Monitor 10, and CS350 XO upgrades

ben62670

Guys if you have the CS350 you should really do this upgrade. A Dayton cap fits easily in here, and is cheap. I did the CS350 for free. It's easy, and I feel that voice matching is just as important with caps as tweeters. The monitor 10 is typical. This one is a peerless model.
Ben


Ben

bsoko2

I had Ben do the crossovers on my Monitor 10's and CS 350 center. This is an excellent match between mains and center. After 10 hours of listening to them (music and BluRay movies) all I can say is WOW, the soundstage is amazing. I had my heart set on a set of SDA's but with the 10's now sounding so GOOD, maybe I'll put it off until a set falls into my lap. My area is over 6000 cu feet and the sound fills the room. I have Outlaw Audio M2200 200 watt mono blocks on the 10's and the clarity is amazing. These 10's easily handle all the HD audio formats (True HD, DTS Master HD, etc.). I now hear things in the background of these formats that just weren't there before. So the bottom line is, any of you out there with Monitor 10's or a 350 center, get the crossovers done (Dayton Audio products used)! It will be the best bang for the buck that you could ever spend!

Bill

ben62670

Enjoy. You guys running the CS350 should really look at doing these.

Conradicles

Ben,
A couple of CS350 on e-bay now...do you think it would be a big upgrade over my CSi3?

Conradicles

I just saw one of your older post on how cheap it is to do this upgrade...I might need to try this one myself...I'll keep searching to find part #'s. I work in the Electronics Industry so I should be able to do this. If you have any suggestions I would greatly appreciate them. Thanks.

bsoko2

To add to the Monitor 10 and CS 350 upgrade that you did for me Ben: I now find that changing all my speakers to LARGE and not small is a big improvement in audio listening. With the upgrades to the speakers I hear so many things that I didn't hear when the speakers were set to small. I had my whole HT configured with MBM's and HSU 3.3's to support small speakers and that it is now not necessary. I get much better detail on the audio with the upgrades. Hey, THSmith, give it a try. I have set my LFE to plus and running the LFE flat at 75 db. The Anti Mode has a 25-35 lift engaged and that just enhances the LFE and speaker bass to some great bass slam. The receiver LFE crossover is solid at 80 hz. When listening to movies this way, you come to realize that the movie audio tracks (HD & SD) were mixed for large speakers settings anyway, why are we trying to set them to small and forcing the speaker bass to the subwoofer? Too much audio detail is lost from the mains, center, and surrounds when doing that as I have discovered with the new upgrades to the Monitor crossovers.

Bill

thsmith

Bill, I agree you on the MBMs. Since getting the M12s the Ultra has not been as busy.

I really do not have the time right now to do the homework, ask questions and locate parts to do the XOs in the M12s.

Busy chasing SDA's right now, they sure are slippery wascles.

The RDO's will be here Thursday but that should be an easy and quick swap out, famous last words.

Maybe if I ask Ben nicely he will consider doing the XOs:eek::D

ben62670

thsmith wrote: »

Bill, I agree you on the MBMs. Since getting the M12s the Ultra has not been as busy.

I really do not have the time right now to do the homework, ask questions and locate parts to do the XOs in the M12s.

Busy chasing SDA's right now, they sure are slippery wascles.

The RDO's will be here Thursday but that should be an easy and quick swap out, famous last words.

Maybe if I ask Ben nicely he will consider doing the XOs:eek::D

Hey bro no asking nicely required:) Any questions are fine. Let me know what you want to do. I do XO upgrades for Polkies pretty cheap. Of coarse if you have the gear, time, and knowledge I am usually around to answer questions:)
Ben

thsmith

ben62670 wrote: »

Hey bro no asking nicely required:) Any questions are fine. Let me know what you want to do. I do XO upgrades for Polkies pretty cheap. Of coarse if you have the gear, time, and knowledge I am usually around to answer questions:)
Ben

Thank you Ben ! I do know how to solder and could do it with enough help but right now I am on a quest for SDAs. Just ask Ron, I have the bug real bad.

I will PM you about my M12s, thanks again !:cool:

bigaudiofanatic

I might want to do this upgrade to see how they sound it would be my very first mod to a speaker.

McLoki

It is pretty easy to do, not terribly expensive and does not take a long time (maybe an afternoon if you take your time and go slow). I would rate it as an excellent 1st mod project.

Face

McLoki wrote: »

It is pretty easy to do, not terribly expensive and does not take a long time (maybe an afternoon if you take your time and go slow). I would rate it as an excellent 1st mod project.

I agree. I did my Monitor 7's over a year ago and they were cake. Modding monitor 5, 7, and 10 crossovers are a good way to get your foot in the door.

zingo

Face wrote: »

I agree. I did my Monitor 7's over a year ago and they were cake. Modding monitor 5, 7, and 10 crossovers are a good way to get your foot in the door.

If anyone is hesitant, just take a look at your XOs and most of them are doable for the amateur. A lot of the XOs only need a few components swapped out, and with a little soldering practice, most people can do it without a problem. Hey, my first redo was my CRS+ where I swapped out all the components and converted them to TLs and I'm still alive! Don't be scared to dive in as some of those old boards can be hard to screw up and some of us have no problems fielding questions or helping.

timlitton

Let's say there was this new member who just bought a cs350ls to go with his ls90's. And suppose he saw this thread and thought "I bet I could do that and only burn 3 or 4 fingers." Not me, mind you, someone else. Entirely. I have nine posts under my belt so I'm almost an old timer. Do you suppose I... uh, I mean HE! HE!

Aw hell, do you have a more detailed walk through I could find?

NJPOLKER

If you use the search function, search this thread, you'll find alot of info on x-over mods. Search this thread and vintage speakers and you should find info to help. Its not hard just alittle common sense and you'll be all set.
Where ya located?
Drew

timlitton

I've searched a little already but I specifically searched "cs350" and "mod". I guess I'll broaden the search terms a little and see what pops up.

I'm in Fort Wayne, IN - BTW.

Face

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/tags.php?tag=crossover+upgrades

ben62670

The XO upgrade on the 350 is a fairly easy one. All you need to do is pull the XO, and remove the board. Remove the cap, and install the new one. Do not solder it, or cut the leads yet. You have to bend the tabs a little bit to get it to fit. The Dayton is the largest cap you can use without having to remote mount the cap. Install the board, and make sure that it fits properly. If it is settled in there nicely go ahead and solder the leads, and trim them. If you are not comfortable you can send the XO to me. Some guys don't won't to buy the soldering iron, and solder, or glue gun to do the mod. Here is a link to the cap used.
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?PartNumber=027-425
Ben

timlitton

Now that's more of what I was looking for. Thanks Ben.

ben62670

No problem. It's not that hard if you can solder:)

timlitton

I've read in other threads you should wear the upgrades in. Does that hold true for this procedure? If so, how long? Also, I've read others experienced better clarity in the mid to highs. Will this correct the "muddiness" I've heard others describe for the cs350 in the forum? One last thing... will this affect the voice matching to my LS90 since it has stock parts?

Thanks for all the help.

ben62670

It does take a little bit of time to burn the cap in, but with the Dayton it does burn in fairly quick. It will sound much better than stock right away. Yes it does clear up the muddiness, make the vocals clearer, and even makes the bass sound tighter. A lot of people don't realize that when some bass notes are hit it travels up into higher frequencies. This is especially apparent with mids like vocals in music. Even though most of the frequency spectrum is done by the mids the tweeter does handle quite a bit of the material. As for your LS90's matching if your center is more forward sounding than your mains it will be a little more forward than before. The LS90 uses only one cap too. It uses just one cap in the whole XO, a 10uf cap on the highs. The 90's are an easy/cheap upgrade too;)
Ben

Face

I agree with Ben, most caps will be a improvement right out of the box, some just take longer than others to burn or settle in.

bsoko2

Ben did my Monitor 10's and CS 350. There was a change as soon as I turned them on and total burn in was about 16 hours or so. My system is on 18 hours per day what with listening to music and TV/movies in the evening.

Bill

rabies_70

Thanks for this thread. I just ordered the caps and cant wait to make my 350's sing!

rabies_70

Cap replacement was extremely straightforward thanks to this thread. First time I turned on the system with the new caps it was obvious something was definitely better. After about 10 hours of movies I can say without a doubt my theater sounds so so very much better now. The dual center cs350ls with 200 watts to each are crystal clear. Dialogue and all center channel information is much more realistic. Thanks a million for the info. Anyone got this speaker and a soldering iron? Do the mod.

zingo

rabies_70 wrote: »

The dual center cs350ls with 200 watts to each are crystal clear.

rabies_70

Thank you sir.

I just added the mod to my "backup CS350" as well. I was watching Wall E last on Blu Ray last night and I started paying attention to the dialogue and center channel information and I just can't say thanks enough to Ben for posting this. If I hadn't stumbled across this thread I'd have never known what I was missing. My single 350 was nice, I knew I was onto something, But the dual 350 completely (or so I thought) brought my front sound stage together. I noticed the slightly muddy dialogue, but it was so much better than what I've had previously I was stoked. With the caps in, it is definitely night and day. I thought I'd add a couple photos for perspective. Thanks again y'all for converting my like of Polk to a LOVE of Polk.

Front of the theater


Dual CS350ls


The rest of my Theater/Bedroom I built for my wife. We call it "Theatre De Jolice"

DollarDave

ben62670 wrote: »

The XO upgrade on the 350 is a fairly easy one. All you need to do is pull the XO, and remove the board. Remove the cap, and install the new one. Do not solder it, or cut the leads yet. You have to bend the tabs a little bit to get it to fit. The Dayton is the largest cap you can use without having to remote mount the cap. Install the board, and make sure that it fits properly. If it is settled in there nicely go ahead and solder the leads, and trim them. If you are not comfortable you can send the XO to me. Some guys don't won't to buy the soldering iron, and solder, or glue gun to do the mod. Here is a link to the cap used.
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?PartNumber=027-425
Ben

I want to do my 90's, 50's, and 400 - do you recommend using the 1% tolerance or the 5%? The cost difference is minimal.

ben62670

I have measured the 5% caps, and I have found them to be tighter than 5%. Both are made of the same material. QC seems to be spot on. If I were to use very small value caps in say a pre, or active XO I would consider the 1% caps. I'll stick with the 5% caps.

Des Moines

ben62670 wrote: »

...if your center is more forward sounding than your mains it will be a little more forward than before.

I am bringing this thread back because I'm planning to upgrade my cs350 center with the 5.6 Dayton cap that Ben recommended. Re the quote above, my cs350 is already quite forward so I'm wondering if a mills 12 watt 1ohm resistor soldered directly with the cap would help to back off the center sound stage. I currently have to run the center at -6 to -8 to keep it from dominating two channel listening.

Has anyone tried this?