Its tough to pick a house!
Comments
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I don't know about all this gobly **** we are talking about. I bought my first house 18 years ago. I have done nothing to it for 18 years. I sold it for twice what it cost me new. If you take the total I paid over the years on insurance, HOA, mortgage, taxes, everything, divide it up over the time I lived there and subtract the sales price it ended up costing me $81 per month to live there. This could have been less if I had actually done anything to the house. Lets say I rented an equal place. Pretty much it would have cost me about $1200 a month. Why would I EVER prefer $1200 a month over $81 a month?
madmax
I'm talking economic theory and the market NOW, because the cost of owning a single family home now is high compared to renting (in general). It worked for you to buy a long time ago. BUT...what if you had been able to rent...at a savings over buying and maintaining a home...then invested the difference. If the cost of your home ownership vs the return of the equity markets had been equal to the average over the last 18 years...you would have earned a greater return in the market and you would have had a larger investment account than the equity you realized when you sold your home. Home ownership is more of a form of "forced" savings. Long term it can be ok...as madmax proved. But ask a hundred people who bought a home in the last 5 years how that investment is working out. 70% will probably say they are down significantly. The same holds true for the equity market...but there is a difference. With stocks you can easily liquidate what you have and re-invest in a different sector that has a good chance of recouping your losses. Thats not going to happen with a single family home...at least not quickly.
I guess it is really a moot issue. For the majority of people their home will be their largest "investment" and the one that returns them the most. That is not the case for me. I have owned my home for 22 years. I've made significant inprovements. I can write off the taxes and insurance on my tax return. It has some equity and has certainly increased in value over time...probably doubled or a little more. On the other hand. My 401Ks and IRAs are worth significantly more than my home and have a superior rate of return over the same time frame. And this is based upon a much smaller percentage of my income. I do believe home ownership IS A GOOD THING to do. However, because of the "overinflated" growth during the early part of this century (due to artificial market conditions), many view it as a great windfall investment...but it really isn't. I really wonder if people that are buying a home now and considering that they are getting a great bargain...will discover in 5 years that in reality they actually bought a home at a reasonable value...and have realized the 3-5% annual rate of return of the past. Only time will tell.
Good luck in your search for a home Chuck!"Just because youre offended doesnt mean youre right." - Ricky Gervais
"For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase
"Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson -
Given the dire state of real estate right now it turns out that my lack of maintainence and upgrading REALLY paid off. Pretty much, my house went for the same price as those which had significant upgrades. Sure it was 10K less than others are getting but I've put almost no money into it. To get that extra 10K others have put tons of cash into their houses. My particular one actually had water pipes leaking, was 50% unfinished (upstairs) etc. Did that hinder buyers? NOT AT ALL! They seemed to be thrilled to find it for slightly less on price. One of the realtors told me "sure, you can fix it up before you sell it but what you will end up with is a house like everyone elses which they cant sell. I had 10 people a day looking through the house and all of them seemed very interested. It actually sold to the second person who looked at it. The first person wanted it but couldn't meet the asking price.
madmax
Edit: BTW, out here it is not cheaper to rent. You can rent a $150K house for $1200 a month. You can buy for cheaper. Also, the rental prices keep going up. Why, because people can't get loans to buy. The less people who buy, the higher the rentals go for.Vinyl, the final frontier...
Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... -
LOCATION x 3. No joke.
Gas is getting expensive and that trend is likely to continue. Buy a house that has been thoroughly updated with all the granite and good windows, and recent appliances mentioned above, but get one with a close commute, near to bars and restaurants and close to grocery shopping. Can you walk everywhere or get to public transportation easily? In ten years, that is what people will value. Think like a European. Stay away from the suburbs; gas ain't free anymore. These kind of houses will appreciate in value while the suburbs will be dead when gas passes 5 buck per gal.
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First off congrats Madmax! I think that size will be just fine..if not tad to big..but who am I to judge..
As fo not buying in the burbs...well not sure what your burbs are like, but here they are almost a small city in its self. Everything is near by. I can walk to all major box stores, the only thing we don't have are great restaurants, in time we will. But then it makes it more of an outing to go d-town o a nice bite. When I'm back to work, we both work in the D-town core and it'sthe only time we go there unless we plan for it. There is no reason to leave our "bubble". So gas even at $5/g, we would still not have a prob. Don't diss the burbs ! -
Yeah, everyone predicting the death of the suburbs, I"d love to know where they think everyone is going to fit, considering most American cities are crowded already.If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
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Investing in a house for short term gain is foolish. It worked during the 'boom' of earlier this decade, but the premise of 12-20% growth per year was ridiculous to believe could be sustained. Even at its best growth, our economy could never sustain it for long. As a Realtor, I'm seeing 'wanna-be' investors who tried riding the bubble (really, they were driving it), go broke one by one as the quik flips they were hoping for turned into monkeys on their backs. It was foolish to think it'd last for much longer. The other ones that tried 'cashing in' by driving their equity around (now at $4+/gal) and expecting to get that back quickly are helping out the crash also.
Always remember, Real Estate is a LONG-TERM investment, and as such has historically proven itself to be one of the best. Every market has its ups and downs and as such, when we reach a 'boom' the ones who really profit are the ones that are first-in, first-out. Trying to ride it for all it's worth many times leads to disaster, as we are seeing now.
The third part, GREED, on the behalf of the lenders with their teaser rates and ballooning payments as they unscrupulously stuck it to their mortgagers are paying the price now as they are stuck with hundreds of empty, trashed homes. And if not already out of business, are taking on average 65% of the value of the mortgage just to unload their inventory.
When buying a home, always remember to just get the best you can find for what you can comfortably afford. Be smart, dont buy if your not able to spend 5-6 years in the place. Use a good Realtor and lender. They know that particular market better than anyone, and from the buying side don't cost you a dime (the Realtor that is). Do your homework, and once you find good ones, listen to what they have to say. Again they do know more than the average buyer.
Afterall, if they are good, its not all about the money now, its on the return visits a few years down the road as the people they gave good adice to come back for another round.
I hope this made a little sense.If there ain't no gold at the end of the rainbow, I'll settle for the pot.
Yamaha RX-A2020
2-Sony DVP-CX995V 400 Disc players
Sony BDP-S580 Blu-Ray Player
Mains:Polk RT2000P
Center: Polk CS400
Rears: Polk FXi A6
Subs:2-Polk PSW450 -
I hope this made a little sense.
That made a LOT of sense! Thanks!
I did let the realtor steer me towards and away from different properties. I was very impressed with him because he wanted to know EXACTLY what my plans were before he would give any comments.
madmaxVinyl, the final frontier...
Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... -
Friday I get to go through the 4 hour excitement of a complete inspection. It seems to me its not even worth it unless they find something structural. There goes another $300...
madmaxVinyl, the final frontier...
Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... -
They are not going to find much with a 5 years old home but I feel it's a cheap way to get leverage on the seller. That's always the big fear for the seller, the inspection report.
Sounds like you got yourself a nice place.Main Gear
Panasonic 50" Plasma, Polk LSi15 (Front), LSiC, LSi7 (Rear), Sherwood Newcastle AVP-9080, AM-9080 bi-amp to LSi15, AM-9080 bi-amp to LSiC and LSi7. -
Max --
Got pics?HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50 LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub
"God grooves with tubes." -
You'd be suprised. Generally find more things with newer construction than anything else. If there's anything structural or an adverse material defect, that should be on the property condition report (if your state requires one, they should).
Don't get bent out of shape on minor, little piddly things. Address things that'll affect health or safety or moderate defects that may later lead to rot of some sort (bad soffit, facia, caulking etc). Other than that, the inspection really is to let you know as a buyer what to expect, and point out mostly preventative maint issues to keep the house up to snuff.
In the offer to purchase, I generally do not give the seller the right to cure defects until I see what the inspection brings. Then I address anything that may warrant attention thru an amendment, then giving the right to cure.
One word of advice on the right of the seller to cure. In most states, the law says the repair must be done 'in a good, workman-like manner'. That means it does NOT have to be done by a licensed contractor. With some defects, you're better off using it to bargain for money off, or an allowance to be used after close for a contractor to fix. Your Realtor should know how to handle it, sounds like he/she is good.
Hope that helps.
Oh, BTW, if anyone has a Real Estate question, please feel free to ask or drop me a PM, I'd be happy to help. Depending on your particular state's laws, I may not have the perfect answer, but may be able to give you a hand on how to better convey your concerns to your agent.If there ain't no gold at the end of the rainbow, I'll settle for the pot.
Yamaha RX-A2020
2-Sony DVP-CX995V 400 Disc players
Sony BDP-S580 Blu-Ray Player
Mains:Polk RT2000P
Center: Polk CS400
Rears: Polk FXi A6
Subs:2-Polk PSW450 -
Oops, cant reply to PM's if yer a lurker like me, SPAM,.....gotta get up to 10 postsIf there ain't no gold at the end of the rainbow, I'll settle for the pot.
Yamaha RX-A2020
2-Sony DVP-CX995V 400 Disc players
Sony BDP-S580 Blu-Ray Player
Mains:Polk RT2000P
Center: Polk CS400
Rears: Polk FXi A6
Subs:2-Polk PSW450 -
More SpamIf there ain't no gold at the end of the rainbow, I'll settle for the pot.
Yamaha RX-A2020
2-Sony DVP-CX995V 400 Disc players
Sony BDP-S580 Blu-Ray Player
Mains:Polk RT2000P
Center: Polk CS400
Rears: Polk FXi A6
Subs:2-Polk PSW450 -
Spam on toastIf there ain't no gold at the end of the rainbow, I'll settle for the pot.
Yamaha RX-A2020
2-Sony DVP-CX995V 400 Disc players
Sony BDP-S580 Blu-Ray Player
Mains:Polk RT2000P
Center: Polk CS400
Rears: Polk FXi A6
Subs:2-Polk PSW450 -
Spam with eggs, this should do it,...sorry guys n girlsIf there ain't no gold at the end of the rainbow, I'll settle for the pot.
Yamaha RX-A2020
2-Sony DVP-CX995V 400 Disc players
Sony BDP-S580 Blu-Ray Player
Mains:Polk RT2000P
Center: Polk CS400
Rears: Polk FXi A6
Subs:2-Polk PSW450 -
Also do a radon test. Lots of that here in colorado."Don't forget to change your politician. They are like diapers they need to be changed regularly, and for the same reason."
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Radon, especially if there's a basement, even more so if it has a sump-pump and new construction is the worst as far as that goes.If there ain't no gold at the end of the rainbow, I'll settle for the pot.
Yamaha RX-A2020
2-Sony DVP-CX995V 400 Disc players
Sony BDP-S580 Blu-Ray Player
Mains:Polk RT2000P
Center: Polk CS400
Rears: Polk FXi A6
Subs:2-Polk PSW450 -
The purpose of a home inspection is primarily to beat up the seller and down the list aways is the part about discovering problems in the home. New homes are the worst and a GOOD inspector will find plenty. You should get your $300 back and then some.
The knowlegable seller always assumes the inspection will turn up problems and they are generally prepaired to give up a little to settle the deal.
Use the inspection as a negotiating tool. Act as if the results of the inspection frighten you beyond consolation. Remember, you are and have always been an ignorant ****, you cant pick a screwdriver from a tool box and you can't change a lightbulb without hiring an election. All that stuff that the inspector found will require an army of experts and tradesmen. Oh Lord... The Horror!The world is full of answers, some are right and some are wrong. - Neil Young -
MadMax,
This is the Clubhouse so let me bore you with a story. The house I live in now was for sale back when the market was overheated. The previous owners were the type of people who really did hire electricians to change lightbulbs. They had a sale lined up and it fell through because they hired an inspector who did his job and "found" all sorts of HORRORS, including a door bell that went dong instead of ding dong. Well the buyers drank the coolaide. They really were the type that would hire an army of experts and tradesmen. They ran away in fear before the inspector could explain the rules of the game.
Anyway, I got ahold of the report and was comfortable with the deficiencies in this then 3 year old house. I made an offer contingent on nothing (no inspection). They took my offer over several others that were much higher because 1) they new the other inspections were going to cost them SOMETHING and 2) my offer was a sure thing and 3) the previous inspector had convinced them their house was a POS.
The moral, if one can be found, is 1) don't drink the coolaide 2) don't underestimate the level of nurosis that selling a house can cause and 3) don't let anyone tell you that a home inspection has no bargaining value.The world is full of answers, some are right and some are wrong. - Neil Young -
They had a sale lined up and it fell through because they hired an inspector who did his job and "found" all sorts of HORRORS, including a door bell that went dong instead of ding dong. Well the buyers drank the coolaide. They really were the type that would hire an army of experts and tradesmen. They ran away in fear before the inspector could explain the rules of the game.
Oh Man, this is priceless...Vinyl, the final frontier...
Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... -
4500 sq. ft is a big house. I hope you like to clean...;)
Definitely get a thorough inspection. You mentioned development, and that just makes me shudder... Especially with the McMansions... -
Everything here is either in a developement or is over a hundred years old. There isn't much in between. Yes, I do like to clean. However, I'm thinking I'll be doing less of it with enough room to spread out my stuff.Vinyl, the final frontier...
Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... -
Oops, cant reply to PM's if yer a lurker like me, SPAM,.....gotta get up to 10 posts
You got 11 now, congrats! Don't be a lurker, get in trouble with your posts like the rest of us!Vinyl, the final frontier...
Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... -
Just make sure you don't have a shot of being downwind of Greeley. If you haven't smelled it yet, you will...There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin
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Its a good distance away and on top of a hill so I think I'm OK. The locals told me about this. I see why one area is premium and another is not. The first house I was looking at was in a bad area and I didn't know it.
Oh yea, about the inspection story I thought that was pretty funny because the morning the buyers of my house came to have it inspected a valve went bad on the toilet and had the basement floor all wet. I could have crapped myself when I saw it.
madmaxVinyl, the final frontier...
Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... -
I went through the inspection process today. It was a waste of money, not a single problem was found. I kinda figured this would happen considering the condition. If nothing else at least I know a little more about the home. The inspector sent a few hours going over all the systems in the house. I found that there was a full computer network installed. I didn't even notice it when I looked the first time. It has connections in every room, a wireless router and a big box full of wiring options. I hadn't even noticed it because it looked so "factory". It was put in when the house was built. When brought to my attention I had to admit it was a better looking system than the small company I worked for had. Pretty awesome! There is a pretty upscale alarm system included too. These people really had an interest in this stuff when they built the house. All in all, everything was pretty impressive. I got to meet the owner too. They were having a garage sale when we were there so obviously I asked if other items in the house were for sale. I bought a complete livingroom setup, kitchen stuff with a counter/sitting stools and a washer and dryer for $1100. Just the washer and dryer seemed reasonable for the price. Nice people, that makes a difference mentally. They are leaving everything else they do not want to move also such as a bunch of planter trees and misc other stuff. We connected and it went well. This looks like a cool situation overall. Way more than I expected. Now I just need a few more pieces of tube equipment to finish up the multiple listening systems and I will be set!
madmaxVinyl, the final frontier...
Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... -
Well then, it was a good inspection. No problems, peace of mind and more knowledge of the house. Not really a waste of time or money at all.If there ain't no gold at the end of the rainbow, I'll settle for the pot.
Yamaha RX-A2020
2-Sony DVP-CX995V 400 Disc players
Sony BDP-S580 Blu-Ray Player
Mains:Polk RT2000P
Center: Polk CS400
Rears: Polk FXi A6
Subs:2-Polk PSW450 -
Did they give any indication of why they were selling? I'm just nosey!I refuse to argue with idiots, because people can't tell the DIFFERENCE!