Need help BAD....

Grimster74

Well ladies and gentlemen, received my VSX-84TXSi Elite receiver yesterday and after close inspection, the unit is flawless minus some of the flaps missing on the fiber optic connectors which apparently is an overall problem for Pioneer. As far as the flaps go, the seller contacted Pioneer and they are sending me the replacement parts and I should be receiving them this week.

Anyways, you would not believe the cabling I've eliminated just swapping units out. Here is the problem I've run into since hooking the unit up which I'm still not finished doing yet. Once I hooked up all cables I have a really, really bad buzzing sound coming out of the speakers. I think I've narrowed it down but I need some help just to make sure. When powering up the receiver and amp, IF the HDMI cable is disconnected, I do not get the buzzing sound, as soon as I reconnect the HDMI cable, it comes back. I've tried 3 different HDMI cables with the same results. Now here is where it gets interesting, instead of running my HDMI cable from the receiver to my wall plate, which then runs to the projector, I tried running direct from the receiver to the projector and get the same thing. This is what I tried next and I'm not sure what made me think of it but I grabbed one of those heavy duty extension cords and plugged my projector into a totally different outlet instead of the one installed at the projector and with all the HDMI cables connected like they should be (from the receiver, to the wall plate then to the projector) the buzzing was gone.

I know very little about electricity other than the fact that it tingles when it bites but now I’m a little confused. When I was running the 990/7700 combo, I believe I had a similar problem with analog connections from the 990 to the amp but when I changed over to the balanced connections, the problem went away. I tried numerous analog connections from the Elite to the 7700 and still had the buzzing sound so I know it’s not bad cables. The other thing I noticed yesterday was if my satellite box was connected to the Elite via HDMI, the buzzing was worse. What I don’t understand is, when I ran my HDMI cables to the Monoprice switcher, then to the wall plate, I had no buzzing sounds either.

I’m at a loss here as to what could be causing the problem. Is it that the receptacle to the projector could be causing my problem? I believe the electrician that ran the line for the receptacle in my ceiling used the same line that’s attached to my recessed lighting. Is it that my satellite box is causing the electrical buzzing sound, I just don’t know. I want to say it’s probably going to be a combination of both but I’m just not sure how to eliminate it. The one thing I did not get around to doing was to run my speaker wires directly to the Elite to see if I still get the buzzing which I was too tired to fool around with it anymore last night but I will do it tonight. So, with everything said, what other help can anyone offer? What other configurations can I try to try and narrow it down to what is causing the buzzing sound. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Sherardp

process of elimination bro, start with just the receiver and one source along with the speakers wired up, then check for the buzzing, then continue to add each source until everything is connected. Then wire in the power amp. Sooner or later you'll find the source of the problem, its much easier to find it this way than by having so many potential causes to look at. I would start there first. Let us know.

phoneisbusy

I had very similar experience. It turned out to be a ground loop from the cable outlet. Installed a ground loop isolator between the cable outlet and the tv and no hum.

It was odd because I encountered this after I swapped out the old amp for an Acurus. The old amp for whatever reason was more immune to the hum then the Acurus. Couldn't tell you why.

Hopefully this is your problem. I happen to have an isolator handy but it's a fairly inexpensive fix (relatively speaking).

Have you tried removing the satellite box from the config? What type of recess lighting do you have? Any dimmers?

Good luck

Dave

Grimster74

Yes, the recessed lighting is on Lutron dimmers. Where exactly do you find a ground loop isolator, Radio Shack?

woofiepaws

Sure sounds like a ground loop. House wiring can be really weird. My place is not very old, never been remodeled. One of the wall sockets is connected to the same circuit as a track light with a dimmer! Loads of fun the first time we plugged a vacuum in to it....

I don't trust anything in my house to be properly grounded. A dedicated line is the next big upgrade.

Grimster74

I'm running dual 20amp, dedicated receptacle's in my H/T room, one on the left front wall, one on the right front wall.

phoneisbusy

Grimster74 wrote: »

Yes, the recessed lighting is on Lutron dimmers. Where exactly do you find a ground loop isolator, Radio Shack?

Radio Shack has one but it's not the type I'm using. Mine's looks like this one:
http://shop.polkaudio.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=13352&storeId=12352&productId=107359&langId=-1

But not as expensive (and probably not as good).

I've read that some dimmers may introduce hum so I thought I'd ask. Were your dimmers on when you encountered the hum.

Just someone who stayed at a holiday inn last night...

Good luck
Dave

Grimster74

Okay, here is the deal. I can plug eveything in on this receiver without getting the buzz/hum. The minute I plug the HDMI cable into the out on the receiver, the buzz is back. Is it possible that the power wire running to the projector is to close to the HDMI cable and that is whats causing the buzz?

McLoki

Try a 3 prong to 2 prong adapter. (so you can plug a 3 prong device into a 2 prong outlet) on each 3 prong item you have one at a time. When the hum goes away, that is the device that is causing you issues.

Grimster74

McLoki wrote: »

Try a 3 prong to 2 prong adapter. (so you can plug a 3 prong device into a 2 prong outlet) on each 3 prong item you have one at a time. When the hum goes away, that is the device that is causing you issues.

I'll try and pick one of these up tonight on my way home from work, pretty sure they can be picked up at Lowes, correct? Another thing I tried last night was hooking up only the receiver and the speakers (connected speakers directly to the speaker inputs on the receiver) and it was dead silent until I hooked up the HDMI cable, as soon as I hooked up the HDMI cable, the buzzing came back just not as loud as when the amplifier was connected but still noticable. So, the next thing I did was run an extension cord from a totally different room to the projector and then the HDMI cable from the receiver directly to the projector (to try and eliminate the idea of the HDMI cable being to close to the power running to the projector in the ceiling) and still had the annoying buzz. It's beginning to look like I'll be selling the Elite and moving back to the trusty 990/7700 combo. I was really hoping the Elite was going to be an easy intergration into my system but looks like my room is telling me otherwise. Tonight when I get home I'm going to swap out the 3805 with the Elite to see if I can reproduce the same problem with the HDMI connection just to rule out the receiver being the problem.

phoneisbusy

Is the outlet for your projector on the same dedicated 20 amp lines or on a separate ciruit? Have you tried plugging in the projector into the dedicated lines?

Good luck

Dave

ben62670

Unplug the CATV wire, and then try the HDMI.

Grimster74

phoneisbusy wrote: »

Is the outlet for your projector on the same dedicated 20 amp lines or on a separate ciruit? Have you tried plugging in the projector into the dedicated lines?

Good luck

Dave

I was thinking the same thing this morning but I had already left for work so I'm going to run the power of the projector via heavy duty extension cord to the same outlet as the amp and the receiver to see if the buzz disappears at lunch time today. I'll report my findings as soon as I return back to work after lunch.

Grimster74

ben62670 wrote: »

Unplug the CATV wire, and then try the HDMI.

I thought about this also and nothing is connected from the Satellite (Directv), phone line and/or cable. The only thing I have hooked up right now is the receiver with the speaker cables going directly to the rear of the receiver, no analogs from the amp and/or trigger wires are connected.

Grimster74

Okay, so when I got home for lunch I reconnected the Elite with the 7700 (just the fronts), ran the extension cord over to the Monster Power HTS 5100 and powered everything up, dead quite. Okay, lets plug in the HDMI cable, low and behold, a very faint HISS now, not a BUZZ like before. The hiss is only there when the Elite is set in "tuner" mode, when I switch over to DVD, dead quite. Thanks a million guys for helping out.

Now, here is my next question, other than running an extension cord across the ceiling and down the wall to get to the HTS 5100, not sure how to get power to the receptacle easily. I will have to completely unload the built-in media cabinet to remove the built-in shelves to get behind the cabinet where all the cables are run. Once that is done, do I (a) tap into the dedicated 120 amp circuit to run power to the projector, which is the same outlet the HTS 5100 is plugged into or should I (b) run basically a long heavy duty extension cord basically the same way (threw the wall) but come threw the wall so I can plug directly into the HTS 5100. Like I said, I know very little about electricity so I'm not sure if option (a)basically does the same thing as option (b).

Now that I think about it, with the projector being like this the whole time, do you guys think it's had a negative effect on picture quality?

Grimster74

Just wanna try and clear the above post up a bit. What I want to do is run another 12/2 line from the dedicated 120 amp (daisy chaining) to the receptacle mounted in the ceiling at the projector. Correct me if I'm wrong, like I said before, I know nothing about electrical work but if I run another line off of the dedicated 120A line to get power at the receptacle at the projector, wouldn't the projector and the HTS 5100 share the same ground then? I just think this would be a much cleaner install compaired to running an extension cord threw the ceiling then out the wall and plugged into the HTS 5100.

phoneisbusy

I think you're saying you'd like to daisy chain another circuit off your dedicated audio electrical outlets to where your projector is to eliminate the ground loop. This should work but it'd involve wiring. I'm assuming you'd let an electrician do this. Perhaps he might have an idea on how to solve this problem?

Just to do some further diagnosis, what else is connected to the present circuit for the projector? Dimmers maybe?

Good luck

Dave

Grimster74

Well, looks like the 990 is back in place until I can get an electrician to come out to the house. My father and I are really good friends with a guy that lives in my fathers neighborhood thats been an electrician all of his life so I'm hoping to talk him into coming by the house. I did like I said I was going to do, got everything all hooked up, all 7 channels of the amp, all gear and ran the extension cord to the HTS 5100 were all the other gear is hooked up to and sure enough the buzz was back, not near as bad as before but it was still there, seemed to be worse when the receiver was set in "tuner" mode. I dealt with the buzz long enough the fire up the Blu-Ray player and put in Casino Royale to see if I even liked what I heard and from my 15 minutes of skipping threw chapters, I sure hope I can get the ground loop problem resolved.

tonyb

Too many grounds in one place my friend.Ground loop.Some gear is more sensitive to it than others.Take the pioneer and plug it direct into the wall with a cheater plug that cost 2 bucks and see how that works.

Grimster74

Well, got in touch with my father's neighbor which is the electrician and he said he's going to try and get by the house Sunday morning to have a look at things. He said he could very well be able to correct the issue by checking the wiring on the receptacle itself, not quit sure what he meant by it but if thats the case, hopefully it will be an easy fix. I'll keep ya posted on the outcome.