Gas prices

zingo

I do feel a little bad for the station owners. I remember a few years ago when some people thought gas was starting to sky-rocket, in the Seattle area a station owner thought it would be cool to sell gas .30 less than the surrounding stations. A few days later, corporate has pulled his sponsorship and closed his station because "he couldn't set the prices" they claimed.

On the other hand I'm pissed because Congress has the oil companies hands tied with drilling for more oil, opening more refineries or anything! Anything on their part would help beause part of the price of gas and crude is "oil futures" and it would show that we aren't just taking it lying down. But oil companies are just not allow to do anything right now with all the restrictions and regulations. It seems to be lose-lose.

zingo

San Mateo, Calif.

Jstas

It's still $3.99 for Sunoco Ultra 93 right down the street from me.

xsmi

Demiurge wrote: »

The gas station doesn't really make money on gas. They make it on concessions and other crap, just like a movie theater. I feel bad for gas station owners that get bitched at by their customers for the prices on the pumps -- they have no control over it.

I wouldn't have done it, but that's just me.

This is somewhat of a myth. Day to Day a show on NPR spent a day with a station owner and they do have some latitude on what they charge. No the profit is not as big as we think it is, but to say they make no money on gas is inaccurate as well.

polkatese

Where's the power be? Are they all in hiding or suddenly lost words? At this rate, if "R" is not here yet as the claimed, surely this price trend will push the economy over the cliff.

Demiurge

xsmi wrote: »

This is somewhat of a myth. Day to Day a show on NPR spent a day with a station owner and they do have some latitude on what they charge. No the profit is not as big as we think it is, but to say they make no money on gas is inaccurate as well.

/facepalm

Okay, Mr. Literal, the phrase "they don't really make money on gas," is an expression. There's not a single gas station in this country that could sustain itself on just selling gas. There's very little profit in it. They make their living on the general public buying sodas, candy bars, and cigarettes with their gas.

Also -- NPR -- lol?

If you want to complain about the price of gas you can start with the government who taxes the ever loving **** out of the stuff. They make more profit on a gallon of gas than the oil companies and the station owners combined. Where's the outrage?

zingo

Demiurge wrote: »

If you want to complain about the price of gas you can start with the government who taxes the ever loving **** out of the stuff. They make more profit on a gallon of gas than the oil companies and the station owners combined. Where's the outrage?

Amen. Washingtom makes .55 a gallon on gas and .60 a gallon on diesel; second highest in the country behind California. And that's just state tax!

petrym

zingo wrote: »

Amen. Washingtom makes .55 a gallon on gas and .60 a gallon on diesel; second highest in the country behind California. And that's just state tax!

We should be glad that the gov't tax is fixed and not based on a sliding percentage scale on the base cost of the gasoline.

zingo

I know, but it still feels like robbery.

Deadof_knight

Diesel ,is a byproduct of making gasoline so whats the deal with it being higher than gas.....it used to be half of what gas is.... Damn oil companies money mogels!

xsmi

Demiurge wrote: »

/facepalm

Okay, Mr. Literal, the phrase "they don't really make money on gas," is an expression. There's not a single gas station in this country that could sustain itself on just selling gas. There's very little profit in it. They make their living on the general public buying sodas, candy bars, and cigarettes with their gas.

Also -- NPR -- lol?

If you want to complain about the price of gas you can start with the government who taxes the ever loving **** out of the stuff. They make more profit on a gallon of gas than the oil companies and the station owners combined. Where's the outrage?

I wasn't being literal. What I am saying is that When you have a .20 per gallon difference in gas prices from the same brand in the same city, these prices are being set by the stores themselves by what is being charged in that area. Toledo is not a large city and for them to set these prices so differently says to me that there is some latitude in their pricing. I don't disagree that the huge bulk of their profits come from inside the store but, why sale gas if you can't make money from it. Some stores in this city selling the same brand of gas as the guy across town I think is making a little more profit than his counterpart. Is he entitled to that? If the market will bare it, yes.

WilliamM2

I don't disagree that the huge bulk of their profits come from inside the store but, why sale gas if you can't make money from it.

To attract people to buy the items in the store. Everyone needs gas.

Demiurge

xsmi wrote: »

I wasn't being literal. What I am saying is that When you have a .20 per gallon difference in gas prices from the same brand in the same city, these prices are being set by the stores themselves by what is being charged in that area. Toledo is not a large city and for them to set these prices so differently says to me that there is some latitude in their pricing. I don't disagree that the huge bulk of their profits come from inside the store but, why sale gas if you can't make money from it. Some stores in this city selling the same brand of gas as the guy across town I think is making a little more profit than his counterpart. Is he entitled to that? If the market will bare it, yes.

There are brands and blends of gas. They're not all getting gas from ABC Gas, Inc. Gas will relatively be competitively priced across the board, but BP gas is going to be more expensive than Acme gas.

The gas station owners aren't to blame here, and your anger or whatever is completely misplaced.

You asked "Why sell gas if you can't make money from it?" Obviously you're taking my comment that they don't make money on gas quite literally, right?

The gas gets people to the store to purchase the items that have all of the markup. It's a catalyst for more business, but by no means is gas where they're making much of their profits.

I'll just accept your premise for a moment...Why is one station selling for $0.20 less than another station in town when gas was $1.50/gallon any different than now when gas is $4.00/gallon? The profit margin (which means EVERYTHING in business) hasn't changed at all. Is the station supposed to take it in the shorts because gas is "too expensive" now? How come the government doesn't have to tax less? How come we can't forego all of the fuel mixtures forced in certain states that drive up the price of gas? Why would the onus be on the guy trying to make a living to take in less money just because the price of the commodity tripled in price?

The gas station owners aren't the blame for the price of gas and as much as this will hurt to hear -- neither are the oil companies. You can pin almost all of this on three things:

Government Regulation/Mandates
Taxes
Increased Global Consuption

polktiger

True - Gas station owners do not have a large profit on the actual gas sales to the customer. I am a CPA and have done the accounting for gas stations in the past, so I have seen real world numbers. However, they do have some discretion. That is why some BP stations will have price differences. It is also why some areas of a town always have "expensive" or "cheap" gas. Each store has its own fixed costs, so they adjust prices accordingly.

However, to say there is NO profit in the gas sales is completely false even if sold at cost becuase many refineries offer volume rebates to the stations. This is the profit in the gas for many stations. I have seen some stations sell at break even on the marginal price of gas just to keep or increase their volume to preserve the size of the rebate from the refinery. While many operators see this rebate as "other income," it is properly accounted for as a reduction to cost of sales - gas.

Serendipity

Just filled up today.

Demiurge

polktiger wrote: »

True - Gas station owners do not have a large profit on the actual gas sales to the customer. I am a CPA and have done the accounting for gas stations in the past, so I have seen real world numbers. However, they do have some discretion. That is why some BP stations will have price differences. It is also why some areas of a town always have "expensive" or "cheap" gas. Each store has its own fixed costs, so they adjust prices accordingly.

However, to say there is NO profit in the gas sales is completely false even if sold at cost becuase many refineries offer volume rebates to the stations. This is the profit in the gas for many stations. I have seen some stations sell at break even on the marginal price of gas just to keep or increase their volume to preserve the size of the rebate from the refinery. While many operators see this rebate as "other income," it is properly accounted for as a reduction to cost of sales - gas.

Of course they have discretion. We're talkling pennies/gallon. Some perspective is certainly in order. The comments being made in this thread are that somehow gas station owners are striking it rich because of the price of oil. They're not. Their margins haven't changed.

I know there is some profit in gas. I think I clarified that point a few times now. My point is that it's a very small portion of what sustains them as a business. To say that it's okay to take advantage of the mistake of a gas station employee because their supposedly making money hand over fist because of the price of gas is 100% false.

I'm paying the same price for gas as the rest of you. I'm just not appaled at the guys who happen to sell the end product. They're not the enemy here.

xsmi

Demi,

Calm down man. My point is that the BP near me sells gas .20 more than the BP across town. In some cases it is less than a mile. I have never meant that we should be angry at the gas station itself, but being the point man in the industry it is easy to blame them first. (We have really hijacked this thread) If I seemed to imply that the station is making money hand over fist, I apologize.

Demiurge

xsmi wrote: »

Demi,

Calm down man. My point is that the BP near me sells gas .20 more than the BP across town. In some cases it is less than a mile. I have never meant that we should be angry at the gas station itself, but being the point man in the industry it is easy to blame them first. (We have really hijacked this thread) If I seemed to imply that the station is making money hand over fist, I apologize.

I'm perfectly calm.

This part of the discussion got started when it was mentioned that an employee at a gas station posted a price incorrectly and people started taking advantage of the mistake and others chimed in implying it was okay because of the price of gas.

I am just asking why it's okay to take advantage of it. The rationale seems to be the high price of gas, even though it's not really the gas station owners who made it go from $1.50 to $4.00+. It's the price of the commodity in gas - oil. See where I am going here?

If you think a 20 cent swing in gas is the problem here I think you're barking up the wrong tree. We can argue all day about this. Where is the other station? Is it on a freeway? etc. etc....there are factors for everything in the marketplace, but I guess it's just easier to pretend we're all being screwed. I'll accept the premise -- why don't you just patronize the guy selling gas 20 cents on the gallon less if it's only a mile down the street? If the guy selling his gas for more is gauging the consumer the market will take care of itself.

treitz3

I apologize for yesterday's post. I guess I'm partly to blame for derailing the thread. I thought that I would give you an update. I drove back by that same shop today, guess what? Price still at $3.09 for super unleaded. :eek: Some people just need to be shot.

If it's still that way tomorrow, I'll try to find out who the owner is. I was floored when I saw that the price hadn't changed. Oh well. Glad I don't own the station.

Serendipity

Just a thought...

I should've filled up some extra cans of gas since the price doesn't seem to be going down, only up.

It seems like the price of premium will be up another 10 cents ($4.69) soon!!

xsmi

Demiurge wrote: »

If you think a 20 cent swing in gas is the problem here I think you're barking up the wrong tree. We can argue all day about this. Where is the other station? Is it on a freeway? etc. etc....there are factors for everything in the marketplace, but I guess it's just easier to pretend we're all being screwed. I'll accept the premise -- why don't you just patronize the guy selling gas 20 cents on the gallon less if it's only a mile down the street? If the guy selling his gas for more is gauging the consumer the market will take care of itself.

I was using the .20 swing in price to show that there is some latitude in pricing. Both shops are in residential neighborhoods. Both neighborhoods seem to be about the same demographically it is just one of the quirks of this city I guess. But, its been that way as long as I have been here. BTW, I do patronize the cheaper shops.

Danny Tse

$4.07/gallon this morning for 87 regular unleaded. Over $40.00 to fill up a Civic is just plain sick.

Norm Apter

I don't have a car, but on my nightly run, just saw that the cheapest stuff is going for $4.45 and the premium for $4.75. I run by the same gas station every night and have been noticing the price creep up week by week, day by day. Unless something reverses the trend, it looks like we're going to be seeing $5 within two weeks.

michael_w

Funny how these threads come up and then people talk of alternatives, but in the end we all just suck it up and pay the price

Btw, $5.25usd / gal for regular / 87 here. Painful.

One of my local gas station makes most their money off of the shop that's also part of the building doing mostly small repairs and oil changes. The only item out of the snack shop that gets regular movement is the occasional drink and a few packs of smokes (I know because I worked there). Not much of a profit margin on gas for them although they do set their own prices according to whatever they feel will go well -- aka, drive around to the other stations and beat that price by half a penny.

bobman1235

To those of you who insist on not putting your location in your info, can you throw out an idea of where you are when posting these prices? I'm curious which parts of the country are so expensive (we're still around 3.85 here).

Serendipity

bobman1235 wrote: »

To those of you who insist on not putting your location in your info, can you throw out an idea of where you are when posting these prices? I'm curious which parts of the country are so expensive (we're still around 3.85 here).

Oh that's NYC, for the prices I posted.

RuSsMaN

I'm using a pogo stick to go to work today.

Serendipity

I'm riding my bike today.

I need to save up some money for that Polk I-Sonic ES

SKsolutions

$3.83 was the best price I saw for 'ethanol added, knock & ping 87'.
Metro Boston.

Gadabout

Deadof_knight wrote: »

Diesel ,is a byproduct of making gasoline so whats the deal with it being higher than gas.....it used to be half of what gas is.... Damn oil companies money mogels!

Not to say they aren't making a larger percentage of profit on diesel, cause I just don't know. However, ever since they made 15ppm sulfur diesel mandatory the prices have stayed higher than gas.

Not sure if that is an actual cause or if the profit margin is just higher on diesel.

I can say that Oklahoma has some of the lowest prices on diesel for the places I drive. The big shocker was when I drove to Colorado in April. For the first time gas & diesel was cheaper in Colorado than in Texas or Oklahoma. That has never happened in the 12 years I have been working this job.

BTW ... Diesel was $4.55 as I filled up and left Texas, $4.51 in OK & probably lower in OKC.
Regular was $3.83 in Texas when I left town today. Around here in Southern OK, regular is $3.85. (Regular = 87 Octane, No ethanol)