Dynamic Headroom question...

13»

Comments

  • tcrossma
    tcrossma Posts: 1,301
    edited June 2009
    Yeah, I don't think you have an issue with the way the audio is being processed in terms of DD/DTS, etc. I just think either there is a setting being overlooked in either the DVD or processor, or one or the other of those units doesn't have a sound that is to your liking.

    Honestly, without an extra CD/DVD player lying around, or a different receiver/processor to check out, I think you're going to have a hard time getting an answer to this one.
    Speakers: Polk LSi15
    Pre: Adcom GFP-750 with HT Bypass
    Amp: Pass Labs X-150
    CD/DVD Player: Classe CDP-10
    Interconnects: MIT Shortgun S3 Pro XLR
    Speaker cables: MIT MH-750 bi-wire
    TT:Micro Seiki DD-35
    Cartridge:Denon DL-160
    Phono Pre:PS Audio GCPH
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,665
    edited June 2009
    CWV, let me ask you this..........just trying to recap here.........are you OK with the sound of most or all music but not satisfied when it comes to HT sound via 2-channel?
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    Yeah, pretty much. The speakers sound good, they image well (given the space they have), etc. Now, I listen to mostly rock, I don't know if this has anything to do with it/
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • tcrossma
    tcrossma Posts: 1,301
    edited June 2009
    cokewithvanilla wrote: »
    Yeah, pretty much. The speakers sound good, they image well (given the space they have), etc. Now, I listen to mostly rock, I don't know if this has anything to do with it/

    Just to clarify here, I think you've said that some music CD's don't sound good too, like the 1812 Overture and several others? So it's not just movies (or more specifically things with a DD or DTS 5.1 soundtrack) right?
    Speakers: Polk LSi15
    Pre: Adcom GFP-750 with HT Bypass
    Amp: Pass Labs X-150
    CD/DVD Player: Classe CDP-10
    Interconnects: MIT Shortgun S3 Pro XLR
    Speaker cables: MIT MH-750 bi-wire
    TT:Micro Seiki DD-35
    Cartridge:Denon DL-160
    Phono Pre:PS Audio GCPH
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    I guess you could say that. All my elton john sounds muffled, so does the 1812 overture. I just wrote that off to poor recordings.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,665
    edited June 2009
    Well, I've been thinking about what has been said in this thread and to be honest, it has gotten my curiosity going as to what the issue may be. With trying to narrow down what may be going on, I'm thinking that we may need to go back to the basics as TNRabbit has suggested.

    So, if music is good and the issue is HT then we have a separate issue that may have nothing to do with dynamic headroom. Where are you located if you don't mind me asking??
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    Knoxville, TN..

    I have ruled out amplifier as well.

    I just plugged in my lsi25's subs as subs and listened to the opening scene of Star Wars Ep. II where the ship blows up... ok the ship blows up, the subs go nuts, like big noise, but the upper drivers don't sound equally big with those punchy explosion sounds...
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,665
    edited June 2009
    How old are the 25's and did you get them through a Polk authorized dealer?

    Knoxville, huh? We may have some folks there local that could help troubleshoot if we can't get it done here. Thanks.
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • tcrossma
    tcrossma Posts: 1,301
    edited June 2009
    cokewithvanilla wrote: »
    Knoxville, TN..

    I have ruled out amplifier as well.

    I just plugged in my lsi25's subs as subs and listened to the opening scene of Star Wars Ep. II where the ship blows up... ok the ship blows up, the subs go nuts, like big noise, but the upper drivers don't sound equally big with those punchy explosion sounds...

    I know this has been asked several times, but I don't recall seeing a direct answer from you: have you checked every single driver on both speakers to ensure they are working?

    Do you have any per-channel EQ enabled in your processor, such as from an auto-calibration? Have you tried re-doing the auto-calibration (assuming it has one) or turning on some sort of "pure direct" setting on your processor to see if your CD's sound better that way?
    Speakers: Polk LSi15
    Pre: Adcom GFP-750 with HT Bypass
    Amp: Pass Labs X-150
    CD/DVD Player: Classe CDP-10
    Interconnects: MIT Shortgun S3 Pro XLR
    Speaker cables: MIT MH-750 bi-wire
    TT:Micro Seiki DD-35
    Cartridge:Denon DL-160
    Phono Pre:PS Audio GCPH
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    I have no settings on that tamper with the sound. ALL drivers appear to be working properly. Yes, I did buy this from an authorized dealer, and I ordered new crossovers through polk when I asked them about the same problem. I put the new ones in, and it sounded exactly the same as the old ones. I never called polk to follow up on that problem.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,296
    edited June 2009
    cokewithvanilla wrote: »
    I guess you could say that. All my elton john sounds muffled, so does the 1812 overture. I just wrote that off to poor recordings.

    Sorry if this was answered before............what are using for a pre-amp? I have Elton's whole catalog and I wouldn't describe them as muffled. Some of his earlier recordings lack a little dynamic range.............but not "muffled".

    My guess is it's your pre-amp or a combination of pre-amp and settings.

    H9

    P.s. Very hard to diagnose in a forum :(
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    yeah, I know... its too bad because I have tried everything except a different preamp. Different sources, different amps, ive reset that preamp to defaults like 14 times... I mean, I havent tried different interconnects or speaker wire... but....
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • tcrossma
    tcrossma Posts: 1,301
    edited June 2009
    I'm not sure what else to tell you either, except that I don't think it *should* sound the way you're describing -- my 15's sound wonderful. So it seems like something is wrong somewhere, and I'm still leaning towards the DVD player or the processor.

    You mentioned earlier that you play all music from your computer. When you played the 1812, for example, did you stick that CD into your DVD player or your computer to play it?
    Speakers: Polk LSi15
    Pre: Adcom GFP-750 with HT Bypass
    Amp: Pass Labs X-150
    CD/DVD Player: Classe CDP-10
    Interconnects: MIT Shortgun S3 Pro XLR
    Speaker cables: MIT MH-750 bi-wire
    TT:Micro Seiki DD-35
    Cartridge:Denon DL-160
    Phono Pre:PS Audio GCPH
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,665
    edited June 2009
    PM sent CWV.
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    I used my computer to play it. I have 2 soundcards... I can see what happens with the other one. I do know that I am not getting bitperfect audio from my computer. I don't have ANY cd's at all... everything I have is stored on my computer, i dont even own a cd player.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • tcrossma
    tcrossma Posts: 1,301
    edited June 2009
    Throw it in the DVD player and see how it sounds.

    edit: oh, sorry, in the prior posts you mentioned the 1812 Overture CD, so I assumed we were talking about CD's here. If you're talking about streaming audio from your computer I think we're opening another can of worms here. However, if both audio streamed from your computer (in what format, btw?) AND movies on DVD sound roughly the same, then *maybe* we can rule out the source being the issue. But I'm not a big fan of using a computer as a basic for testing sound quality, since a lot more variable come into play.
    Speakers: Polk LSi15
    Pre: Adcom GFP-750 with HT Bypass
    Amp: Pass Labs X-150
    CD/DVD Player: Classe CDP-10
    Interconnects: MIT Shortgun S3 Pro XLR
    Speaker cables: MIT MH-750 bi-wire
    TT:Micro Seiki DD-35
    Cartridge:Denon DL-160
    Phono Pre:PS Audio GCPH
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,665
    edited June 2009
    How exactly do you have the LSi25's hooked up?
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    I cant find any cd's so I'm going to use the DTS version.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,665
    edited June 2009
    Also, where are your volume settings and frequency settings on the LSi's?
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    right now, they are hooked up with the woofers as subs... a second ago, they were hooked up with the jumpers. In movies they sound better as subs, in music they are better with jumpers unless you really want the bass to stand out.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    when i have them plugged in with jumpers, i set the crossovers at 60hz, volume between half and a quarter. As subs, they are set at 60hz in the preamp. I like the sound better crossed over at 60 than 80
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,296
    edited June 2009
    cokewithvanilla wrote: »
    I used my computer to play it. I have 2 soundcards... I can see what happens with the other one. I do know that I am not getting bitperfect audio from my computer. I don't have ANY cd's at all... everything I have is stored on my computer, i dont even own a cd player.

    Well this is probably the issue or part of it anyway. Add that to a less than musical pre-amp and it will describe what you are experiencing in many cases.

    Are you using the digital out into a dac? If you are using the analog out....BINGO there's your problem.....with music anyway.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    I always use digital out
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    ugh. My cd burner won't work. I think im blaming it on Windows 7 right now. However, I found a cd in my car... Weezer Make Believe.

    I am listening to it with the subs off.

    I tried it with dvd player, with computer, and from the version that I ripped to the computer.

    There is no real difference, nothing that stands out like I should be listening to it from that source.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited June 2009
    I'd hate to have to hook up the c and fx's... i have no place for them
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter