I Just Can't Win With These Amps!
Comments
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I believe this is metal's first dip in the separates pond.
Regardless of what some keep repeating here about QC issues, I actually own one, and there is zero hiss, hum, or buzz.
Of the problems I've seen reported, 95% are either cable related, or the owner's house wiring had no ground.
There are a few legit lemons out there, but no more so than other brands. -
Just a thought here....do you have cable TV connected to your AVR? Cable/boxes are NOTORIOUS for hum/ground issues. I use an optical connection from my cable box to eliminate this issue...
my $.02...TNRabbit
NO Polk Audio Equipment :eek:
Sunfire TG-IV
Ashly 1001 Active Crossover
Rane PEQ-15 Parametric Equalizers x 2
Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature Seven
Carver AL-III Speakers
Klipsch RT-12d Subwoofer -
Sorry to hear this metal. Have you searched Emo's boards? I'm not sure but IIR I've read on a forum somewhere of issues like this on some of their older series amps, that for whatever reason turned out to be the IC's I think. They were good HQ IC's, but for some reason not compatible with the design architecture of the amp. Seems like Lonnie or maybe Dan saw the post and suggested some different cables, with a technical explanation of what he thought was going on, and it took care of the problem. The one ch. being worse could just be a matter of tolerances, (one has to be the worst, one has to be the best, but not a big window) or with the visible damage to the boxes could be shipping damage.
Did you sign for the package? If it is shipping damage, you might be in for a battle if you signed without any comment of the condition of the box. If you ever receive packages like this note somewhere with the shipper of "damaged box, possible internal damage". With the electronic note pads FedX and UPS use these days that's pretty hard, but ask them if they have any paperwork to document this or refuse to accept. Hopefully you did not sign for it.
I'll see if I can find that post, but I do not remember where I saw it so don't hold your breath.
Good luck, we keep hearing about the Emo CS being good so I think you will be taken care of, they all can't be made up posts.
Probably not what you wanted to hear, but hope it was helpful in some way. -
It doesn't have to be connected to the AVR to cause problems. Disconnect your cable line from everything in your rig and see if the noise goes away.Just a thought here....do you have cable TV connected to your AVR? Cable/boxes are NOTORIOUS for hum/ground issues. I use an optical connection from my cable box to eliminate this issue...
my $.02...
In the EMO's IEC inlet, is there 2 or 3 prongs?"He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche -
Any way of checking amp at another location? If so, that should eliminate your "home wiring" variable. Good luck and I am sure things will work out one way or the other.
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Thanks LessisNevermore.
It's possible that the receiver has only a two prong cord(my Onkyo does) and the amp has a three prong, which could explain why the receiver alone is quieter than the amp. Have you tried a cheater plug yet?"He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche -
A cheater plug would be my first suggestion as well, and then diagnose from there. Sounds like a ground loop hum on top of normal tweeter hiss.Speakers: Polk LSi15
Pre: Adcom GFP-750 with HT Bypass
Amp: Pass Labs X-150
CD/DVD Player: Classe CDP-10
Interconnects: MIT Shortgun S3 Pro XLR
Speaker cables: MIT MH-750 bi-wire
TT:Micro Seiki DD-35
Cartridge:Denon DL-160
Phono Pre:PS Audio GCPH -
I've been messing around with these two amps again this morning. I hooked up the XPA-3 again, and no hum from the speakers, with just a slight hiss from the tweeters.
Then i took the XPA-3 out of the lineup and put the XPA-5 back in. Speakers started to hum again, and the hiss is louder than with the XPA-3.
Considering i was having trouble with channel 1 on the XPA-5, i took that channel right out of the equation. So, without channel 1 being used on the XPA-5, all other symptons quiet down considerably and it basically acts like the XPA-3.
And just for the heck of it, i did a little comparing of the two amps. I thought my new XPA-5 sounded better, but upon testing this morning, as far as i can tell, the two amps sound exactly the same, even with 200wpc (XPA-3 all channels) vs 250wpc (XPA-5 3 channels). And the 275wpc on the XPA-5 while listening to 2 channel music, makes no difference vs the 250wpc on the XPA-3 in 2 channel mode. So, you guys are right, an extra 50wpc (and 25wpc in stereo mode) makes no audible difference.
So, all in all, i spent an extra $300 for the XPA-5, it makes no difference, and i can't use all channels on it without causing irritating issues. -
Have you tried using a 3 prong to 2 prong plug.Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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Well i just talked to Lonnie, he explained a lot of things to me. He's definitely concered that 1 channel is having an issue and apologized sincerely for my troubles. He just wants to make me happy and doesn't want me to have to fuss with testing everything over and over, so now it's bacially up to me if i want to keep the XPA-3, or send back the XPA-3 and XPA-5 and have him send me another XPA-5.
I'm constantly amazed at with the high level of customer service this company has. Lonnie seems like a very nice guy, and it's comforting to know i can talk to the guy that knows the ins and outs of these products.
Thank you everyone for your suggestions, i'll let you know what happens. -
Have you tried using a 3 prong to 2 prong plug.
No i haven't tried using one of those.
I'm now just trying to decide what i want to do. In regards to which amp i'm going to stick with. The XPA-3 i have seems to be fine, Lonnie explained to me that what i was experiencing was normal with it was normal because of the magnetic field inside the amp. But he's basically willing to let me do whatever i want at this point. Keep the XPA-3 (or get another XPA-3), send me another XPA-5 and return the two amps i currently have, etc etc.
I think part of me wants to just stick with the XPA-3, and save $300 since it appears the XPA-5 really didn't make a difference in sound. Ahhh decisions decision, i'm just very happy Emotiva is working with me here, it's a relief. -
No i haven't tried using one of those.
I'm now just trying to decide what i want to do. In regards to which amp i'm going to stick with. The XPA-3 i have seems to be fine, Lonnie explained to me that what i was experiencing was normal with it was normal because of the magnetic field inside the amp. But he's basically willing to let me do whatever i want at this point. Keep the XPA-3 (or get another XPA-3), send me another XPA-5 and return the two amps i currently have, etc etc.
A cheater plug (3 to 2 prong) has been mentioned several times already, and my suggestion would be to try one before you make any decisions. They are cheap, it's an easy test, and it will narrow down one very common and specific cause of what you're experiencing.Speakers: Polk LSi15
Pre: Adcom GFP-750 with HT Bypass
Amp: Pass Labs X-150
CD/DVD Player: Classe CDP-10
Interconnects: MIT Shortgun S3 Pro XLR
Speaker cables: MIT MH-750 bi-wire
TT:Micro Seiki DD-35
Cartridge:Denon DL-160
Phono Pre:PS Audio GCPH -
Metal I wouldn't expect the 5 to sound different from the 3. The big question is does it give a nice boost to your back speakers. It should from just running off of the receiver. If it does, then keep the 5.Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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I would thank the Lonnie fellow and get my money back if possible, sometimes things just do not work out.
RT1 -
A cheater plug (3 to 2 prong) has been mentioned several times already, and my suggestion would be to try one before you make any decisions. They are cheap, it's an easy test, and it will narrow down one very common and specific cause of what you're experiencing.
I have one of those floating around here somewhere, i'll definitely give it a shot no matter what i decide. Though i'm sure it won't help with the channel 1 issue on the XPA-5, Lonnie agrees with me that something might be wrong in the amp.Metal I wouldn't expect the 5 to sound different from the 3. The big question is does it give a nice boost to your back speakers. It should from just running off of the receiver. If it does, then keep the 5.
I'm testing out some scenes from movies with active surround fields now.reeltrouble1 wrote: »I would thank the Lonnie fellow and get my money back if possible, sometimes things just do not work out.
RT1
I appreciate the suggestion.
But i'm not giving up easily, i want one of these amps, and i'll jump through hoops if i have too. -
Have you hooked up just the amp and speakers without anything else connected? If it still hums or hisses at that point, it's definetely an amp problem. If that turns out to be the case, I would take reeltrouble1's advice, and get a refund. I read too many stories of people who went through 2-3 or more Emotiva amps before getting one that worked right. Not worth the bother in my opinion.
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Metal I wouldn't expect the 5 to sound different from the 3. The big question is does it give a nice boost to your back speakers. It should from just running off of the receiver. If it does, then keep the 5.
So i've tested out the Dark knight on blu ray, i went back and fourth through the big chase scene a couple of times. I can't really hear much of a difference in my surrounds whether they are hooked up to the Amp or to my Pioneer Elite 92. I have a pretty good AVR though, so maybe that's why.
Anyways i was only able to go back and fourth twice and with one movie. I'm running out of time since i have to leave for work soon, but i'll try to compare some more when i get home.Have you hooked up just the amp and speakers without anything else connected? If it still hums or hisses at that point, it's definetely an amp problem. If that turns out to be the case, I would take reeltrouble1's advice, and get a refund. I read too many stories of people who went through 2-3 or more Emotiva amps before getting one that worked right. Not worth the bother in my opinion.
I'm pretty sure it's the amp having the problem, at least with the XPA-5. The XPA-3 may just be something with my house or many of the other things you guys have said. At least that amp doesn't produce a hum from my speakers, and all the channels work the same.
I'm definitely going to try and stick with one of these amps, whether i keep the XPA-3 or the XPA-5. If i decide to keep the XPA-5, having to exchange it for another because of the channel 1 issue won't bother me all that much much, at least i know Emotiva is willing make this right for me. These are the amps i can afford, and they sound great, and i personally love the style of them as well. I know there are better ones out there, but i can't afford them, and i don't wanna buy a used amp simply because i want something brand new and with a warranty.
Anyways, i'll figure it this mess out one way or another. -
In regards to using a cheater plug.
Considering i have the amp hooked up to my HTS 1600 (makes no difference if hooked to the wall outlets, i tried them all), should i put the cheater plug on the HTS's cord, or use it on the amp and then plug it into the HTS?
Just curious. -
Good to hear you've had a chance to talk with CS, and it sounds like things are moving in a good direction on that end. Not sure on the XPA but on the LPA the power cord is 3 prong, but the IEC inlet in the amp itself is only 2 so the ground is already lifted. You may want to take a look in the receptacle in the back of the amp before looking for your cheater plug, it may be a waste of time.
+1 This would eliminate any noise from the AVR pre outs or IC's. That brings it down to the amp or house wiring as it is unlikely the speakers or speaker wire IMHO.Have you hooked up just the amp and speakers without anything else connected? If it still hums or hisses at that point, it's definetely an amp problem......... (edited by me)
I think I would go with the XPA5. Just leaves more things open for the future, ether way hope you get things straightened out so you can start enjoying things ASAP. -
In regards to using a cheater plug.
Considering i have the amp hooked up to my HTS 1600 (makes no difference if hooked to the wall outlets, i tried them all), should i put the cheater plug on the HTS's cord, or use it on the amp and then plug it into the HTS?
Just curious.
Plug the amp directly into the wall using the cheater plug.Speakers: Polk LSi15
Pre: Adcom GFP-750 with HT Bypass
Amp: Pass Labs X-150
CD/DVD Player: Classe CDP-10
Interconnects: MIT Shortgun S3 Pro XLR
Speaker cables: MIT MH-750 bi-wire
TT:Micro Seiki DD-35
Cartridge:Denon DL-160
Phono Pre:PS Audio GCPH -
I know you said it's not what you want to do, but I'd get a refund and go with something else myself. I've been hearing to many stories lately about people having to return their Emotiva amps 4-5 times before getting one that actually works right.
You said you didn't want to buy used, but personally I'd look into a used Adcom, Rotel, Parasound...or something equivalent. You could get something in the same price range, that would likely sound even better and wouldn't have these problems. Just my .02 cents though.The nirvana inducer-
APC H10 Power Conditioner
Marantz UD5005 universal player
Parasound Halo P5 preamp
Parasound HCA-1200II power amp
PolkAudio LSi9's/PolkAudio SDA 2A's/PolkAudio Monitor 7A's
Audioquest Speaker Cables and IC's -
Don't forget to recalibrate all the speakers with the amp in place.So i've tested out the Dark knight on blu ray, i went back and fourth through the big chase scene a couple of times. I can't really hear much of a difference in my surrounds whether they are hooked up to the Amp or to my Pioneer Elite 92. I have a pretty good AVR though, so maybe that's why.
Anyways i was only able to go back and fourth twice and with one movie. I'm running out of time since i have to leave for work soon, but i'll try to compare some more when i get home.Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2 -
Good to hear you've had a chance to talk with CS, and it sounds like things are moving in a good direction on that end. Not sure on the XPA but on the LPA the power cord is 3 prong, but the IEC inlet in the amp itself is only 2 so the ground is already lifted. You may want to take a look in the receptacle in the back of the amp before looking for your cheater plug, it may be a waste of time.
The XPA's are the same way, the power cords are 3 prong but the inlets themselves are only 2. -
comfortablycurt wrote: »I know you said it's not what you want to do, but I'd get a refund and go with something else myself. I've been hearing to many stories lately about people having to return their Emotiva amps 4-5 times before getting one that actually works right.
You said you didn't want to buy used, but personally I'd look into a used Adcom, Rotel, Parasound...or something equivalent. You could get something in the same price range, that would likely sound even better and wouldn't have these problems. Just my .02 cents though.
I'm still probably going to keep trying Emotiva until i get it all worked out, i'll have a 5yr warranty if i stick with them and can get past all this so that's why.
But just out of curiosity i'll take a look, where do you buy used amps? Audiogon? Any other good places? -
From your own experience, it sounds like Emotiva carries used amps........;)HT Optoma HD25 LV on 80" DIY Screen, Anthem MRX 300 Receiver, Pioneer Elite BDP 51FD Polk CS350LS, Polk SDA1C, Polk FX300, Polk RT55, Dual EBS Adire Shiva 320watt tuned to 17hz, ICs-DIY Twisted Prs, Speaker-Raymond Cable
2 Channel Thorens TD 318 Grado ZF1, SACD/CD Marantz 8260, Soundstream/Krell DAC1, Audio Mirror PP1, Odyssey Stratos, ADS L-1290, ICs-DIY Twisted , Speaker-Raymond Cable -
My suggestion... drink more!
sorry.. that was to easy.
send them back if they don't meet your requirements.
Hiss and buzz would kill my enjoyment if it was to loud.
how loud are we talking about? Only if you crank it without anything playing type of hiss or what?
Check all of your interconnects.. one may be bad... are they shielded interconnects? What is you take the amp out and run it from your receiver, is there still hum?PolkFest 2012, who's going>?
Vancouver, Canada Sept 30th, 2012 - Madonna concert :cheesygrin: -
Dennis Gardner wrote: »From your own experience, it sounds like Emotiva carries used amps........;)
+1. It is the undeniable truth that EMO now has many used amps lying around from customer returns. EMO got to do something about these True Reference Amplifier design or sell many B stocks. I hope a Dollar Store carries them soon when EMO cleared them out.Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin: -
My suggestion... drink more!
sorry.. that was to easy.
send them back if they don't meet your requirements.
Hiss and buzz would kill my enjoyment if it was to loud.
how loud are we talking about? Only if you crank it without anything playing type of hiss or what?
Check all of your interconnects.. one may be bad... are they shielded interconnects? What is you take the amp out and run it from your receiver, is there still hum?
Are any of your interconnects crossing over power cords?PolkFest 2012, who's going>?
Vancouver, Canada Sept 30th, 2012 - Madonna concert :cheesygrin: -
danger boy wrote: »My suggestion... drink more!
sorry.. that was to easy.
send them back if they don't meet your requirements.
Hiss and buzz would kill my enjoyment if it was to loud.
how loud are we talking about? Only if you crank it without anything playing type of hiss or what?
Check all of your interconnects.. one may be bad... are they shielded interconnects? What is you take the amp out and run it from your receiver, is there still hum?
Are any of your interconnects crossing over power cords?
I will drink more! Thanks!:rolleyes::p
I've already gone over most of this in previous posts.
No, my IC's are not over power cords.
And yes, they are shielded.
