why can't CD's sound more natural?

danger boy
danger boy Posts: 15,722
edited December 2007 in Music & Movies
after listening to some vinyl for about 6 month's now.. then listen to a CD, the CD sounds so harsh. is it impossible for them to make CD's that sound more analog or tube like?

the dynamics of a CD is impressive.. but at the cost of sounding harsh on a good system. or even my crappy system.. they still sound harsh. I know I could go out and buy a tube pre or a tube CDP, but that's not the point..

anyonw know the answer to this?
PolkFest 2012, who's going>?
Vancouver, Canada Sept 30th, 2012 - Madonna concert :cheesygrin:
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  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,211
    edited December 2007
    Your ears are telling you the truth.
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited December 2007
    I blame bad mixing. I have heard some good Cd's, and some bad ones. Its very disappointing when your equipment gets better some of your favorite Cd's sound worse:( But you know that.
    Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • danger boy
    danger boy Posts: 15,722
    edited December 2007
    ben62670 wrote: »
    I blame bad mixing. I have heard some good Cd's, and some bad ones. Its very disappointing when your equipment gets better some of your favorite Cd's sound worse:( But you know that.
    Ben

    exactly, i try and tweak the system to sound it's best.. and CD's sound good but very harsh. Maybe it's my CDP too? Sony ES, older jobber though. :confused:
    PolkFest 2012, who's going>?
    Vancouver, Canada Sept 30th, 2012 - Madonna concert :cheesygrin:
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited December 2007
    Try some warmer speakers/cables.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited December 2007
    danger boy wrote: »
    exactly, i try and tweak the system to sound it's best.. and CD's sound good but very harsh. Maybe it's my CDP too? Sony ES, older jobber though. :confused:
    Hey man the best advice I have received on the Outlaw was the CD up-sampling, and I am pretty sure it came from you:)
    What are you using for your connection? RCA, Optical, or COAX?
    Not to get a debate going, but... the Coax ON OUR PRE'S sounds best. I don't know if it is the digital to optical to optical to digital that is to blame.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,746
    edited December 2007
    Maybe it's my CDP too? Sony ES, older jobber though.

    There's your problem. CD's on a top notch player are generally excellent.

    Vinyl isn't all it's cracked up to be. I've heard plenty of it that made my ears bleed.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • danger boy
    danger boy Posts: 15,722
    edited December 2007
    this is on my 2 ch only rig. Pioneer Elite amp, Sony ES playa, different CD", SDA 2B's with RDO tweeters... just was commenting about the harshness of digital audio. i bet they could warm up the sound a big without losing any dynamics.

    bass from the SDA 2B's is insane though. ;)
    PolkFest 2012, who's going>?
    Vancouver, Canada Sept 30th, 2012 - Madonna concert :cheesygrin:
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  • Danny Tse
    Danny Tse Posts: 5,206
    edited December 2007
    danger boy wrote: »
    after listening to some vinyl for about 6 month's now.. then listen to a CD, the CD sounds so harsh. is it impossible for them to make CD's that sound more analog or tube like?

    the dynamics of a CD is impressive.. but at the cost of sounding harsh on a good system. or even my crappy system.. they still sound harsh. I know I could go out and buy a tube pre or a tube CDP, but that's not the point..

    anyonw know the answer to this?

    It's called SACD. I'm not saying this is the ultimate digital experience, but when done right, SACD comes very close to analog and it's miles ahead of CD. It's quite hard to explain....it's not necessarily the higher resolution of the increased dynamic range....SACD just sounds more "natural". Most likely the increased sampling rate. Of course, not all SACD will sound excellent, but recordings such as Steely Dan's "Gaucho" SACD simply sounds amazing.

    Btw, I have no expensive components....just a pair of Grado SR60 headphones ($69.00) and a Sony DVP-NS500V SACD/CD/DVD player ($175.00).
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  • Midnite Mick
    Midnite Mick Posts: 1,591
    edited December 2007
    The quality of the DAC is critical!
    Modwright SWL 9.0 SE (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Consonance cd120T
    Consonance Cyber 800 tube monoblocks (6Sons Audio Thunderbird PC's with Oyaide 004 terminations)
    Usher CP 6311

    Phillips Pronto TS1000 Universal Remote
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  • bikezappa
    bikezappa Posts: 2,463
    edited December 2007
    Why can't CD's sound more natural?

    By natureral I assume you mean it should sound like the real thing or sound like live music. The problem is that we rarely get to hear live music without the layer of microphones, amplfiers and speakers. So we really can't compare what our in home system sounds like to natural live music, beause we never or rarely hear live music.

    The first time I heard the Boston Symphony, BSO,I was shocked by the sound of the violins and the brass. The brass sounded harsh and it was not smooth.

    I think today you just play any thing you want any way you want to fit your needs because trying to replicate live music is just about impossible.
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  • MillerLiteScott
    MillerLiteScott Posts: 2,561
    edited December 2007
    I just bought the re-mastered Joshua Tree and I was very disappointed. It is very flat and lacking any sense of dynamics.

    I have found that a hand full of CD's that I could not listen to prior to upgrading my 2 channel amplification are now very listenable and all of my other favorite good sounding CD's sound even better. Morph the Cat sounds awesome but it would probably even sound good on my kids battery powered sing along CD player.

    I am also disappointed that some of my favorite artists CD's don't sound as good as they can or should.

    Scott
    I like speakers that are bigger than a small refrigerator but smaller than a big refrigerator:D
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  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited December 2007
    CDs, in general, aren't inherently harsh; it's the systems that make them sound that way.

    If your music sounds harsh, then you have to isolate the cause(s) of the harshness and change out components accordingly. Start with the source.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,779
    edited December 2007
    I would say 10% of my CD's sound harsh...

    I can listen for hours on most anything

    Definitely isnt totally the CD's fault...
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • shadowofnight
    shadowofnight Posts: 2,735
    edited December 2007
    Lasareath wrote: »
    I have a 14 year old Sony ES player and it sounds amazing. It's warm and not harsh at all.

    I have a Sony C87ES from the early 90's as well...it sounds awesome to this day ( Dont use the selectable digital signal processing...just press the Flat button and its perfect )
    The first rule of Fight Club is you don't talk about Fight Club
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