a/v 7.1 reciever recommendations

magellings

Hello. Two questions for everyone:

1) I'd like some good recommendations of 7.1 A/V recievers in the price range of $1000 - $2000. Home theater and music listening are equally important. What are the best recievers out there?

2) Also, I have rti6's and their max recommended watts is 125. I've been told do not concern yourself with this limitation when purchasing a reciever. If so, why does Polk list in their specifications not to succeed 125 watts? The answer to this question is very important to me.

Current speakers:
fronts - rti10
center - csi5
surrounds - fxi5
surround bacs - rti6

Thanks guys

Imperitor

I think how it works is if you have a 150 watt receiver and 100 watt speakers they would sound the same as with a 100 watt receiver. On the other hand if you have a receiver rated lower then the speakers it could be bad for the speakers. So more receiver watts is always better. This is what I've been told, I could be wrong.

As for receivers I've always liked the sound of the Onkyo 805. Its under $1000 so you might want to get the Onkyo 905 instead. Most receivers over $1000 are good quality so just find one with the features you want.

Sami

For that price you could go with separates, or with a lower end receiver with pre-outs and multi-channel amplifier. I'll repeat what you have heard, don't let the speaker power handling rating worry you. You will damage the speakers with too much power if you drive them to volumes they don't support, but the same happens with lower power and it will actually happen sooner rather than later. Unless you have a very large room and like to listen to ear shattering volume levels, the changes of that happening are very minimal.

For receiver suggestions, there are quite a few threads, you'd get an answer much faster by trying to search previous threads.

jayman_1975

If you don't need the new HD audio codecs then this
one would be a heluva good start for you. I have one an if i had to do it all over again...i wouldn't change a thing. It wolloped my Denon 3805 for 2 channel and movies.

lakesailor

In that price range I would look at the Rotel RSX-1057. Nice sounding uit.

wallstreet

Uh oh, I had my RTi6's hooked up to my 150 WPC B&K a few weeks back. They actually sounded very nice. You'll not blow this speaker with too many watts (assuming you don't want crazy loud). Recievers in your price range worth investigating are:
Yammie RXV-1800
Sony STR-DA5200ES
Pioneer Elite VSX-94TXH

07maximan

I have a Pioneer Elite VSX-94TXH and I like it alot.It has great sound and just a TON of features.Check it out.

SlowcarIX

the yamaha rx-v3800

http://www.ultimateavmag.com/avreceivers/1107yam3800/

~$1100

tonyb

You will get a million different answers to this.For me,B&K or the arcam listed above are great units and more like seperates than an avr.

kuntasensei

I'd grab something that'll handle all the new audio formats natively via HDMI on the cheap like the Onkyo 705, then go with some solid separate amplification if you're really feeling the itch to spend that much. A 705 can be had for around $600 or less if you look around, and makes for a great pre/pro on the cheap.

That said, if you're running a capable subwoofer and your setup is in a mid-sized room, an Onkyo 705 or 805 (or one of the newer Denons) should have ample power for your speakers and give you Audyssey's excellent MultEQ XT room correction, all for well under your price point. I don't see the sense in spending that much just to spend that much.

seeclear

You can get a refurbed onkyo 805 right now on the shoponkyo.com website for $689. Join Club Onkyo, and you get 10 "points" automatically, which you can use on the purchase for $10 off, thus $689 instead of the posted $699.

I own 2 onkyo refurbs and they are like new. By all other reports, too, from other buyers, that is how onkyo refurbs are. And they DO come with wires, batteries, etc that the website says they do not come with. I guess it is possible that you wouldn't get those things since the website says that, but I have heard of maybe one instance where they did not come with a refurbed unit.

shimey013

Truth be told you dont need a 1k-2k reciever to power those...the Onk 805 would work just fine, its close to 1k, but yea...

I have the Onk 705 connected to my RTi8s and CSi3 and it sounds great and works just fine.....

Yea, im sure there are bigger and better recievers..but then its a matter of choice...but from reviews you may want to look into the onk 805 or any onkyo reciever and see if they do what you want.

magellings

Now that I've got some recommendations, this is what I had in mind:

Denon AVR-3808ci
Yamaha RX-V3800
Pioneer Elite VSX-94TXH
Onkyo TX-SR805
Sony STR-DA5300ES

I don't think I'm interested in seperates as I have no where to listen to a setup before I purchase. The above four (minus the sony) I can listen to w/ the same speakers I currently have before I purchase.

Does anyone have any opinions on the above list? It's good to know a few of these were recommended by you guys prior to me responding.

Some additional questions
-The onkyo is thx ultra2 certified. What's the significance of that? The pioneer is thx select2 certified?
-The denon and pioneer I know allow bi-wiring the fronts by combining the surround back outputs...are there any recievers that allow for bi-wiring without using the surround back outputs? I'd like to keep the backs hooked up to my surround backs.

Sami

It's too bad HK discontinued their 7000 series, but if those are your choices you might want to add HK AVR745 into the list to audition.

jflail2

First thing that came to mind for me in that price range was Emotiva.

I had never heard of them till frequenting these forums, but after much reading I almost wish I had skipped buying my Denon completely and just gone with a nice pre/pro combo from Emotiva...

If you have time, that new XPA5 they have coming out (combined with a nice pre) looks to be worth waiting for.

SlowcarIX

THX class classification

http://www.thx.com/products/home/logos/index.html?f=h2

Fongolio

I have owned 3 Pioneers and still have two. The one on my main system is several years old and sounds beautiful for an AVR. My two cents.


The system:

Pioneer Elite VSX-52TXi 7.1 Receiver
Polk Audio RTiA7 Fronts
Polk Audio CSi40 Center
Klipsch RF-25 Surrounds
Polk Audio RTi70 Surround backs
Pure Acoustics RB 1150 Active Subwoofer X2 (one on each side of room)
Hitachi 42HDS69 Plasma Screen
Pioneer DV-400V DVD player (for divX playback)
Pioneer Elite DV-79AVi DVD player (for sacd, dvd-audio and dts audio playback)
Oppo HD981 DVD player (universal player)
Bell ExpressVu 9200 HD-PVR Satellite Receiver
Monster Cable speaker cables and interconnects

wizzy

jflail2 wrote: »

First thing that came to mind for me in that price range was Emotiva.

I had never heard of them till frequenting these forums, but after much reading I almost wish I had skipped buying my Denon completely and just gone with a nice pre/pro combo from Emotiva...

If you have time, that new XPA5 they have coming out (combined with a nice pre) looks to be worth waiting for.

Hey you're near me

seeclear

magellings wrote: »

Now that I've got some recommendations, this is what I had in mind:

Denon AVR-3808ci
Yamaha RX-V3800
Pioneer Elite VSX-94TXH
Onkyo TX-SR805
Sony STR-DA5300ES

I don't think I'm interested in seperates as I have no where to listen to a setup before I purchase. The above four (minus the sony) I can listen to w/ the same speakers I currently have before I purchase.

Does anyone have any opinions on the above list? It's good to know a few of these were recommended by you guys prior to me responding.

Some additional questions
-The onkyo is thx ultra2 certified. What's the significance of that? The pioneer is thx select2 certified?
-The denon and pioneer I know allow bi-wiring the fronts by combining the surround back outputs...are there any recievers that allow for bi-wiring without using the surround back outputs? I'd like to keep the backs hooked up to my surround backs.

The onkyo 805 is now down to $639 on shoponkyo.com for a refurb with club onkyo membership and the $10 off as noted above. Hurry, Hurry!
You will only see the club onkyo price once you join and login.
FWIW

J_Kennedy

I opted for $699 new at Amazon.com and got really lucky. It disappeared Saturday, after I ordered it Friday night.

Still find them for $649.99 on Amazon form other vendors, but you pay about $40 shipping so you're back at the $700 mark.

Also noticed the 705 for $499. I've been watching for a 705 and hadn't seen on on Onkyo yet. A week or so ago I had decided to go that route and missed it on Amazon at $599.

I'm happier with the 805 for $699 though. All of these prices are for new ones.

magellings

Asking again, but does anyone have any comments on bi-wiring/bi-amping and bridging.

Onkyo 875 allows for bridging the two fronts, which doubles total watts per channel to 280 watts per channel

Denon 4308 allows for bi-wiring/bi-amping the two fronts, while also retaining a 7.1 setup without need to rewire speakers. Listening to 7.1 however does not retain the bi-wire or bi-amp setup on the two fronts, only 2-channel listening allows the bi-wire/bi-amp with 7.1 setup.

Onkyo 805 and yami 3800 allow bi-wiring/bi-amping, with sacrifice of only allowing 5.1 surround. You loose 7.1 setup.

Advice? Advice is important as this is something I can not try out before purchasing (unless I get my brothers denon 5308 over to my house to test, but that's a lot of money to be moving around

dkg999

I wouldn't worry about bi-wiring, bi-amping, bi-sexual, etc. If you want to do it so you feel more sophisticated, go for it. My guess is you won't hear a difference that justifies all the effort. You'll probably get more improvement by replacing the metal jumpers on the RTi6's with a good speaker cable, or use a speaker cable like the Signal Cable double-run bi-wire that has two sets of leads on the speaker end. I would recommend the Pioneer Elite, Denon, or Marantz in the price range of receivers you are looking at.

Fongolio

Bi-wiring worked really well (noticeable difference) when my RTi70's were used for front. Fuller deeper lows and just cleaner overall I've since moved them to surround back and replaced them with RTiA7's up front. I tried the RTiA7's bi-wired as well but could not hear any difference. Some speakers respond well to bi-wiring others not so much.

magellings

Fongolio wrote: »

Bi-wiring worked really well (noticeable difference) when my RTi70's were used for front. Fuller deeper lows and just cleaner overall I've since moved them to surround back and replaced them with RTiA7's up front. I tried the RTiA7's bi-wired as well but could not hear any difference. Some speakers respond well to bi-wiring others not so much.

I spoke to the owner of an audio/video store here and he said that w/ the rti10s that all bridging or a seperate amp will provide is more power so that you can listen to your speakers louder. Bi-wiring he said gets a bit tricky as you tend to need to mess around with settings on the avr when trying to enjoy different flavors of music. He said it was easier years ago when you had equalizers w/ sliders to simply adjust, but now with the newer recievers it is harder as you need to dig deeper into the recievers settings to adjust when bi-wiring. This of course is figuring you are serious about 2-channel listening.

He also highly recommends denon. He sells both denon and sony es products and said denon would beat sony es anyday. He mentioned 93% of radio broadcast stations run denon equipment for reliability due to the quality construction and parts that make up their equipment.

He also mentioned that Denon is very good at not distorting. You can turn a Denon volume up nearly full blast and not hear it distort the signal. This he said is because whereas most reciever manufacturers measure distortion for only short quick intervals, denon holds the measurement for a full second during testing. (It would be much more technical if he explained it).

All in all I was leaning towards the Onkyo but am now I think leaning more towards the denons again.

dkg999

Good luck on turning that Denon up nearly full blast. Report back on your findings. Cheers!

bfd

I went with the Yammy 3800 - got it at 6ave for just over $1000. Arrived in great condition. Call them if you don't get that price online. Very happy with the sound, the features, and the codecs. TrueHD and DTS Master Audio, etc. via HDMI inputs. If you plan to go HD-DVD or BluRay, you'll appreciate the lossless formats.

The less expensive 1800 is also worth a listen if you don't need/want the network capability of the 3800. Only 10 fewer watts per channel and probably $500 less. Will more than power what you have now and might get in the future (unless you're planning on building an arena).

lockmart

seeclear wrote: »

You can get a refurbed onkyo 805 right now on the shoponkyo.com website for $689. Join Club Onkyo, and you get 10 "points" automatically, which you can use on the purchase for $10 off, thus $689 instead of the posted $699.

I own 2 onkyo refurbs and they are like new. By all other reports, too, from other buyers, that is how onkyo refurbs are. And they DO come with wires, batteries, etc that the website says they do not come with. I guess it is possible that you wouldn't get those things since the website says that, but I have heard of maybe one instance where they did not come with a refurbed unit.

I'm considering the 705 refurb, I guess you can't return it if you are one of the unlucky ones to not get all that extra stuff since they disclaim it up front? I haven't seen one recently anyway, but was contemplating jumping on it when I see one.

magellings

One question, again?

Will the 140watts/channel of some of these recievers wreck/damage my rti6 or fxi5 that only handle up to 125watts?

If not, then why does polk spec a "max" of 125 watts in their listing?

magellings

Hi all,

I bought the Denon 3808ci after listening to these recievers again.

My findings:

My setup is:

fronts rti10
center csi5
surround fxi5

Listening Criteria:
Two-channel pure direct listening:
a) Tom Petty & the Heartbreakers - Runnin' Down a Dream
b) PACHELBEL - Canon (classical)
Dolby Digital surround
c) U2 Vertigo 05 live from chicago - scene Cry / Electric Co.
d) Saving Private Ryan - scene The Alamo & the one directly following

All listening was conducted at a reputable retail store (americantv in WI) in which all recievers were hooked up to a switcher and could switch back and forth between recievers to listen to sound w/ setup listed above.

Denon 3808ci -
Overall good soundstage, good sound, clear, vibrant. Plus 1080p upconversion of all signals, whereas Yamaha/Onkyo pass thru majority of hd signals below 1080p. also believe audysee optimization can be set flat which I believe disables audysee implicit settings, whereas cannot w/ yamaha cannot do this, not sure of onkyo
a) Good sound, instruments very clear and distinct.
b) Noticed Denon was the brightest sounding of all recievers, to the point of a bit on the listening fatique side, albeit the tom petty track more than made up for this. I've been told violen highs should be bright like this though. Also note very good soundstage on this track and good distinction between low, mid, and highs
c & d) both very good, soundstage tended to direct more to the center than the l/r fronts. Good sound, felt like was in the action, not disappointed with either

Denon 4308ci - this reciever would have been my second pick. same as findings for 3808, but a bit brighter highs at times than 3808 on classical b) above. Sounded a bit louder at same volume level due to obvious fact that is 10watts more per channel at 140watts. To me not worth the extra $750 I would have had to pay to get this reciever. This reciever does support bi-wiring/bi-amping while retaining 7.1 setup, albeit to my ears 3808ci was more relaxed and comfortable to listen to. At times when switching back and forth between two denons, didn't notice any difference, and didn't think bi-ing anything would improve sound enough to justify purchase of this reciever

Yamaha 3800 - this reciever would have been my third pick. This reciever tamed down the brightness of the classical b) above, but it was also a more laid back sound and mids/lows weren't quite as distinct as denon sound. on c)/d) movie watching soundstage tended to move out to the l/r fronts and not as much sound protruded from center. Good clear distinction of mids/lows/highs, and did not experience listening fatique of brightness as did a bit during denon listening. I did not like the fact I read in a review that the yamaha does not superimpose volume level onto the tv screen during adjustment. This was a con to me.

Onkyo 805 - the onkyo soundstage protruded to the center channel very similar to the denons during movie watching. Onkyo instrument sounds were not quite as distinct and seperate in criteria b) above as w/ denon/yamahas. did not experience listening fatique w/ highs. sound during a)/b) criteria above seemed to protrude more directly from l/r fronts, whereas w/ denon yamaha sound seemed to come more from whole front wall during a)/b) criteria. I did not know if volume was superimposed on tv screen w/ this reciever, only know it is w/ the denons as my brother has one at the time I purchased the 3808

Pioneer Elite
I eliminated this avr during my first trial of these recievers. Listed in this response are the details of my second trial experience of these recievers. The lows/mids on this reciever presenting sounded a bit overwhelming and distorted to me which would have generated listening fatique for me over short time.

Overall I think anyone would be happy w/ either of these recievers in their own home. The fact I got to listen to them all w/ the same speakers I own was a huge plus. And I was able to determine which one I liked best taking all the criteria above into consideration, as well as features these recievers offered. My suggestion to anyone looking to purchase a reciever would be to go to a store with a good reputation for audio/video equipment that has the recievers you want to test setup on a switching board. Make sure this seller has the same setup/speakers as you have because from opinions I gathered thru my postings on this forum everyone hears sounds differently, and my findings above will not necessarily be the same for someone else. Also remember my findings above are with the specific speakers/recievers combination I listened to, and with different speakers recievers will not sound the same, again based on opinions/facts I gathered from posts I submitted in the forum. Good luck to anyone looking for a new reciever and hope my summary helps you. Also thanks to everyone for their input, I think this forum is great for getting answers to audio questions. Thanks again everyone.

magellings

Note I did not try out the sony es as did not have a place to try out w/ current setup. I was told denon would beat sony es any day in sound quality and reliablity.

sagasa

Thanks for the review, my question is where you able to calibrate each
Unit to your desired settings.