HELP! CRS+ pulsing drivers

zingo
zingo Posts: 11,258
edited March 2008 in Vintage Speakers
I got my new ebay CRS+ yesterday from DHL, and they arrived in perfect condition. I couldn't have bought a better pair in person; tacky and shinny drivers, no dented tweeters of dustcaps, polished baffles and cabs, dust free grills. I hooked them up to my amp, (with no SDA IC) and they sounded great; no problems at all. Then I installed the SDA IC, turned the system back on and the music still sounded great. However, I noticed the the woofers were now slowly pulsing back and forth. It almost looked like they were breathing and it wasn't with the music. Whether or not the music was on, the drivers kept slowly pulsing in and out, and it didn't really seem to effect the music. I turned the system off, unhooked the SDA IC, turned it back on the pulsing stopped. What is this?!? Does it have something to do with my amp? It's an oldschool Audiometric AM441, so I have no idea if it's common ground or not. Could this be a symptom of that? Please help friends! (I'll post pictures tonight of the beautiful babies)
Jake
Post edited by zingo on
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  • hoosier21
    hoosier21 Posts: 4,413
    edited March 2008
    zingo wrote: »
    Does it have something to do with my amp?


    yep, I would not hook the IC with Audiometric AM441 again.

    Try a different amp with the IC and see if it still does it.
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  • ShinAce
    ShinAce Posts: 1,194
    edited March 2008
    If the amp has a subsonic filter, use it. Try a different IC before trying a different amp.
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  • Ricardo
    Ricardo Posts: 10,636
    edited March 2008
    Just grab a multimeter and measure ohms/resistance between the two black/negative binding posts in the amp. You should read 0 or they are not common ground. If they are not, there's a chance you might have damaged a drive or two. I hope it's not the case.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,204
    edited March 2008
    Non-common ground amp is what I'm guessing as Hoosier and Ricardo have stated.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,204
    edited March 2008
    Or if your amp has a high DC offset it could cause the pulsing. But since it's fine without the umbilical chord connected between the speakers that's probably not it.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • Boywonder
    Boywonder Posts: 225
    edited March 2008
    You could also use a DMM to check the resistance from the black (neg) binding posts on the amp to the amp chassis, it should read 0 (or close to it) ohms for common ground, ie neg speaker terminals are not floating.
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  • zingo
    zingo Posts: 11,258
    edited March 2008
    So if it is a non-common ground issue, I'll try another amp. However, I think I used this amp on my SDA 2As for a while with out problems. Is that possible?

    Also, it's a DIY interconnect made from a length of speaker cable, two spade connectors, and two 1/8" pins. Could that be a problem?
    Jake
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  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,577
    edited March 2008
    I would call a priest and request an exorcism.
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
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  • jakelm
    jakelm Posts: 4,081
    edited March 2008
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXsyRAPU8g0
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  • zingo
    zingo Posts: 11,258
    edited March 2008
    heiney9 wrote: »
    Or if your amp has a high DC offset it could cause the pulsing. But since it's fine without the umbilical chord connected between the speakers that's probably not it.

    Interesting though. The pulsing of the drivers almost looked like when you hook a speaker up to a 9v battery. It was that same type of driver surge.

    Also, a suggestion was made to try a different IC. What would be the reasoning behind that? Isn't a Pin-Blade IC a Pin-Blade IC?
    Jake
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  • zingo
    zingo Posts: 11,258
    edited March 2008
    So I pulled out the DMM tonight and checked the continuity of the negative terminals on the Audiometric and I came up with "open". Tested one of the terminals to the case and got the same thing. So I decided to open up the case and check things from the inside; the same results. I figured at this point that I had a non-common ground amp. Well, while putting the amp back together, I noticed a stick on the back of the case noting that the amp was not common ground. Well, there is my problem with the speakers and that was a lot harder then it had to be...
    Jake
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  • hoosier21
    hoosier21 Posts: 4,413
    edited March 2008
    zingo wrote: »
    I noticed a stick on the back of the case noting that the amp was not common ground. Well, there is my problem with the speakers and that was a lot harder then it had to be...

    you could have just read the first reply :p
    Dodd - Battery Preamp
    Monarchy Audio SE100 Delux - mono power amps
    Sony DVP-NS999ES - SACD player
    ADS 1230 - Polk SDA 2B
    DIY Stereo Subwoofer towers w/(4) 12 drivers each
    Crown K1 - Subwoofer amp
    Outlaw ICBM - crossover
    Beringher BFD - sub eq

    Where is the remote? Where is the $%#$% remote!

    "I've always been mad, I know I've been mad, like the most of us have...very hard to explain why you're mad, even if you're not mad..."
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  • zingo
    zingo Posts: 11,258
    edited March 2008
    I know, but inquiring minds want to know... Thanks for the help though hoosier21.
    Jake
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  • Refefer
    Refefer Posts: 1,280
    edited March 2008
    Is it ok? Test it with a new amp, and nothing bad happened?
    Lovin that music year after year.

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  • zingo
    zingo Posts: 11,258
    edited March 2008
    That's my plan. I'll grab one of my other amps tonight and test them out with SDA. I was listening to them last night with the Audiometric without the SDA and they still sounded fantastic! I'll let you know the results tomorrow.
    Jake
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  • zingo
    zingo Posts: 11,258
    edited March 2008
    Yup, all is well. I hooked up the CRS+s to a common ground amp with the IC and they sound great. No damage, and I feel like I dodged a bullet. I decided to try the CRS+s on their sides with the tweeters on the outside and the stereo drivers on-top, and they sound weird; still really good, just a little different. (I figured it was the only pair of SDAs you could try this on :p)
    Jake
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