JP MorganChase bought Bear Stearns for practically a penny on the dollar - wow

Sami

dorokusai wrote: »

How can you compare this to the fall of Rome....ridiculous.

It's an empire crumbling, and it won't happen overnight, but eventually it will.

dorokusai

Then you should buy some plane tickets in advance....or sooner.

Sami

dorokusai wrote: »

Then you should buy some plane tickets in advance....or sooner.

If you would have read what I said you would have noticed I am not comparing this to the fall of Rome, it's not yet there. When the US economy finally sinks, it marks the end of USA's reign as the world superpower, and that includes military. It most likely won't happen in our lifetime, at least I hope so, but it will happen.

It was a direct response to rskarvan's comment about military, and economy and military go hand in hand.

dorokusai

www.southwest.com

AndyGwis

So. . . do I need to learn mandarin now?

US will be fine long term (fingers and toes crossed). I'm just happy I was too lazy to put more money in the market the past few months. I look like a genius making my 2-3% in the MoneyMarkets as opposed to losing 5-10% in the stock markets.

Now, just need to buy some good stocks at these clearance sale prices and watch them float back to normal levels. Money's cheap!!!!

AndyGwis

Then you should buy some plane tickets in advance....or sooner.

www.southwest.com

Dude, Southwest has their own problems to deal with right now. They need to tighten their nuts and bolts better or something

bobman1235

Predicting that the economy will collapse and take the country with it is one thing, even though I disagree.

Comparing it to the fall of Rome is just mimicking a common and stupid sound bite that's floating around, and dumbing down a very complex situation into pseudo-intellectual crap. If you think the global economy is similar now to what it was in 400 AD or whenever Rome fell, you need to have your head examined.

dkg999

I would think Russia for the potential new super power, at least militarily. The old Russian federation has some real potential. There's some bumps in the road for China, and the ghosts of Chairman Mao are floating through the countryside.

Sami

bobman1235 wrote: »

Comparing it to the fall of Rome

bobman, I could have said the British Empire, Greek Empire, Babylonian Empire. The point was: "Granted it won't happen over night", meaning a shift in power. US is a world power because the economy has been good and it has enabled a strong military. Eventually there will be a shift in power, and the ever weakening US dollar is a bad sign, but like I said I don't think it will be in our lifetime. Who knows, there might be a huge turnaround but there also might not be.

We can revisit the thread in 200 years to see what happened.

Sami

dkg999 wrote: »

I would think Russia for the potential new super power

Very true. The best potential in the short term IMO is in Europe but the nationalistic pride dividing EU is way too strong for it to happen in real life. Maybe a generation or two will fix that problem.

carpenter

Guys, especially Sami, why be so negative? you can look at recent developments as the
beginning of an economical sync, or you can look at it as a wake up call.
Just to remind you, in the 1930's the US economy suffered the worst depression imaginable, and I don't think you need to be a history buff in order to know how the rest of the 20TH century developed.

nms

carpenter wrote: »

Guys, especially Sami, why be so negative? you can look at recent developments as the
beginning of an economical sync, or you can look at it as a wake up call.
Just to remind you, in the 1930's the US economy suffered the worst depression imaginable, and I don't think you need to be a history buff in order to know how the rest of the 20TH century developed.

Right, because we had the largest and bloodiest war in human history to yank our economy out of its funk. Without WWII the Great Depression would have been around for a lot longer.

So this leads to the conclusion.... when your economy tanks, go to war! Oh wait, we did that in 2003! :rolleyes:

carpenter

In the meanwhile Lehman Brothers stock drops 40% :eek: ...... ouch....

Demiurge

It's one thing to have a realistic negative opinion. It's another thing to work towards making sure the opinion becomes reality.

Some people posting in this thread aren't originally from America, and are Americans on paper at best. Happily sucking on the American teat and doing everything in your power to tear it down.

Nice.

carpenter

nms wrote: »

Right, because we had the largest and bloodiest war in human history to yank our economy out of its funk. Without WWII the Great Depression would have been around for a lot longer.

So this leads to the conclusion.... when your economy tanks, go to war! Oh wait, we did that in 2003! :rolleyes:

I'm sure you were joking. in the beginning of the 40s, before the US entered WW2 (thanks again Toyota ) the economy was already well on its way to recovery.

tonyb

dkg999 wrote: »

The economy of easy credit and living beyond your means is now facing a reality check and a squaring up of the balance sheet.

Bingo!! That is of coarse untill the lazy ones start crying again because mortgage companys are too strict in handing out loans.This always runs in cycles,things tighten up and a few years down the line,they loosen again.

Strong Bad

For some reason, I can only see the good in this big mess! A correction every now and then kicks this country in the ****. Remember the DOT COM Bubble of the '90's? The Real Estate bubble will be no different. Everything will get fixed and some other damn bubble will burst in about 10 years that will have Rome falling again.

Thanks for the link Doro. I'm thinking a flight to some nice warm beach is about due. Maybe I'll see if Christi wants to go. Hmmm...a bikini photoshoot on some warm beach....yeah!

ohskigod

economies go up and down. its just the way it is. also cant compare whats hapenning now to years ago. there werent countries dependent on each other like the more global economy we have now.

you think our economy's gonna tank and China's is gonna just rock out with its c*ck out ? are you out of your mind? China's sh*tting themselves over our economy just like we are.

its also why we panic when Asian Markets tank. its all linked now in ways never dreamed of in the past.


great depression?.......f**king ROME?!?!?!?!? will you STOOOOOP!

things are still peachy compared to the Carter years. people that lived through that are wondering what all the fuss is about right now

Bamadude

Strong Bad wrote: »

For some reason, I can only see the good in this big mess! A correction every now and then kicks this country in the ****. Remember the DOT COM Bubble of the '90's? The Real Estate bubble will be no different. Everything will get fixed and some other damn bubble will burst in about 10 years that will have Rome falling again.

Only that during the .com bust we didn't have the energy problems we're having now. This does appear to be a little more intense of a correction. I could be wrong though.

ohskigod

Strong Bad wrote: »

Remember the DOT COM Bubble of the '90's? !

oh, do I know some people that got **** F%^KED during that debacle....LOL

I didnt lose a thing. I gotta say, I always seem to be out fo the fray when this **** happens in terms of the stock market. of course, my house's falling value isnt fun, but its actually not TOO bad in NJ compared to other parts of the country. houses priced right still sell

Demiurge

ohskigod wrote: »

things are still peachy compared to the Carter years. people that lived through that are wondering what all the fuss is about right now

I agree. The last 4 years have been better than the previous 10 for us. A housing crunch =/ a **** economy across the board. Besides, with a **** dollar I have been selling more international orders than ever before. It's not all negatives unless people choose to look at it that way or got themselves into a mess and want to point fingers.

Biggest thing stopping us from expanding more is the taxation. #1 stranglehold on business with health care becoming a close #2 these days.

Bamadude

The economy here in Mobile is kicking. Fastest growing small metro area in America according to Forbes.

Bamadude

ohskigod wrote: »

oh, do I know some people that got **** F%^KED during that debacle....LOL

I was working for Corning when the .com crap hit the fan. You wouldn't believe how fast we had to put the breaks on. Our department went from 325 people to about 70 in a blink. Went from expanding fiber plants to shutting them down all in the same month. Some people that were hired and not yet transitioned from their previous employer were told not to show up. It was nuts.

Strong Bad

And I remember back in 2001, how many people told me I was nuts for quiting my job to go back to IT school to get Microsoft certified. "Oh man, you'll never get into IT. There are so many IT people out of work due to the DOT COM bubble burst! You'll never do it!"

So much for that idea.

We'll survive this mess and come out stronger!

cfrizz

Good for you Lou, I agree!

But the other problem is people need to stop also thinking of their homes as a liquid investment first & think of it as a stable roof over their heads.

Right now it's the other way around, which is one of the reasons why housing is such a mess.

But hopefully because of this mess & declining prices, I just might be able to finally buy a condo!:)

ohskigod wrote: »

oh, do I know some people that got **** F%^KED during that debacle....LOL

I didnt lose a thing. I gotta say, I always seem to be out fo the fray when this **** happens in terms of the stock market. of course, my house's falling value isnt fun, but its actually not TOO bad in NJ compared to other parts of the country. houses priced right still sell

rskarvan

I'm hoping that the low dollar will be good for domestic manufacturing... since, imports will become more expensive. That will be a good market correction.

Perhaps the reason that the dollar is falling is because domestic manufacturing of EVERYTHING is down (free trade, etc).

This is the generation that has it made. The problem is that we forgot how to "MAKE IT".

I fear that the falling dollar will simply put our labor supply (both skilled and unskilled) on par with India and China. That big sucking sound that Ross Perot predicted will mean that the USA will be just another country very similar to the rest of the world.

Besides history and speculation, what is floating the USA economic boat?

Bamadude

This country has an insatiable appetite for success and I think that's what drives our economy. I've visited several other countries on business and one thing I've noticed is that in general we're wound a little tighter when it comes to getting things done. I won't name specific countries, but I was appalled at the work ethic and apathy in several places (not all of them). We might have become a little complacent in all of the recent wealth, but start taking it away watch how quick folks get crazy about getting it back.

mrbigbluelight

shack wrote: »

The other thing is energy…that issue must be solved…and it will be. It is driving too much of our economy right now. Corn based ethanol is the STUPIDEST idea since the pet rock.

Short term things are very tough. Recession is a possibiltiy. Long term…IF we make the right decisions, things should be just fine. Panic is not our friend.

First: thanks for your input.

Second: The statement you made regarding corn-based ethanol is the truest thing ever posted on CP (ignorning that it is a huge understatement).
At least the pet rock craze offered some value in its amusement.

Third: Agree that panic is not our friend. The only thing backing the US dollar is confidence. Lose that, and it's all over but the shouting.


For whichever party is in power, for whichever power comes into power in the upcoming election, they MUST make some tough political choices for the good of all.

The Depression of the 20's was caused, in large part, by the banks calling in loans for stocks that had been bought on margin, wasn't it ?
Is this similar to what is occurring now, ie, subsitute "homes" for "stocks" and does a similar situation exist now ?

It smells like "greed", on a lot of levels, has brought this situation to a head.


Thanks for the input, again; hope the thread continues.
That it hasn't gone off-track with party-finger-pointing is a credit to everyone.

Everyone give themselves a pat on the back; Doro may substitute another region as he sees fit.

rskarvan

Other good candidates for energy sources (personal vehicle) are:

1. Hydrogen. Either fuel cell or aluminum produced (Purdue Invention).
2. Electricity stored in lithium battery packs. Electricity will most likely come from "solar fields" of the future. Its a cleaner fuel than corn. And, corn needs significant post-processing to make it viable.
3. Nothing wrong with nuclear power... but, I suspect that the demand wouldn't keep up with the supply of plutonium and we'd be in the same boat as with oil.
4. Lastly, I see nothing wrong with re-organizing our communities to make due with HUMAN POWERED bicycles. We are a bunch of fat Americans that could use some serious exercise.
5. Natural gas is still an "ok" source of clean fuel that is domestically produced.

bobman1235

Not to mention harnessing the hot air expelled from supposedly retired forum members.