Rear speakers for the LSI15

alphaone

Monday I will be getting a pair of LSi15.
Which would be better for surrounds, the LSi9 or the LSi f/x?
As center, could a LSi9 be used except for being a little too big?
Thank you

SBrown712

I haven't seen the LSi9 but I hope you don't think the F/X is a small speaker. I have the F/X paired with my 15s and am completely satisfied. I also like the way the speakers are made in the F/X. The way the boxes are angled allows a wider stage than the front firing of the 9s. The size wasn't an issue for me and they did get girlfriend approval. I vote for the F/X.

BlueFox

I had 2 LSi7s for the rear, but later upgraded to two LSi15s. No regrets.

alphaone

I got my LSi15s this morning and I have been comparing them for about 5 hours with my RM30 I had before. I just want to understand what I need to doo different or if I am listening correctly. I have an Onkyo TX-SR805 and while comparing both speakers I keep it in Direct mode, and sometimes in stereo, but always outputting just to the 2 front speakers. The speaker wires go from the Onkyo to the subwoofer and then to the speakers. I tried it with the subwoofer on and off. I was trying to find out how much better the LSis were. I have been listening to music for a long time but I don't consider myself an expert on setting up sound systems. I am kind of apologetic because I am about to say I didn't hear any difference as I switched from the RMs to the LSis, and back again, over and over. Of course the RMs need the Sub and I was trying to disregard the bass. However, with the Sub on I didn't see much of a difference. To me they both sound very good and about the same. I connected the LSis and listened to them first and I was impressed. Then, I connected the RMs and I was surprised when they sounded just as good. If there is a difference I can't be sure. I continue to see no, or little difference as I switched back and forth.
I thing the LSis must be better because of the reviews. Then, could it be that the Onkyo can't do any better and therefore if doesn't matter which speakers are connected to it? I have heard about the extra amplifier, but wouldn’t the RM 30s also sound better and maybe not be so different from the LSis?
I would appreciate any suggestion and opinions.

Thank you

Monster Jam

...give me a moment while I put on my flame-retardant jump suit...

Let me ask a series of questions in response to your question: If you were to have auditioned the speakers and found that they sounded about the same as your RMs, would you have bought the LSis?

I am curious as to what caused you to "get" the LSis in the first place? Where they gifts, a great-deal purchase, or something else?

You comment "I thing the LSis must be better because of the reviews." (and I believe you meant "think" in the line referenced), but let me assure you that because you read great reviews on a product (even if they are overwhelmingly so) that it is not a sure-fire bet that you will appreciate the product or that its even a superior product. As an example, there are literally thousands of posts on polk forums and AVS in which a person who has upgraded to an amplifier or bought high-end interconnects/cabling hear a "significant" difference. Then there are those few who purchase said amps, cables, and ICs and hear NO difference.

I'm not sure I could give an opinion or suggestion without a little background on how you acquired the speakers.

alphaone

Monster Jam wrote: »

...give me a moment while I put on my flame-retardant jump suit...

Let me ask a series of questions in response to your question: If you were to have auditioned the speakers and found that they sounded about the same as your RMs, would you have bought the LSis?

I am curious as to what caused you to "get" the LSis in the first place? Where they gifts, a great-deal purchase, or something else?

You comment "I thing the LSis must be better because of the reviews." (and I believe you meant "think" in the line referenced), but let me assure you that because you read great reviews on a product (even if they are overwhelmingly so) that it is not a sure-fire bet that you will appreciate the product or that its even a superior product. As an example, there are literally thousands of posts on polk forums and AVS in which a person who has upgraded to an amplifier or bought high-end interconnects/cabling hear a "significant" difference. Then there are those few who purchase said amps, cables, and ICs and hear NO difference.

I'm not sure I could give an opinion or suggestion without a little background on how you acquired the speakers.

- Not likely because I wouldn't spend the money for no sound improvement.

- I got the LSis because I read excellent reviews in 3 or 4 different magazines. Not only the Polk Audio Forums but also on others, everyone likes them. I looked for audio stores in my area but I couldn’t find one that had the LSis.
They were a good deal purchase at Polk Audio's Ebay site.

I am really questioning my ability to recognize the sound quality because it seems impossible that they are the same as the RMs since so many people say they are much better. If I hear no difference or little difference (except in the bass), then it must be something else like my receiver/amplifier, positioning, etc. I am trying to determine what it is.

Even if I couldn’t hear any different but other people could, I would still buy them. I will ask others. When my wife got home I played both and she thinks the LSis sound better. When I got the RM30s I noticed a big improvement. Maybe my hearing was better a few years ago, and I am not kidding when a say this. However, I have no reason to thing I have a hearing problem.

SBrown712

I have never heard the RM30s so I don't have a reference for the two. When I got my 15s I hooked them up to a HK AVR 435 and was expecting to be blown away. I wasn't. Not at all. I was wondering if I had made a mistake in buying them. Then my amp arrived and I hooked the speakers up. WOW, I was in love. The difference in the sound quality was amazing. I'm guessing it was the power that the amp produced over the power of the receiver. It may be the same in your case. Does that receiver produce enough power at 4 ohms to power the 15s the way they should be? If you read the reviews like I did you read that the 15s are really power hungry speakers. I just looked at the specs on your receiver and the only mention of 4 ohms was into one channel. I don't pretend to know much about what all these numbers mean I would question the power output to go with the 15s. You might ask around about that receiver with the 15s and get a consciences of the combination.
Or, just break down, buy an amp and be done with it, lol.

devani

onkyo 805 can't really drive LSi15 well...what ohm setting do you have on the 805 for driving LSi15?

I also drove LSi15 with HK445 and later got an amp....

cheddar

If it were me, I would not do listening tests with the subwoofer on. It could be that you just really respond well to the bass and it's coloring all your listening tests for the mid and upper frequencies.

I would also make sure to set the fronts to large and experiment with diverting the subwoofer output to the fronts. If your bass management cuts the mid and low frequencies then you will be cutting out much of the advantage of a floorstanding speaker. But music selections that don't need a subwoofer would probably be good test material.

If you still think the difference between the speakers is small, I wouldn't force yourself to like the 15s just based on what others think. They do respond well to seperate amplification because of their power requirements and will certainly improve more than the RMs when fed better power. But if you really think the difference is small, I wouldn't go out and buy an amp when you might like the sound of a new subwoofer with your RMs even better. Count yourself lucky that your wallet will be better off. If you know a friend with an amp you can borrow, though, the 15s really deserve to be listened to at their full potential...

curved

Those 15's need an external bad!! That is extremely hard on your Onkyo - it'll get hot!! What kind of sub do you have?

Monster Jam

OK, at the risk of getting flamed -recall I put the jump suit on earlier-, this is my recommendation based on your response (reading Cheddar's response, I may have some back up here)

Suggestion: If you can't return the speakers, sell one of the sets (LSis or RMs) privately or use them as plant stands. Don't buy an amp. You’re wasting time and money. Yes the speakers would sound better with a separate amp, but will it sound markedly better? Will it sound good enough to justify dropping $1k? That’s a call that I think you might not agree with.

Further, and I say this as respectfully as possible, next time you decide to buy speakers, if at all possible audition them. I understand that this is not always practical (or even possible where internet only companies are concerned), but you'll save yourself alot of heartache in the long run. And its part of the fun in hunting for the perfect speaker!

alphaone

Sorry I spoke so quickly saying that the LSi15 probably weren't much better than the RM30s, however I didn't really believed it, and that's why I was inquiring. Next time I will wait a few more day and do more experimenting. But your replies helped a lot. Thank you.

I did several things repeatedly as necessary: I repositioning the speakers, changed the controls in the sub lowering them quite a bit (sub is almost unnecessary for music), change settings in the Onkio and chose CDs that should have better quality recording. I did these things from the beginning, but probably not enough or correctly. I also set the Center speaker to None until I get the LSiC which I should get in a day or two (I think the sound is better without it). I placed the RM30s as surrounds until I buy the LSiFXs. I probably did other things too.

Conclusion: I am impressed with the LSis. There are CDs with music I didn’t like before and now I do because, now, I can hear it. I may get better sound with an added amplifier but right now my 805 sounds excellent. It used to run hot, but since I added a 5 in. computer fan, I touch the case ant it’s cool.

Now, I am thinking to complete the speaker set as follows:

LSi15 – Front (done)
LSiC – Center (done)
LSi F/X – Surrounds
LSi7 or 9 – Rear (thinking size)
Sub – SVS ?? (If the PSW 505 doesn’t work well with these)

I appreciate any suggestions

If I find out I also need an amplifier, maybe the UPA-7.

Today I played a SACD on 7.1 channels and didn’t notice reduction in sound quality, but the rest of the speakers are RMs and not the speakers I mention above which probably require more power.

apphd

Good to hear you are making progress. Your next speaker choices sound like the right direction to build on the 15's, BUT keep in mind the more LSi's you add the harder the Onk will have powering them. Get that amp!

ben62670

Get a used amp. You can sell it at, or near what you paid for it if you shop smart.
Happy hunting.
Ben

cheddar

Good to hear you're finally hearing a difference. Since you're keeping the 15s and are now trying to build out a 7.1 LSi surround system, I would also recommend getting an external amp. When I put an external amp on my 15s, not only did details come out in music, but the bass really slammed harder. I originally thought that the 15s didn't have much bass without a subwoofer but found out that they can really hit harder when properly powered. Maybe not as deep as a good sub, but the quality of the bass improved a lot.

Bummer that you can appreciate the difference now...maybe some audio induced poverty in your future...;)

bdtae5656

cheddar wrote: »

Good to hear you're finally hearing a difference. Since you're keeping the 15s and are now trying to build out a 7.1 LSi surround system, I would also recommend getting an external amp. When I put an external amp on my 15s, not only did details come out in music, but the bass really slammed harder. I originally thought that the 15s didn't have much bass without a subwoofer but found out that they can really hit harder when properly powered. Maybe not as deep as a good sub, but the quality of the bass improved a lot.

Bummer that you can appreciate the difference now...maybe some audio induced poverty in your future...;)

How much power to you have going to your 15's

devani

get SVS or HUS subs....polks subs are okay but for the same money you can do better....

cheddar

bdtae5656 wrote: »

How much power to you have going to your 15's

I have 400wpc into 4ohms.

ben62670

Were are you located? My buddy is selling a full LSi set.
LSi15 – Front (modded)
LSiC – Center (modded)
LSi F/X – Surrounds

curved

Monster Jam wrote: »

Suggestion: If you can't return the speakers, sell one of the sets (LSis or RMs) privately or use them as plant stands. Don't buy an amp. You’re wasting time and money. Yes the speakers would sound better with a separate amp, but will it sound markedly better? Will it sound good enough to justify dropping $1k? That’s a call that I think you might not agree with.

One word - impedance. It's not that they will just sound better....it will be very hard on your AVR as I said before. You'll be shortening the life-span of it considerably.

cheddar wrote: »

I have 400wpc into 4ohms.

That's it

teatouch

I have a marantz SR5002 @ 90wpc powering Lsi15s and a Csia6. So far I have had one incidence where the marantz just cut off after a loud fall sound on a blu-ray. I am debating if I should get an Emotiva XPA-3 amp next or get a pair of lsifx next. Eventually I will have both but I am not sure which to get next.

apphd

teatouch wrote: »

........So far I have had one incidence where the marantz just cut off after a loud fall sound on a blu-ray.
I am debating if I should get an Emotiva XPA-3 amp next or get a pair of lsifx next. .......

I think I know what I would get next

candjhuntley

Let me chime in as well - you really need an external amp to drive those things - the 4 ohm impedance just kills that Onkyo. This would be ESPECIALLY true if you're going to fill out the rest of your setup with the LSI series. I think you will be glad you did, but your Onkyo will crap out on you soon if you keep asking it to drive that kind of load in 4 ohms. Yeah - it's expensive - but look here, Audiogon, Ebay, keep an eye on Craigslist - just start looking for a solid amp that is 4 ohm capable and runs at least 200wpc into 8 ohms - at least that was the advice given me for my LSIs