Should I shift from 7.1 to 5.1 and send more power to fronts?

Hoopnoop

I have a couple of newbie questions regarding my system set-up. My current system is this:

Onkyo SR605 Receiver
Polk PSW505 Sub
Polk RTI10s Front
Polk CSI5 Center
Polk R15 X 4 Rear Surrounds

My room is about 20 X 20

I have two questions:

1. I am currently running a 7.1 system but don't notice much of a difference between 7.1 and 5.1. Also, my placement of my back speakers have to be in the back anyway (can't put any to the side). Would it make sense to just use two surrounds and go to 5.1 so as to free up power receiver power to the other speakers (particularly the RTI10s)? This would also allow me to bi-wire my two fronts.

2. Would my system benefit much from upgrading the rear surrounds to the matching surrounds which are FXi5s? I am on a tight budget and only plan to upgrade the surrounds if it will make a big difference.

Thanks in advance for any replies!

Toolfan66

I say buy the Onkyo TX-SR805 thats in the flee market here, and buy a 3 channel amp to power the front stage of your setup.

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81014

here is the link for the receiver. this receiver plus an Emotiva XPA-3 for about $1000 you will be loving those RTi 10's. this of course is if this would be in your budget.

I really don't think you will see a big change if you go with the FXi5"s, I say save up your money buy a receiver with preouts, and put in a amp to power the front stage. there is where you will see a big change. then look into the FXi5's later on.

comfortablycurt

Well, that bi-wiring feature isn't actually going to send any more power to your fronts. The power for both the front channels and the surround back channels is all coming from the same power block, so it's not as if it's going to double it's power output because it's connected to two pairs of inputs. The theory behind it is that by sending a separate signal to the woofers and the mid/tweeter, you're going to have a cleaner sound because of the separated signals. Most people that have tried bi-wiring with their AVR's reported absolutely no improvements. Some people have reported some small improvements though.

Give it a shot and see if you like it though.

If you don't have the room to properly set up a 7.1 system, which it sounds like you don't, you're really going to get better sound with 5.1. I'd say lose the surround backs. Even if you don't notice any improvements with the bi-wiring method, it's still going to take a little bit of the strain of the power amp and allow all of the speakers to be driven with a slight bit more power.

I'd say you'd also see a big improvement by switching the surrounds to a pair of FXi5's. The R15's are one of Polk's entry level speakers, where as the RTi series is more like the upper middle range. The FXi's are timbre matched to your RTi10's and the CSi5, so that would probably be your best bet.

wutadumsn23

I wouldn't bother trying to shift things around going from a 7.1 to a 5.1 as far as freeing up power to your other speakers. The only issue I would see is that a correctly placed 5.1 will sound better than a cramped 7.1 anyday IMO. Also removing the wiring to your back two speakers and bi-wiring your fronts will not make much of a noticable difference, since the receiver only sends out a set amount of power to the speakers anyway, you will not gain much, nevermind double the amount of power going to your fronts from bi-amping. IMO, bi-amping isn't worth the cost of the extra speaker wire. If you really want to gain better sound from your setup, then I would second TOOL's suggestion to upgrade your AVR, and maybe add an external amp. Give us a budget and lets see what we can figure out for you.

wutadumsn23

Damn you Curt!!!! I need to learn to type faster, lol.

nooshinjohn

wutadumsn23 wrote: »

Damn you Curt!!!! I need to learn to type faster, lol.

he has prepackaged responses saved as word docs. He just cuts and pastes:D

good luck beating that:p

wutadumsn23

nooshinjohn wrote: »

he has prepackaged responses saved as word docs. He just cuts and pastes:D

good luck beating that:p

Ahhhh, so that's how he does it, lol.

Hoopnoop

Thanks for the suggestions! Sounds like a consensus that a well set-up 5.1 is better than 7.1 -- but the power gain to the fronts isn't that great. So, I'm going to shift to 5.1 and may just try the bi-amping for the heck of it.

Re: the 805, will it really make a noticeable difference? I've read in various posts that the impact of shifting up to an 805 isn't that great unless you are a real audiophile. I will also be challenged to convince my wife to go from 605 to 805 given that I've been in careful negotiations to acquire the equipment I have. I guess if I sell my 605 I might be able to upgrade for a few hundred dollars but these are tough negotiations!

Toolfan66

When you can you really need to put some power to those RTi 10's if you really want to hear what they can do. In my honest opinon you will not notice any change taking down the 7.1, and bi amping with your receiver.

Keep your eye out on Craigs List, and find a receiver on the cheap with preouts. Start there then work on a amp with at least 3 channels you may find a 5 channel amp close to the same price maybe a little more if so your in.

You will have a nice little setup on the cheap, and you will be amazed with what the RTi 10's will sound like. you will think you just got a new set of speakers on the bonus side.

Good Luck

wallstreet

Hoopnoop wrote: »

Thanks for the suggestions! Sounds like a consensus that a well set-up 5.1 is better than 7.1 -- but the power gain to the fronts isn't that great. So, I'm going to shift to 5.1 and may just try the bi-amping for the heck of it...

Errr, I wouldn't call that a consensus. I believe the quote was better than a cramped 7.1 system. I enjoy my 7.1 system. It is better than the 5.1 system I had. Sounds can circle around my seating area. There's not a lot of 7.1 content though. But when you do find the occasional action movie with DTS ES or DD EX, the results can be exciting.

Toolfan66

wallstreet wrote: »

Errr, I wouldn't call that a consensus. I believe the quote was better than a cramped 7.1 system. I enjoy my 7.1 system. It is better than the 5.1 system I had. Sounds can circle around my seating area. There's not a lot of 7.1 content though. But when you do find the occasional action movie with DTS ES or DD EX, the results can be exciting.

Agreed!!!!!! I love my 7.1 system..... I would not go back to 5.1

royalty

You really dont think Bi-amping will improve them much at all?

comfortablycurt

wutadumsn23 wrote: »

Damn you Curt!!!! I need to learn to type faster, lol.

nooshinjohn wrote: »

he has prepackaged responses saved as word docs. He just cuts and pastes:D

good luck beating that:p

Yep, that's how I do it. I have a pre-typed response to every question that could possibly be answered. The only hard part is finding the correct one sometimes...:p

royalty wrote: »

You really dont think Bi-amping will improve them much at all?

True bi-amping would improve them a lot, but this isn't true bi-amping. It's bi-wiring. It's basically splitting the signal in half and sending a separate signal to each pair of inputs on the speaker. There isn't actually any extra power going to the speakers.

Like I said...some people have noticed a difference using that method, but the majority haven't. Try it...it might give you an improvement. Don't expect to be completely blown away by it though.

wutadumsn23

wallstreet wrote: »

Errr, I wouldn't call that a consensus. I believe the quote was better than a cramped 7.1 system. I enjoy my 7.1 system. It is better than the 5.1 system I had. Sounds can circle around my seating area. There's not a lot of 7.1 content though. But when you do find the occasional action movie with DTS ES or DD EX, the results can be exciting.

That is true, I was trying to say that a 5.1 would sound better than a cramped 7.1, but not that a 5.1 would sound better than a well setup 7.1.

TOOLFORLIFEFAN wrote: »

Agreed!!!!!! I love my 7.1 system..... I would not go back to 5.1

I had a 7.1 before my current setup, but can't do it now due to room size. I look forward to the day I can go back to 7.1 though.

Hoopnoop

Yes, I stand corrected on the 7.1 vs 5.1 -- my system isn't very well set-up for 7.1 so it seems preferable to shift to 5.1 and free up some of the receiver's energy towards the other speakers. I'll also give a shot on bi-amping and put in my two cents as to whether it makes a difference -- I already have the wires set up for it anyway.

I have to hold off on going with the 805 but will keep that on my wish list for now. I have 9 kids so every a/v purchase involves challenging trade-offs!

Toolfan66

9 KIDS!!!!!!! WOW!!!!!!:eek:

wutadumsn23

Holy ****, my wife is always watching that damn show on TV about the 8 kids and what not, you should have your own show, lol. Hey wait a minute are you the Octodad?? lol

Hoopnoop

No on the 8 kids dad. I believe they had 6 at once so there situation is a bit more challenging than mine!

But audio/visual negotiations are tough!

DV1

Interesting!

Hoopnoop

Well, I found some FXI3s on Craigslist, which are a good match for my system. So, I'm going to add them and convert back to a 5.1 and bi-wire the two fronts. I don't have the money at this point to upgrade the receiver or add an amp. But I'll report back in terms of the improvement in sound with my revamped system which now consists of:

Onkyo SR605
PSW505
CSI5
RTI10s X 2
FXI3s X 2

unc2701

Just a clarification here, folks- the SR605 has a bi AMP option. This will get a little more power to the fronts, but how much is debatable- Everything is pulling from the same power supply, it won't double the power you get, but there will be some more headroom. Bi Wiring adds zero power (although you would pick up some power by getting the rears off that power supply that they all share).

Hoopnoop

Thanks, I checked the owner's manual and you are correct -- by connecting the surr back l/r speakers to the RTI10s woofers and using the current terminals to the tweeters then I will be bi-amping. This will hopefully bump up the power a bit although my the replies to my initial post seem to indicate that an external amp would be the preferred solution.