boring ic question

superjunior
superjunior Posts: 1,632
edited August 2009 in Basic Hookup/Wiring Questions
when I first hooked up my amp using some cheap generic analog cables, my amp would immediatly shut down with the left channal light blinking. I replaced those cables with some cheap monster ics and problem solved - so I thought. Now the amp will do the same thing- only at very high volume with the right channal light blinking. I think I've narrowed the problem down to my cheasy ic's. Can anyone suggest some quality ic's that would work well with my gear? I would need 3, or 2 pair I guess. Like to keep it under a couple hundred, everytime I see them on the fm they've already been snatched up. Thanks ahead for any thoughts
jr
panasonic th-50pz85u
pioneer elite vsx-92txh
pioneer elite bdp-05fd
emotiva xpa-3
monster power hdp 2550
sa 8300 hd dvr
sda 2b's
fronts - rti a9's
center - csi a6
surrounds - fxi a6's
sub - polk dsw pro 600
harmony one
Post edited by superjunior on
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Comments

  • wutadumsn23
    wutadumsn23 Posts: 3,702
    edited July 2009
    Get with Ben, he makes his own, and from what I hear they are some of the best around. Don't know the prices, but I'm sure they are reasonable. If not he may be able to point you in the right direction. However, that may not be the root of your problem.
    HT Rig
    Receiver- Onkyo TX-SR806
    Mains- Polk Audio Monitor 70
    Center- Polk Audio CS2
    Surrounds- Polk Audio TSi 500's :D
    Sub- Polk Audio PSW125
    Retired- Polk Audio Monitor 40's
    T.V.- 60" Sony SXRD KDS-60A2000 LCoS
    Blu-Ray- 80 GB PS3


    2 CH rig (in progress)
    Polk Audio Monitor 10A's :cool:

    It's not that I'm insensitive, I just don't care.. :D
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  • jimmydep
    jimmydep Posts: 1,305
    edited July 2009
    jr...I'm assuming you're referring to the pre-outs to the amp.......I can't see why the IC's would be the issue unless the first pair was defective......I've used pretty cheesy IC's and never had any problems other than a noticeable loss of SQ.....

    Jimmy
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  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    wutadumsn23 wrote: »
    Get with Ben, he makes his own, and from what I hear they are some of the best around. Don't know the prices, but I'm sure they are reasonable. If not he may be able to point you in the right direction. However, that may not be the root of your problem.

    Thanks. thought I saw a pair of bens cables on the fm,have to see if they're still there
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
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  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    jimmydep wrote: »
    jr...I'm assuming you're referring to the pre-outs to the amp.......I can't see why the IC's would be the issue unless the first pair was defective......I've used pretty cheesy IC's and never had any problems other than a noticeable loss of SQ.....

    Jimmy

    thanks jimmy, yes the pre outs from the receiver to the amp. when I replaced them (ic's) the first time the problem was gone - untill listening to some really loud music- problem back. Once I get some good ic's, if the problem still persists I can rule the cables out. crap- late for work- gotta go !
    jr
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
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  • Willow
    Willow Posts: 11,135
    edited July 2009
    I would have to say it sounds like an issue with the amp and not the cables. Have you checked your speaker cables to be sure the - and + are not touching? at the AMP end ?

    Do you have another AVR you could test out maybe it's your pre-outs
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  • curved
    curved Posts: 664
    edited July 2009
    Ben's IC are outstanding...especially after they burn in. However, I don't think that's going to solve your problem.
    Living Room:....................[HTML] [/HTML] Zone 2 (Workout Room):
    AVR - Yamaha RX-V757......JBL 4312 Pro Monitors
    Pre - Nak CA-5
    AMP - Adcom 555 (Main)
    Main - Polk RTI8**/RTiA5
    AMP - Adcom 545II (Center)
    Center - Polk CSiA4**
    Sub - Snell Basis 300:p......Zone 3 (Outside)
    CD - Yamaha CDC-555.......Def Tech AW5500
    TV - Pani TH-42PZ80U
    BR - LG BD390
    Monster HTS1600 Power Center
    Dedicated Circuit - (2) 20amp, (1) 15amp
    Ben's IC, Canare 4S11
    **Dayton and Sonicap Caps with Mills Resistors**
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited July 2009
    Willow wrote: »
    I would have to say it sounds like an issue with the amp and not the cables. Have you checked your speaker cables to be sure the - and + are not touching? at the AMP end ?

    Do you have another AVR you could test out maybe it's your pre-outs

    I have to agree....that just doesn't sound right. I/Cs vary in quality for sure...but shutting down your unit shouldn't happen unless there is a problem with the Pre-outs?

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • dragon1952
    dragon1952 Posts: 4,907
    edited July 2009
    I also agree....it's not the cables.
    2 channel - Willsenton R8 tube integrated, Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE DAC, audio optimized NUC7i5, Windows 10 Pro/JRiver MC29/Fidelizer Plus 8.7 w/LPS and external SSD drive, PS Audio PerfectWave P3 regenerator, KEF R3 speakers, Rythmik F12SE subwoofer, Audioquest Diamond USB cable, Gabriel Gold IC's, Morrow Audio SP5 speaker cables. Computer - Windows 10/JRiver, Schiit Magni 3+/Modi 3+, Fostex PMO.4n monitors, Sennheiser HD600 headphones
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  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    thanks fellas, maybe I should dig a little deeper and double check all my other connections. First suspect would be my bannanas on all my speeker connections,I'm not quite sure I've got the best connections there. I still need some good ic's, but the suggestions here have helped big time. Thanks folks
    jr
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
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  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    it is odd though, that the problem "changed" when switching the ics. Hope its not a problem with the avr or amp:(
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
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  • LessisNevermore
    LessisNevermore Posts: 1,519
    edited July 2009
    superjunior wrote: »
    it is odd though, that the problem "changed" when switching the ics. Hope its not a problem with the avr or amp:(

    It's not the amp.
    It's not the avr.
    It's not the amp, and....it's not the amp.

    I had the same issue with my XPA 5 when I first got it. The protection circuitry is finicky with regard to IC's. Oddly enough, it was when I got rid of my Monster Cables, that the issue went away. IMO, the protection circuitry is too sensitive, but once you find a set of cables that agree, you won't go into protection anymore.(without a good reason...:D)

    Avoid non-shielded/poorly shielded cables. I wanted to find out for sure if the IC's were really the culprit, without spending a ton of money, so I tried out the Monoprice cables. The problem disappeared. I've since replaced those with a 5-lead snake type cable, and still no issues. (I didn't care for the MP IC's on my rig)
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  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    thank you sir, that is music to my ears :)
    jr
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
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  • LessisNevermore
    LessisNevermore Posts: 1,519
    edited July 2009
    You're very welcome.
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  • curved
    curved Posts: 664
    edited July 2009
    I would look at the following depending on your budget:
    - Ben's
    - AQ
    - Kimber

    Like you said before, you need new interconnects regardless. Let us know how it works out.
    Living Room:....................[HTML] [/HTML] Zone 2 (Workout Room):
    AVR - Yamaha RX-V757......JBL 4312 Pro Monitors
    Pre - Nak CA-5
    AMP - Adcom 555 (Main)
    Main - Polk RTI8**/RTiA5
    AMP - Adcom 545II (Center)
    Center - Polk CSiA4**
    Sub - Snell Basis 300:p......Zone 3 (Outside)
    CD - Yamaha CDC-555.......Def Tech AW5500
    TV - Pani TH-42PZ80U
    BR - LG BD390
    Monster HTS1600 Power Center
    Dedicated Circuit - (2) 20amp, (1) 15amp
    Ben's IC, Canare 4S11
    **Dayton and Sonicap Caps with Mills Resistors**
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    will do- got a few leads, will be ordering new ic's tommorro hopefully
    jr
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited July 2009
    LessisNevermore wrote: »
    It's not the amp.
    It's not the avr.
    It's not the amp, and....it's not the amp.

    I had the same issue with my XPA 5 when I first got it. The protection circuitry is finicky with regard to IC's. Oddly enough, it was when I got rid of my Monster Cables, that the issue went away. IMO, the protection circuitry is too sensitive, but once you find a set of cables that agree, you won't go into protection anymore.(without a good reason...:D)

    Avoid non-shielded/poorly shielded cables. I wanted to find out for sure if the IC's were really the culprit, without spending a ton of money, so I tried out the Monoprice cables. The problem disappeared. I've since replaced those with a 5-lead snake type cable, and still no issues. (I didn't care for the MP IC's on my rig)

    That is interesting. Is that a particular problem with Emotivas or are other amps affected by that because I've never seen that happen with a number of other power amps? Of course I haven't tried more than a handful of others...and no Emotivas. Even cables a lot lower end than the infamous monsters had no such effect. I'm talking about really questionable cables.

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • LessisNevermore
    LessisNevermore Posts: 1,519
    edited July 2009
    cnh wrote: »
    That is interesting. Is that a particular problem with Emotivas or are other amps affected by that because I've never seen that happen with a number of other power amps? Of course I haven't tried more than a handful of others...and no Emotivas. Even cables a lot lower end than the infamous monsters had no such effect. I'm talking about really questionable cables.

    cnh

    I don't know the particulars, just what I, and a few others experienced. I know that Emotiva implements a lot of protection circuitry in the XPA series, not sure about the others. I've only heard about it in this series.

    And I don't think it's so much a problem, as it is a quirk. When I first experienced it, I was using Monster IC's, I swapped out the cable on the offending channel with another of the same make and model. The next time, it was on a different channel, and it seemed to be totally random. Then I noticed it would do it pretty consistently when changing inputs on the AVR.

    First I scrounged around an found whatever I had laying around, (rat shack, throw aways, etc.) and pulled all of the MC's out. The amp never went into protection again. I bought all new Monoprice IC's, and still had no issues, same story with the snake.

    So it is not the amp per se, but the protection system sensing something in the cables that's not kosher. Maybe some of the EE types here can theorize as to what could cause that.
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  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    Less, this is the exact "quirky" thing my xpa is doing. Can anyone suggest wether mit avt3's or audioquest diamondbacks would work better with my gear? Someone in the fm has the diamond backs for $60 a pair and mit is selling refurb avt3's for $50 a pair. I would still need 1 more for my third channal though, but these seem to be good prices. thanks
    jr
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • LessisNevermore
    LessisNevermore Posts: 1,519
    edited July 2009
    superjunior wrote: »
    Less, this is the exact "quirky" thing my xpa is doing. Can anyone suggest wether mit avt3's or audioquest diamondbacks would work better with my gear? Someone in the fm has the diamond backs for $60 a pair and mit is selling refurb avt3's for $50 a pair. I would still need 1 more for my third channal though, but these seem to be good prices. thanks
    jr


    Sorry jr, I can't comment on your choices. A quality, 100% shielded wire should work fine.

    When I pulled out one of the Monster cables (a mid-line) that was definitely bad, I cut it open to see how it was built. I couldn't believe it, there were only 6 strands each, of copper in the leads.:eek: That was a lesson to me, that thickness of the jacketing, has no correlation to the quality of the wire inside.

    I'd say go ahead and try out one of the brands you mentioned, if they don't work out, you can always unload them here in the Flea Market area, and try out the other ones.
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  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    good info, thanks again my freind
    jr
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    just ordered the mit's. thanks to all for comments, suggestions and pm's. Will post results when they arrive
    jr
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    I HATE UPS :mad: !!!
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    well the mit's finnally got here. They don't have an arrow showing which direction to plug them in. anyone know if the short box end should be at the receivers outs, or the amps inputs?
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,136
    edited July 2009
    superjunior wrote: »
    well the mit's finnally got here. They don't have an arrow showing which direction to plug them in. anyone know if the short box end should be at the receivers outs, or the amps inputs?

    The amps inputs.
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  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited July 2009
    thanks, can't wait to hook these up..
    jr
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • superjunior
    superjunior Posts: 1,632
    edited August 2009
    did some serious 2 channal listening today with the mit avt 3's. the new ic's cured the quirky amp problem thats been haunting me. Amp works perfect without flaw, thats the good news. Sound? Oh God it was painfull. My a9's were always a little on the warm side - which I liked. After swiching the ics the sound was so bright I had to wear sunglasses and my ears are still bleading. Its amazing how different cables effect sound.
    panasonic th-50pz85u
    pioneer elite vsx-92txh
    pioneer elite bdp-05fd
    emotiva xpa-3
    monster power hdp 2550
    sa 8300 hd dvr
    sda 2b's
    fronts - rti a9's
    center - csi a6
    surrounds - fxi a6's
    sub - polk dsw pro 600
    harmony one
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,136
    edited August 2009
    superjunior wrote: »
    did some serious 2 channal listening today with the mit avt 3's. the new ic's cured the quirky amp problem thats been haunting me. Amp works perfect without flaw, thats the good news. Sound? Oh God it was painfull. My a9's were always a little on the warm side - which I liked. After swiching the ics the sound was so bright I had to wear sunglasses and my ears are still bleading. Its amazing how different cables effect sound.

    You have to give the AVT 3s time to burnin.
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