Bada HD-22SE CD player

Norm Apter

Although there are already a number of Polkies who own and use the Bada HD22SE (several of them are responsible for me stumbling across this unit), I thought I’d share my listening experience after one week of use. For those who aren’t familiar with the player, it is made in China and distributed solely (to the best of my knowledge) though Pacific Valve & Electric Company. It currently retails for $599 and comes with a one-year service warranty through Pacific Valve.

Personal History and Associated Gear

I joined this board just over a year ago, not long after purchasing a pair of LSi9s. Since joining, everything other than the speakers has been replaced (some items multiple times). As an aside, I recall one incident last May in which I queried TroyD about the relative merits of upgrading to a better pre vs. amp (I ended up doing both); Troy remarked that while doing both was crucial, perhaps the source was really the most important piece in the rig. Having just purchased a Marantz CD-5001 about 6 weeks earlier, I found that difficult to digest at the time. Of course Troy was right, but nevertheless I decided that I would try to work on everything else before reentering the market for a CD player. Hence, this move (from Marantz CD-5001 to the Bada) was a mighty big jump and that might explain why some of the language below may seem a bit hyperbolic.

Here is the gear that is being used in tandem with the Bada HD-22SE:

Parasound Halo A23 Amplifier
Parasound Halo P3 Pre-amplifier
LSi9 Loudspeakers
MIT Shotgun S-3 Interconnects (CDP to pre and pre to amp)
Signal Cable Ultra Speaker Cables
IeGO 70530 Power Cords (for amp, pre and CDP)…These just arrived today from Taiwan.

Basics, Functions and Accessories

Upon arrival, the Bada strikes one as particularly attractive, heavy, and well built. The casing is very solid with a very nice brushed steel surface that matches quite nicely with the Parasound gear aesthetically. The layout of buttons on the faceplate is simple: 6 buttons for the most basic functions. The display may be a bit too simple for my taste. When a CD is loaded, it lists the total number of tracks and total time. When playing a CD, however, only the current track number and time (expired/remaining) are displayed (my old CD player lists both current track and total tracks simultaneously which I preferred). Just a minor quip. Erndog has noted elsewhere that there is no shuffle function. I tend not to use that, but some folks might find that to be a detriment.

As noted in other threads, this CDP uses a single tube (though both tube and SS outputs are available). Mine came with a stock Chinese tube which everyone suggests replacing. I went with the GE 5670 ($10), as suggested by the folks here and on the demo video at Pacific Valve. It took me a few days to find the correct tool (it requires a right-sized star wrench), but once I did it was very easy to change. I noticed a marked improvement in sound with GE 5670 over the stock one, as expected.

The remote is fantastic. Heavy with a solid silver metal casing like the player (I’ve never had a non-plastic remote before, so this is certainly a step up for me). It is long and thin and easy to handle. My only substantial quip with the remote (and the whole package in general) is that the remote does not have an on-off option. Yes, I’m lazy, but it’s nice to be able to turn everything off from afar…perhaps I’m spoiled by previous players.

Sound

For these ears (stepping up from the Marantz), the Bada is nothing short of phenomenal. I’m not an audiophile. I doubt I ever will be. I just don’t know that much about sound and I certainly don’t know all of the nomenclature to describe the nuances of sound. I love music and this CDP has brought a level of enjoyment to music listening that each of the various other upgrades I made did not. They might improve this or that aspect of sound, but the Bada has made recordings enjoyable and life-like on a level that these ears did not know was possible (though of course all of the parts work in tandem so I would by no means disparage the relative contributions of those other upgrades to the final product/sound).

I’ve especially enjoyed going back to the late Elliot Smith’s Figure 8 (2000), because I am very familiar with that CD, because its recorded and mixed particularly well, and because it features a plethora of instruments. I have this benchmark in mind of how it has sounded since I purchased it 9 years ago. Any changes/enhancements are particularly apparent.

First, I suppose the best way to describe the music that the Bada reproduces is rich, full-bodied and deep in tones (maybe this is the tube at work – I have never heard a tube before so it’s hard for me to know if this is just characteristic of tubes in general). These rich tones make it seem as if we are approaching a live /amp-ed experience. When I close my eyes, I can almost envisage his fingers rolling over the piano keys. Even the singer’s voice makes him seem more human (bringing out even feelings of vulnerability, for instance, in songs geared as such) and not as a bunch of digital bits, on a level previously not experienced by me outside of actual live performances. I suppose voices and strings in particular just seem to resonate and hang in the air in ways they didn't before.

Second, there is a greater tendency for all instruments to come forth together yet separately. When listening to a certain track in the past perhaps the lead vocal and the guitar might take “center stage” with most other instruments receding in the background. Now that second electric guitar, the guy walking the bass, the percussion, and the backing vocals are all on full display in unison, though again clearly distinct. Yeah, they’ve always been there, but it’s almost as if they were simply accompaniments before, playing a side role. Thus I guess this goes along with the point above about a fuller musical presentation.

Finally, there is also nice detail brought out...yet not in an overly precise/analytical sort-of-way. In particular, I’ve picked up the squeaking of fingers sliding along guitar strings that once again almost brings out a live-like performance…or much closer than anything I’ve previously experienced.

Perhaps I’ll sum up with a quote from Brad Mitchell’s Affordable Audio review of this unit's predecessor, the Bada HD-22 (Nov. 2006). This is what I’ve been trying to get at and he puts it better and more succinctly than I have: “The Bada simply delivered more music, and it was teeming with the level of excitement of a live performance”

That just about says it all.

Norm

P.S. Some images of the outside of the unit can be found in another thread (Bada..come to papa), but here are a few shots I took of the insides and the remote. The single tube is located in the upper right corner.

Ern Dog

Nice review Norm.

Now, Kick back and enjoy the tunes!

danger boy

nice review.. enjoy your Bada.

this is the only CD player on my list of next purchases.

Early B.

Excellent review!! And yes, you're an audiophile.

NJPOLKER

Thanks for a great review and taking the time to put it together. And yeah you are audiophile.
You may want to replace those two caps which look like Solens. Maybe one of the other owners will chime in on that. I do know when I replaced the Solens in my pre-amp with Dynamicaps there was a huge improvement in sound quality.

heiney9

Great review Norm!! Daboyz has one as well (as you know) and he brought to our last RAS meeting and I was impressed with this unit. It seems to be priced right as it performs and is built to a higher standard than it's price would suggest.

Sit back and enjoy your system, you've accomplished a lot in a short period of time. You should be proud and set for fine tunes for a long time.

H9

tonyb

Congrats,and stay away from the Bada upgrade threads,you may blow the nestegg.

Early B.

NJPOLKER wrote: »

You may want to replace those two caps which look like Solens. Maybe one of the other owners will chime in on that. I do know when I replaced the Solens in my pre-amp with Dynamicaps there was a huge improvement in sound quality.

There are three Solen caps. And yes, someday you should consider trading them out for Sonicaps. Huge difference.

Early B.

tonyb wrote: »

Congrats,and stay away from the Bada upgrade threads,you may blow the nestegg.

Aaahhh, he's just getting started.

In fact, I'm gonna try to convince Norm to upgrade the rest of his gear now that he has a superior source.;)

heiney9

Well, I think what he has now is pretty damn nice and he'd have to spend a lot more to get an improvement. Enjoy what you have for awhile and avoid chasing your tail. .

I could suggest improvements as well but his wallet would be non-existent then.

NJPOLKER

Early B. wrote: »

There are three Solen caps. And yes, someday you should consider trading them out for Sonicaps. Huge difference.

I would have used the Mundorf Silver/Oils's but could not get them in 2uF for a few months. The Dynamicaps are about burned in now and sounding real nice. My thinking on the Dynamicaps was they will be warmer than the Sonicaps. They are a night and day difference then the Solens and for about $50. for the pair I couldn't go wrong.

Conradicles

Very nice info. Good job Norm and congrats.

Norm Apter

heiney9 wrote: »

Enjoy what you have for awhile and avoid chasing your tail. .

I could suggest improvements as well but his wallet would be non-existent then.

Precisely. I plan to enjoy this set-up for a while...at least 6-9 months before the next round of upgrades. I think its nice to take things relatively slowly because then you can really appreciate each of the successive stages.

Well, that and the fact that all of my "discretionary funds" for audio stuff is exhausted for the time being, especially after dropping $240 on those three IeGo power cords this week. (BTW, thanks for pointing me in the right direction, EarlyB... I placed my order on late afternoon Monday and they arrived (from Taiwan) on Friday. Incredible. I first just swapped out the CDP stock cord with noticeable improvement in resolution... it took like 3 seconds literally. Then the pre and amp and could immediately hear a second set of improvements...money well spent).

Anyway, though it will be quite some time before I actually make additional upgrade(s), I always like to have a set of possibilities in mind as I move forward. Up until I read some of your responses about replacing caps, I had thought that speaker cables would be the next logical upgrade. The SC Ultras are a damn good value, but I'm wondering now what some better speaker cables might yield.

So, I am wondering what you guys think about moving up the chain in speaker cables vs. the CDP internal changes (i.e. replacing caps). Is there a particular order to move in that would be more desirable? Any and all thoughts are welcome. Again, just spitballin and brainstorming here...it won't be some time until I actually act, after further deliberation.

Second (fully exposing my ignorance here), would replacing caps essentially entail taking the unit to trusted hi-fi store to perform such a mod (assuming I have no soldering skills or the like)? I probably wouldn't trust myself unless it was a pretty simple job. I'm about the least handy guy you'll ever meet! Well hopefully not the least, but you get my point.

organ

Congrats man. That is an amazing cdp. The speed and dynamics is also incredible.

Early B.

Norm Apter wrote: »

Up until I read some of your responses about replacing caps, I had thought that speaker cables would be the next logical upgrade. The SC Ultras are a damn good value, but I'm wondering now what some better speaker cables might yield.

So, I am wondering what you guys think about moving up the chain in speaker cables vs. the CDP internal changes (i.e. replacing caps). Is there a particular order to move in that would be more desirable? Any and all thoughts are welcome.

Second, would replacing caps essentially entail taking the unit to trusted hi-fi store to perform such a mod (assuming I have no soldering skills or the like)?

Do the speaker cables first. Regarding the SC Ultras -- there's better stuff out there in the same price range. I use MAC cables. This is a fantastic deal: http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?cablspkr&1246302025&/MAC-CU-

The cap upgrade requires a technician because the board will need to be removed. If you have a friend who is skilled with electronics and will do it for a cold bottle of beer, go for it now, but if you have to pay $100 for a technician to do it, this tweak can wait. Even if you have to pay a tech, it's well worth the expense, IMO.

ben62670

Congrats Norm. Thanks for the write up.
Ben

engtaz

Nice review. Congrats on the new gear.

heiney9

A good used budget cable of which are easy to find are the MIT Terminator 2's. Try to get the later versions with the Iconn ends. Iconn ends allow you to interchange the end very easily.

Second choice would be the Signals Cables, you've already heard the difference with MIT and that's where I'd go. Are you the MIT cable swap list? If not perhaps get your name on it and you can demo a pair.

heiney9

Norm Apter wrote: »

Second (fully exposing my ignorance here), would replacing caps essentially entail taking the unit to trusted hi-fi store to perform such a mod (assuming I have no soldering skills or the like)? I probably wouldn't trust myself unless it was a pretty simple job. I'm about the least handy guy you'll ever meet! Well hopefully not the least, but you get my point.

Most on here DIY it because having a shop do it probably atleast doubles or triples the cost. At this point it can't be done unless you want to void your warranty.

For a point of reference I had 2 small caps replaced in my pre-amp because it was getting noisy. The labor was $80 at the hifi shop. For the Bada and the amount of caps in question think atleast double that.

Ern Dog

Norm- If you haven't do so already, check out the Reference Recordings label for some new cd's. 90% of them are HDCD which will reveal the maximum benefits of your new Bada.

daboyz

Norm,excellent write up. Couldn't have said it better myself. I was thinking of upgrading the caps too but H9 brought up the fact of waiting for the warranty period to lapse before playing around with it.

I would second the T2's as H9 also said. They will definitely open up your soundstage and bring the perfomance up a couple notches. For the price they're a no brainer.

Norm Apter

Early B. wrote: »

The cap upgrade requires a technician because the board will need to be removed. If you have a friend who is skilled with electronics and will do it for a cold bottle of beer, go for it now, but if you have to pay $100 for a technician to do it, this tweak can wait. Even if you have to pay a tech, it's well worth the expense, IMO.

So perhaps I will look toward the speaker cable upgrade first -- maybe 6-9 months down the line depending on which cable I decide on and its cost. As daboyz and others noted, that way I can wait until the warranty period of the unit has expired to tackle the mod (at least one year from purchase date).

So for budgetary planning purposes, would parts (3 Sonicaps, right?) and labor run me somewhere in the ballpark vicinity of $200 for the CDP mod? More? less? I'd like to get an general idea so that I can plan ahead.

Norm Apter

Ern Dog wrote: »

Norm- If you haven't do so already, check out the Reference Recordings label for some new cd's. 90% of them are HDCD which will reveal the maximum benefits of your new Bada.

Will do that. Thanks for the suggestions....I was wondering about HDCDs as it doesn't appear that I own any.

fredv

A word of caution about modifying the cdp, you effectively give Pacific Valve the excuse not to honor the warranty if anything (not related to the mod) goes wrong. I recommend you to wait a little.

You can also try the Russian 6N3P-EV. They are pretty nice and cheap. One potential caveat, they are taller than the 5670. They are about the size of a 12AU7.

Early B.

Norm Apter wrote: »

So for budgetary planning purposes, would parts (3 Sonicaps, right?) and labor run me somewhere in the ballpark vicinity of $200 for the CDP mod? More? less? I'd like to get an general idea so that I can plan ahead.

Budget $150.

Open her up and check the cap value(s), then research the cost of the caps.

danger boy

hey have you tried the solid state outputs? does it sound similar or quite a bit different then the tube output?

nice detailed review.

Norm Apter

danger boy wrote: »

hey have you tried the solid state outputs? does it sound similar or quite a bit different then the tube output?

Yes, this is kind of a complicated matter and daboyz and H9 and others have weighed in on this matter after the RAS met and listened to the Bada. If I am not mistaken, they didn't detect any difference between the outputs (but they should feel free chime in, especially if I have misrepresented their impressions).

Well, not meaning to challenge there findings, I have a slightly different experience. I just threw in the digital remaster of Micheal Jackson's Off the Wall in for a comparision (as Nickolas has noted elsewhere, the sq of this disc is excellent) between SS outputs and tube output with GE 5670. Now, I did detect a improvement with the GE 5670 over the SS output. I wouldn't qualify it as vastly improved but at least with my selection from this CD it was there. For example, switching over from the stock Chinese tube to the GE 5670 yielded more noticeable improvements as did switching out the stock power cords for the IeGos PCs last week. In the case of those two moves, the improvement hit one (i.e. me) over the head in less than 3 seconds of play time. When comparing the GE 5670 tube output to the SS output, it was only after listening for several moments that I felt that the tube output had a bit higher resolution.

Its hard to know how noticeable this difference would be with other recordings. I think it would take a lot more comparison (esp. with CDs that are not produced quite as well) to reach more valid conclusions.

Systems

Nice review of what appears to be a great little CDP for the money.
It may be different with this model but IIRC in the predessor to this unit the tube was configured as a follower(buffer) at the output of the SS stage,so the IC op-amp used in the SS analog section was always in the signal path.

Early B.

GV#27 wrote: »

It may be different with this model but IIRC in the predessor to this unit the tube was configured as a follower(buffer) at the output of the SS stage,so the IC op-amp used in the SS analog section was always in the signal path.

Aha. That would certainly explain the similarities in sound between tube and SS. It also suggests that the SS output on the Bada is damn good. So even if you're not into tube gear, it's a great CDP to consider.

heiney9

I have to tell you that I think GV is on the money. We all listened to this unit many times forgetting which input was what and using a remote I personally switched between the two inputs and didn't hear one bit of difference. Usually I am pretty sensitive to that. None of us (6 people) heard a difference. It was a little later in the day so maybe we were a tad fatigued, etc. We were switching between it and the Monarchy tube DAC before that and heard some subtle differences; mostly staging and a bit airier vocals, etc.

I'm not totally a tube head (yet ) but the sound was more reminiscent of SS than tubes............but it really doesn't matter because it sounded damn good for $599. The Monarchy which edged it out is a $1500 tube DAC.

Systems

Early B. wrote: »

It also suggests that the SS output on the Bada is damn good.

I believe it's either the BB OPA 2604 or OPA2134,both decent op amps.However if by chance the chip was socketed ,it would allow for the swapping of different op-amps as easily swapping tubes.