Tube Pre's are bandaids.

heiney9

ben62670 wrote: »

Well I just got off the phone. I have been holding back on the name of the pre that I have here for a reason. I can not disclose the name of this pre. I will however share what tubes can do. The other Pre I have grown to love is George's Belles 20. I have my daughter with me today. So chasing a 3 year old is very distracting. I will say that these two Pre's are like MIT shotgun's. They might not be perfect for every system, but they will be very sweet in most.

Well the not disclosing part is suspicious, but chasing a 3 year old around will wear you out. If you have time today please expound, remember we like details; ie the type of design of said tube pre, the tubes used, etc, etc....

H9

ben62670

heiney9 wrote: »

Well the not disclosing part is suspicous, but chasing a 3 year old around will wear you out. If you have time today please expound, remember we like details; ie the type of design of said tube pre, the tubes used, etc, etc....

H9

Yes sir. I will try to get some time. I do not see it happening till after she goes to bed. This may be near 9pm.

reeltrouble1

you saying you did not drink a beer last night Ben???? thats even worse if you wrote that title sober

here's something for you, my family calls me Teddy and you are not my family.....

The title of this thread is inane as in without sense or subject, if you cannot write then I would suggest some schooling for you, first LSI's suck, then Tube pre's are bandaid's, honestly ben, your harmless enough but some of these things you come up with as serious posts need to be in the Sunday Comics...Since you admit you cannot write, Can you Draw???

RT1

dorokusai

May I call you lover Ted?

reeltrouble1

it would top what you said after the last time............

RT1

nspindel

ben62670 wrote: »

Even though I have sub par equipment in the eyes of a few members here the tubes are doing some magic that I thought was imposable.

So I'm confused about the title of your OP. Are you saying that tubes are one good way of band-aiding an otherwise inferior system? i.e. paying tubes a compliment?

I perceived it more as meaning that best case scenario, tubes are some sort of band-aid, meaning that you were discrediting them. But from your above quote it would seem that you're a proponent.

concealer404

nspindel wrote: »

So I'm confused about the title of your OP. Are you saying that tubes are one good way of band-aiding an otherwise inferior system? i.e. paying tubes a compliment?

I perceived it more as meaning that best case scenario, tubes are some sort of band-aid, meaning that you were discrediting them. But from your above quote it would seem that you're a proponent.

From reading the rest of the thread, it seems that he's paying them a compliment. At least that's what i got out of it.

Nobody else seems to be catching that same meaning from his other posts, so i might be the one off base here....

amulford

reeltrouble1 wrote: »

it would top what you said after the last time............

RT1

Hwon Hung Lo???


Out with it, Ben. WTF are you talking about. Band aid, huh? I gotta hear this ****...

ben62670

nspindel wrote: »

So I'm confused about the title of your OP. Are you saying that tubes are one good way of band-aiding an otherwise inferior system? i.e. paying tubes a compliment?

I perceived it more as meaning that best case scenario, tubes are some sort of band-aid, meaning that you were discrediting them. But from your above quote it would seem that you're a proponent.

concealer404 wrote: »

From reading the rest of the thread, it seems that he's paying them a compliment. At least that's what i got out of it.

Nobody else seems to be catching that same meaning from his other posts, so i might be the one off base here....

Thank you guys. F1 caught it right of the bat. I had to sell my Adcom GFA-585, and now I am stuck using an old Yami M-80 amp on my tweeters, and a GFA-545 on my mids. The tweeters I have are great for there price, but nothing that wows you. The baid-aid effect I speak of is the healing power of band-aids. The term band-aiding something is a bad thing, but band-aids are a good thing;) What I have seen this Pre do on 3 totally different systems has blown my mind. There is no mushy bass. The mids and highs are not smeared. Bad recordings on good SS gear can sound much worse. I have not thrown any real bad recordings in yet, but that will come. Sound stage is to die for. Also please keep in mind that this thing is brand new. It has less than 30hrs on it. I have heard tube gear that has sounded like cheap distorted SS gear cranked to high, I have heard it sound mushy, I have heard it sound narrow. I have heard some tube stuff sound good in one system, but not another. I have always thought it was stupid to finance gear, but a real solid tube pre is one piece of gear I would finance if I could. As for it being suspicious why I can't post what it is do not read to much into. It is nothing bad. I had to fix something very minor, this particular piece may not even be available yet, and the person that I received the piece from requested that I not name the gear. BTW my friend Jerry should be getting the Belles 21A this Wednessday:) Georges Belles 20 is real close to this piece of gear. I think the winner would be system dependant.

engtaz

Tube pre is a band-aid until you match to a tube amp. Tube pre to ss is a type of band-aid. JMO

Hawkeye

engtaz wrote: »

Tube pre is a band-aid until you match to a tube amp. Tube pre to ss is a type of band-aid. JMO

I disagree. I had both tube and ss pre in the house at the same time and the tube pre IMO was more desireable. While we can go back and forth, I certainly don't see a tube pre as a band-aid but a cure

Gordon

nspindel

Hawkeye wrote: »

I disagree. I had both tube and ss pre in the house at the same time and the tube pre IMO was more desireable. While we can go back and forth, I certainly don't see a tube pre as a band-aid but a cure

Gordon

I agree with the satisfaction of the tube pre, my problem is the whole "band aid" and "cure" thing. That casts the assumption that there's a problem. I like what tubes do for me, but there's nothing "wrong" with my solid state equipment.

ben62670

Thanks guys this is what I was shooting for. Some sharing among people who have tried. Too many people will buy a piece of gear based on reviews, and give props or dis that piece of gear based on one system made up of certain components.
When I said tube pre's are like a band-aid I meant very nice things. Band-aiding things is used as a derogatory comment by many, but the tube Pre here has healed(fixed) many short comings and annoyances. I finally had a chance to listen to some old Steve Miller that was recorded badly. The tube pre improved it where an SS would have magnified the flaws. I have until recently thought(from my listening experience) that tube gear was great on some music, but just couldn't cut the mustard like SS with some other types of music. This and the Belles have made me re think tube gear. Like I said this is the very first piece of gear that I would ever consider financing. It's not going to happen, but I feel very strongly about this. Pre's to me are like IC's. The first piece in the path is more important the the second. This is a pre vs amp/ IC vs speaker cable statement.

nspindel wrote: »

I agree with the satisfaction of the tube pre, my problem is the whole "band aid" and "cure" thing. That casts the assumption that there's a problem. I like what tubes do for me, but there's nothing "wrong" with my solid state equipment.

You still aren't getting it. There are so many variables in an audio system. There is always a problem. You can have a near perfect system(not me) with a certain set of Cd's(or vinyl), and throw something else in and it sounds like crap. Again Band-aids fix/heal things. Nobody has a perfect do all system, but for the first time in my audio journey have have been to the mountains. I have seen the light. I have been chasing my tail with different gear for a long time. Different systems for a long time. I have been driving my friends nuts for a long time! I want to get a good solid tube pre in the mix!

ben62670

Kex wrote: »

Ouch! Ben, nobody calls me Teddy at all, but if you're feeling stung, you can just call me Teddy instead, if you like!

Thanks for the offer, but I have a Teddy bear I named RT1 that I cuddle with. I dress it up with special chaps, and put a chip-n-dales bow on it. It has a tube drive voice. When you push the button it says "I love Ben and Adcoms". He could really using a cleaning, but I am scared to ruin the tube. You know how it is with your favorite Teddy. Especially this one with its warm tube. By the end of the evening they always seem to end up in the no touch zone.
Back to tubes/gear.
Tubes sure can rule!
Thanks again
Ben

concealer404

ben62670 wrote: »

Thanks for the offer, but I have a Teddy bear I named RT1 that I cuddle with. I dress it up with special chaps, and put a chip-n-dales bow on it. It has a tube drive voice. When you push the button it says "I love Ben and Adcoms". He could really using a cleaning, but I am scared to ruin the tube. You know how it is with your favorite Teddy. Especially this one with its warm tube. By the end of the evening they always seem to end up in the no touch zone.
Back to tubes/gear.
Tubes sure can rule!
Thanks again
Ben

Mmmm..... Adcoms....

Ben, how detrimental to my wallet is it really going to be to try a tube pre? My main complaint with the actual sound/timbre what have you with my system is that it really makes bad recordings sound even worse. Other than that, and issues with the analogue outputs on my cdp sounding like crap, i don't particularly want to alter the sound. It's already plenty warm and smooth for me.

Should i try this? Or continue on with ignorance being bliss?

I'm worried that a tube pre is going to make it TOO warm. It was already night and day going from an Adcom pre and power, to the Adcom pre and the Onkyo power.

Ricardo

ben62670 wrote: »

I have a real expensive one in my house. I only have it for a very short time, but I will elaborate on my statement later. All I have to say is between local Polkies(great friends) I have been able to listen to much gear on a lot of different gear. There are a few that really need to get on the ball and spend a little time. We don't need to make a big thing out of it. We have a lot of fun when it is only two or three of us.
Ben

You know, my English is not perfect. Can someone translate this for me?

Damn Ben, and you were not drunk when you wrote this?

ben62670

Ricardo wrote: »

You know, my English is not perfect. Can someone translate this for me?

Damn Ben, and you were not drunk when you wrote this?

Thanks Ricardo. Yes my writing sucks. Yes I have been very tired lately(health issues). Yes I have mild dyslexia. So thanks much. I kinda summed it up here in the beginning of this post.
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1087005&postcount=6

concealer404 wrote: »

Mmmm..... Adcoms....

Ben, how detrimental to my wallet is it really going to be to try a tube pre? My main complaint with the actual sound/timbre what have you with my system is that it really makes bad recordings sound even worse. Other than that, and issues with the analogue outputs on my cdp sounding like crap, i don't particularly want to alter the sound. It's already plenty warm and smooth for me.

Should i try this? Or continue on with ignorance being bliss?

I'm worried that a tube pre is going to make it TOO warm. It was already night and day going from an Adcom pre and power, to the Adcom pre and the Onkyo power.

I think that warm, mushy, distorted sound is a major misconception. I have heard some tube gear sound very sterile and SS like. Ideally you can find someone local that will let you try something. Down in FLA I did not have that option. From what I have heard it starts around $1000 to get something real nice. These guys know much more than what I know. Hopefully they will chime in with real suggestions on which way to head, and not just give you a $10,000 shopping list.

NJPOLKER

Ben,
I understand where your coming from and yes I have been drinking, its almost 3pm.
Since I have time on my hands I've been changing out some of my equipment and am really surprised at what I am hearing. Example; my little ole Cambridge Audio A500 integrated amp sounds better than my Carver M-1.5t amp and Anthem pre-amp combo.

Oh yeah, Your writing is far better than a lot of the folks around here.

reeltrouble1

ben62670 wrote: »

Thank you guys. F1 caught it right of the bat.

Really?? Just spoke with him, he says what he caught is that your thread is stupid.

No need to worry about me pissing up things, hell, you've pee'd down your leg so bad your shoes are full and your socks are soaked.

RT1

Ricardo

NJPOLKER wrote: »

Ben,
yes I have been drinking, its almost 3pm......and am really surprised at what I am hearing.

Not surprised

my little ole Cambridge Audio A500 integrated amp sounds better than my Carver M-1.5t amp and Anthem pre-amp combo.

If you continue drinking, your alarm radio will sound even better.

NJPOLKER

Ricardo wrote: »

Not surprised


If you continue drinking, your alarm radio will sound even better.

Those are beautiful replies and I love them but I stand by what I said.

ben62670

reeltrouble1 wrote: »

Really?? Just spoke with him, he says what he caught is that your thread is stupid.

No need to worry about me pissing up things, hell, you've pee'd down your leg so bad your shoes are full and your socks are soaked.

RT1

Teddy the troll. What I would like is to have a thread where we share, but you will make it your duty to sit here and troll this to death.
Thanks Teddy.
Can we get back to tubes/gear?

ben62670

Well that just put a huge grin on my face. My 3 yo daughter was listening to too much rope by Roger Waters. In the beginning the guy is busting rocks with a sledge. It was very very dynamic. When the horses were coming into the room it was different than any other time. Before I have heard the horses crossing the room, but this time is was room filling live sounding. JJ jumped off the couch ran and looked behind the speakers, out the windows, and turned and looked at me like what the heck was that. She has heard that song many times before. She knows where the sweet spot is and plants herself right there:) Best presentation on any gear that I have heard yet. I haven't heard in in the room room filling sound like that since George had his gear here that unforgettable time.

engtaz

I have used a Tube pre to SS and it did not sound as good as tube tube.

madmax

Ben, if you have taken up drinking please put the bottle down, slowly and carefully back away from the equipment and whatever you do don't pee on the tubes...
madmax

Systems

dorokusai wrote: »

I've heard magic for 100 bucks.

Thats about what it cost me to build my Pass BOZ pre.

ben62670

madmax wrote: »

Ben, if you have taken up drinking please put the bottle down, slowly and carefully back away from the equipment and whatever you do don't pee on the tubes...
madmax

Not the issue. If you have ever noticed my posting history you will see that I post at all hours. I can not sleep for more than 2 hrs at a time. My health has lately gone down hill real fast. I am finally getting in to see the doctors. They drew 6 tubes of blood from me the other day, and are trying to get me into a treatment center asap(out patient). Raising two little girls, crazy X wife, nearly no income has been adding to the anxiety which is partly due to the physical issues I have. No sleep adds to it. It used to be every third day I would feel pretty good. I would go to the point of exhaustion, and be able to sleep some. Now the Girls are out of school so those after the girls are taken to school naps are gone. Never mind all the back and neck issues. When I don't have the girls for a few days I do drink some beers sometimes, but time to myself is not very often. Thanks for the advice about not peeing on high voltage electronics. Not that I would do it anyway;) I am liking the tubes lately:)
Take care Chuck.
Ben

ESavinon

ben62670 wrote: »

Well that just put a huge grin on my face. My 3 yo daughter was listening to too much rope by Roger Waters. In the beginning the guy is busting rocks with a sledge. It was very very dynamic. When the horses were coming into the room it was different than any other time. Before I have heard the horses crossing the room, but this time is was room filling live sounding. JJ jumped off the couch ran and looked behind the speakers, out the windows, and turned and looked at me like what the heck was that. She has heard that song many times before. She knows where the sweet spot is and plants herself right there:) Best presentation on any gear that I have heard yet. I haven't heard in in the room room filling sound like that since George had his gear here that unforgettable time.

I wish i could get my kids to sit with me a while and listen to music.
If it doesn't involve video, They're not interested.

polkie4life

ESavinon wrote: »

I wish i could get my kids to sit with me a while and listen to music.
If it doesn't involve video, They're not interested.

No you don't Ed! They will cease control of whats being played... mine are loving the mama mia soundtrack at present. :eek:

Truly though i really enjoy the sessions where we just sit and enjoy music together. One of my fondest memories was when my 11yr old daughter commented that every time Angel by Sarah M played she wanted to cry.

reeltrouble1

ben62670 wrote: »

Not the issue. If you have ever noticed my posting history you will see that I post at all hours. I can not sleep for more than 2 hrs at a time. My health has lately gone down hill real fast. I am finally getting in to see the doctors. They drew 6 tubes of blood from me the other day, and are trying to get me into a treatment center asap(out patient). Raising two little girls, crazy X wife, nearly no income has been adding to the anxiety which is partly due to the physical issues I have. No sleep adds to it. It used to be every third day I would feel pretty good. I would go to the point of exhaustion, and be able to sleep some. Now the Girls are out of school so those after the girls are taken to school naps are gone. Never mind all the back and neck issues. When I don't have the girls for a few days I do drink some beers sometimes, but time to myself is not very often. Thanks for the advice about not peeing on high voltage electronics. Not that I would do it anyway;) I am liking the tubes lately:)
Take care Chuck.
Ben

So not since Saint Faster have we had such sad tales. So comes Saint Ben the victim, broke, beat down, but so brave. Well the fact is you do need help and need to check in, that is for sure and I do have empathy for your little girls as they have no choice. But so much the victim ben, you know you have a problem, you know your past history is not stellar and never mind the cover story.

You want to play hard ball ben, thats fine, but first go check in, broke??? You just posted about your vacation to Orlando???? Broke??? Why are you spending money on a hobby. You need to get your priorities straight ben, get your life squared away, then come back and you and me will play when its more of fair.

If not you can continue playing the victim, be the Saint, heck put a statue up in front of the place of ben, give the pidgeon's a place to land and do their business. You see that tag ben??? You would be suprised if you knew who put it their, you can wallow in the pity some members feel for you but its pity it wont change a thing for you or you can stand up and do what you need to do.

That's it, I am out.

RT1