can borrow mine, but I live in Mexico City..

although if he buy it, just ask me for the Alpine document, it will make a huge difference

I passed your msg on and it seems that he isn't going to be buying anything for a while. His wife found out how much he had spent on the system........:D

So he's stuck with what he has, for a while.

tk421

theoretically, 3 way is best. in practice, difficult. in reality it's a four way setup cause u also got a sub woofer.

the push for 3 way is clear. let each driver play a defined range and avoid wave distortion. this approach is used in a lot of high end home audio. but in a car, it;s hard to do. u really need to keep the speakers within inches of each other to give a point source effect. else, u got real tuning and positioning to do!

tuning them requires understanding IDT and IID and thus, setting your crossover points to suit. choosing a good 3 way speaker system should involve a woofer that plays as low as possible. at least down to 50 hz comfortably. then u let the sub play sub bass. it is hard to find a 6" that can do 50 hz at the level u want it to. (ie - if u want it loud. i like my bass to hit and hurt.)