hope it doesnt get this bad here

ohskigod

apparently, everyone and there mom is knifing people in London, its getting bad. thsi article also ignites the "do you help someone in need" discusion we have had before. this case here the mayor says no, with no mention of even calling the authorities to help.

effing wierd man, wierd.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1031282/After-stabbing-London-Mayor-Boris-Johnson-warns-DONT-involved-trouble.html

bobman1235

Good to see that handgun ban in the UK is working out just peachy.

sucks2beme

Kinda hard to do drive by stabbings, though.

ohskigod

bobman1235 wrote: »

Good to see that handgun ban in the UK is working out just peachy.

and of course, the police are heavily searching people for any kind of weapon now, god forbid anyone has any ability to protect themselves.

I know some good hand defence against knife stuff, but it's last resort to avoid death at best, I wouldnt want to count on it as the only way to protect myself and loved ones.

I'd be carrying a stick weapon f some kind (assuming a gun to be nearly impossible there).....coupled with allowing no one to get frikkin near enough to me to be in knife use range.

in close quarters, knives scare me more than guns, if that makes sense

strider

bobman1235 wrote: »

Good to see that handgun ban in the UK is working out just peachy.

Is there an increase in crimes committed with a handgun?

ohskigod

sucks2beme wrote: »

Kinda hard to do drive by stabbings, though.

its not like drive bys are too common everywhere, it's limited to gang stuff. if someone is standing within 5 feet of you, believe me, a knife will wreck your **** much faster than a gun.

not many drive by shootings on a subway or heavy populated urban areas

drive by's draw attention (hence why they are not more widepread than gang situations). knives are very quiet. there only downside is close range, but with skill, that downside is not to debillitating if someone really wants to hurt/kill you

bobman1235

strider wrote: »

Is there an increase in crimes committed with a handgun?

The point is criminals will always find a way to commit crimes.

ohskigod

strider wrote: »

Is there an increase in crimes committed with a handgun?

I'm sure there will be comfort to the guy that got shanked in the liver, dying a slow painful death, that it was at least not done with a handgun.......LOL

REALLY DUDE!?!?! LOL

forget the weapon of choice, the point is limiting the populaces ability to protect itself will get people killed no matter how hard you try to control any weapons. Make laws that are heavily against people protecting themselves is bad.

I can jam a pen in your eye and kill you, laws on the books that can put you in jail for taking precausitons to protect yourself are more damaging than any weapon on the street

it's just particularly interesting how very heavy gun control laws in england have now seemed to cause an increase in the use of knife to do violence. as I said, knives scare me. much easier to use, kill someone, and most improtantly get away unscathed and unoticed........to fire a gun, your making a commitment that everyone and there mother will know you just used one, not so for knives.

strider

ohskigod wrote: »

I'm sure there will be comfort to the guy that got shanked in the liver, dying a slow painful death, that it was at least not done with a handgun.......LOL

REALLY DUDE!?!?! LOL

forget the weapon of choice, the point is limiting the populaces ability to protect itself will get people killed no matter how hard you try to control any weapons. Make laws that are heavily against people protecting themselves is bad.

I can jam a pen in your eye and kill you, laws on the books that can put you in jail for taking precausitons to protect yourself are more damaging than any weapon on the street

Sorry, I was just trying to see where Bobman was coming from, that's all. I know that this one of those topics that can get ugly quick, it seems to illicit a pretty strong response whenever it's brought up.

strider

bobman1235 wrote: »

The point is criminals will always find a way to commit crimes.

Cool, I wasn't trying to stir the pot or anything, just curious as to where you were coming from.

ohskigod

strider wrote: »

Sorry, I was just trying to see where Bobman was coming from, that's all. I know that this one of those topics that can get ugly quick, it seems to illicit a pretty strong response whenever it's brought up.

I hear ya bud. what really scares me is our country heading in that direction. given my positions, it might surprise you that I never owned a gun in my life. not a big gun man here, I am a big supported of a person's right to protect themselves though.

My general point is this, the only person responsible to protect you (you meaning anyone) is you.

for those that count on the cops?, if your actually attacked..have fun getting kicked, stomped, robbed, raped and possibly killed for the at least 10 minutes it takes for cops to get to you......and thats if your lucky enough to get the cell phone call off and tell cops where you actually are before getting stomped.

this is not a slight on cops, they can pnly do what they can do. theyre not clairvoyant. they can react to crime, not prevent it as well as one thinks.

Demiurge

ohskigod wrote: »

thsi article also ignites the "do you help someone in need" discusion we have had before.

I'd rather not make an assumption, so I'll ask, are you refering to the Horn case? If so, that guy wasn't helping anyone in need. If he was, the reaction that thread had would have been decidedly different.

krabby5

strider wrote: »

Sorry, I was just trying to see where Bobman was coming from, that's all. I know that this one of those topics that can get ugly quick, it seems to illicit a pretty strong response whenever it's brought up.

but what do you propose can stop this? Allow me to carry a knife in the UK to protect myself? That's assuming I even know how to handle a knife, which I don't. Not everyone is a martial arts specialist, or cares to learn the disclipline. Same with guns...you still have to know how to handle one to protect yourself..and most people don't..in fact more bad things may happen than good if any schlep started carrying guns to protect themselves..If one of those schleps (like myself) is getting robbed at gunpoint, I may lose some tangible assets, which sucks, but I am probably still alive if I don’t try and resist…but if I was carrying a gun and tried to stop the guy from robbing me, I might get shot in the process as well.

Bottom line… most people shouldn’t be carrying knives and guns to protect themselves since they don’t know how to use them anyways.

Now if you say everybody learn martial arts and self defense that is another story…but most people won’t go that route

ohskigod

Demiurge wrote: »

I'd rather not make an assumption, so I'll ask, are you refering to the Horn case? If so, that guy wasn't helping anyone in need. If he was, the reaction that thread had would have been decidedly different.

no, ya silly goose

cant remember it specifically, but I think it was some woman bartender getting stomped by a guy on tape (subequently a cop) and people standing around pretty much watching.

this article brings up that topic because the London mayor came out and said specifically if you see someone getting attacked, do nothing to help (read the article, its a hoot)

I have no idea if he means just do not intervene physically, or if that extends to at least being a witness and calling the cops for help

ohskigod

krabby5 wrote: »

Bottom line… most people shouldn’t be carrying knives and guns to protect themselves since they don’t know how to use them anyways.

your absolutly right, I'm not saying everyone should, but I am saying one should have the right to train and take proactive steps to protect themselves if they so choose. eliminating the right to do so isnt the answer, even if there is a large part of the populace that would choose not too even if the rights were broadenned.

dont want to carry anything, thats cool, like I said, I'm not a gun guy....hell, i'm not much of a knife guy, but have carried one if i know I;m going to a bad place. but in NJ, we cant even carry a tazer for god's sake........anything that can be contrued as a weapon (bat, stick, anything) in the eyes of a cop can be a ballbuster, and it shouldnt be that way.

Demiurge

krabby5 wrote: »

Same with guns...you still have to know how to handle one to protect yourself..and most people don't..in fact more bad things may happen than good if any schlep started carrying guns to protect themselves..If one of those schleps (like myself) is getting robbed at gunpoint, I may lose some tangible assets, which sucks, but I am probably still alive if I don’t try and resist…but if I was carrying a gun and tried to stop the guy from robbing me, I might get shot in the process as well.

Such a flawed argument.

First, the majority of idiots with guns are usually gang bangers, who have the proclivity to turn the gun sideways when they attempt empty the clip into some punk **** **** that looked at them the wrong way, hitting everything but the intended target. They're also not carrying legally anyways.

Second, in order to carry you need a permit, something that most people don't go through. It's not easy to get that permit. Extensive training is involved and the people who choose to carry legally are responsible. It's not the CCW people that are getting into trouble with the law. This part of your argument is completely emotionally charged. Some people will get the permits, which puts the unknown factor out there for the criminal element to ponder.

Thirdly, anyone who is willing to pull a gun on you is willing to kill you. To not make that assumption is asinine. The criminal is in control of you when you're not armed. If you've ever been robbed, you know there's a sequence of events. You need to act quickly. You can get shot whether you do something or don't. When you have a gun, you at least have a chance and some control over the situation.

Lastly, anything can be a weapon. I can pound your face in with a stapler if I want to. You can't keep baning inanimate objects because they incite emotional reactions. It's completely illogical.

ohskigod

Zero wrote: »

It's a lovely place where you are stripped of any way to adequately defend yourself should the event arise. Apparently, these events are happening so much that citizens are now encouraged to turn a blind eye if they happen to see someone being maliciously attacked. What a wonderful place! .......... What scares me is that I see our own country following a similar path....

Zero,


ya got my point in a nutshell

congrats...LOL

polktiger

krabby5 wrote: »

Bottom line… most people shouldn’t be carrying knives and guns to protect themselves since they don’t know how to use them anyways.

Good point - So, if we can teach kids in 5th grade how to have safe sex, why can't we also be teaching them self-defense and gun safety?

strider

krabby5 wrote: »

but what do you propose can stop this? Allow me to carry a knife in the UK to protect myself? That's assuming I even know how to handle a knife, which I don't. Not everyone is a martial arts specialist, or cares to learn the disclipline. Same with guns...you still have to know how to handle one to protect yourself..and most people don't..in fact more bad things may happen than good if any schlep started carrying guns to protect themselves..If one of those schleps (like myself) is getting robbed at gunpoint, I may lose some tangible assets, which sucks, but I am probably still alive if I don’t try and resist…but if I was carrying a gun and tried to stop the guy from robbing me, I might get shot in the process as well.

Bottom line… most people shouldn’t be carrying knives and guns to protect themselves since they don’t know how to use them anyways.

Now if you say everybody learn martial arts and self defense that is another story…but most people won’t go that route

My proposal? ****, thanks for the credit, but hell if I know. You ban guns, then the only people that have them are criminals. Doesn't make sense to me. Everyone learns martial arts, that would be cool, maybe teach a lot of people some needed self discipline, but have have you ever seen Indiana Jones? Great sword work buddy, but I'm just going to shoot you. Whatever way you look at it, it's a pretty complex issue.

sophie

hmm everyone could make something like this....

strider

sophie wrote: »

hmm everyone could make something like this....

Macrame?

Face

sophie wrote: »

hmm everyone could make something like this....

That's a lot cooler and more comfortable than a real vest.

ohskigod

I know of some knife proof armor out there, seems the ones that are stab proof (thrusting stab) are actually more expensive then bulletproof armor, go figure

also, if I am not mistaken, illegal in some places. which is funny, I dont think people are going to try to smother people with there knife proof vests anytime soon

Ron-P

Illegal or not, I'd just carry a gun.

polktiger

ohskigod wrote: »

I know of some knife proof armor out there, seems the ones that are stab proof (thrusting stab) are actually more expensive then bulletproof armor, go figure

also, if I am not mistaken, illegal in some places. which is funny, I dont think people are going to try to smother people with there knife proof vests anytime soon

I have normally seen them as a plate insert to a bullet proof vest.

Intrestingly, the history channel (probably the most watched channel in our house by a huge margin) has a 1 to 2 hour show on the history of knives/swords and armor. Its was really intresting. It went over how different swords/knives are used and how armor evolved in response to different bladed weapons.

Face

FYI, some, if not most armor companies are no longer using metal inserts in body armor. This is due to the possibility of the bullet ricocheting upwards to the individual's head. Some are now using a extra piece of Kevlar in it's place.

Polk user

The U.K. is FINISHED as we knew it. It is now being run by a bunch of P.C. loons. The sad part is its heading here.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1031126/White-man-convicted-racial-abuse-making-honky-jibe-WHITE-security-guards.html

Music Joe

Dragon Skin would be nice.

Weeks ago around the time the the man in Japan went Apesh%T with a truck and a knife I was bleery-eyed and half watching UK Parliament on C-span (not by choice) and a gentleman from Labour or Liberal suggested opening a dialogue to knife control. He said it with such a straight face...oh that English wit
They so avoided talking specifics or detail 'coupled with my inattention' I assumed they were speaking of the Japanese attack.
I see the story of a man P'od at cops stabbed to death five Chinese police officers.

Knife control, sheesh...even prisoners can pack shanks. It's not the tools but the will.

Ron-P

Face it, we are slowly headed back to the Old West.

bobman1235

I'd take the old West over the Brave New World.

zombie boy 2000

sophie wrote: »

hmm everyone could make something like this....

Didn't Freddie Mercury where something like that?