Well that was fast!!!

Orange PeelOrange Peel Posts: 53
edited October 2002 in Speakers
I just got done tuning my system some more, and I put in LOTR's. It was at the part when Gandolf met with Saruman and Gandolf was going to leave and the doors slam, my SVS bottomed out! It made some weird noise (CLACK) when it hit and popped kinda. Now it has this rattle when it plays. I just emailed SVS to see what will happen, most likely they will send me a new driver.

I can't believe it. My gain is set less than half, my HK sub level is -5, and it's tuned to about 80db's on the SPL meter.

It's just my damn luck, 3 days and I break it already, I take real great care of my stuff and never abuse it, but this thing has a little too much power maybe :(

Update - Tom is sending me a new driver and we have been emailing back and forth for the past 2 days, I must say SVS is one AWESOME company. They stand by their products and care for their customers!!
Scott Goldsmith

Home Theatre:
Klipsch RF-3's (Front Mains)
Klipsch RC-3 (Center)
Klipsch RS-3's (Rear Surrounds)
SVS 20-39 PC Plus Subwoofer
Harman Kardon AVR-520
Mitsubishi WS-65869 Widescreen TV
Denon DVD 1600
Sony DVD DVP-S530D
Post edited by Orange Peel on

Comments

  • Ron-PRon-P Spaceman Spiff Posts: 8,511
    edited October 2002
    Sounds like you had a defective driver to begin with.


    Peace Out~:D
    If...
    Ron dislikes a film = go out and buy it.
    Ron loves a film = don't even rent.
  • Dr. SpecDr. Spec Posts: 3,780
    edited October 2002
    Scott:

    Too bad about the blown driver - the dB-12 is supposedly very durable and one instance of bottoming should not have hurt it.

    I have had no such problems and I have only heard of about three dB-12 driver failures since the CS+ came out over a year ago. Mostly cooked VCs instead of bottoming. Is your SS filter set to 20 Hz?

    I'm assuming you are using 75 dB test tones as your "reference level". 80 dB for the sub tone is rather on the hot side if you are actually playing AT reference levels.

    Most people run 75 dB or even 73 dB for the sub tone if playback is actually AT reference. Already you are probably 5-7 dB hot over reference recommendations.

    Next, if you are using a Rat Shack SPL meter, it tends to read LOW in the bass ranges by about 2 dB. There are calibration correction charts for the Rat Shack meter for bass. I recommend that you use them and factor them in when you recalibrate your system after the new driver is installed.

    Being 5-7 dB hot to begin with, and adding in the "Rat Shack meter factor", you could actually be as much as 8-9 dB hotter than recommended for actual reference level playback.

    Next - the LOTR-FOTR overall soundtrack is mastered about 8 dB LOUDER than it should be. I can't even approach my normal reference level (-15 on the master volume) for playback of this DVD - it is simply WAY too loud. I play this DVD at -25 or maybe -23 at the most.

    Also, in addition to being mastered way too loud, LOTR-FOTR is extremely bass heavy.

    Was your master volume setting at "reference" on LOTR when you blew the woofer?

    If your master volume setting was actually at reference for LOTR - you could have literally been around 16dB too hot on the sub for this specific and particular set of circumstances.

    Have you actually been measuring SPL peaks on C-weighted Fast settings at your listening position? For your size room (it looks around 1700 ft3 from the pics), you can expect bass peaks of 112-113 dB from the sub 10 feet away. If you were pushing much harder (easy to do when the bass is so clean and deep), you can expect problems. SVS says an Ultra can safely go 114 dB at the couch in a moderate size room, and a Plus can safely do a bit less - maybe 112dB. If you are playing louder than that, I'd go with two Plus subs.

    I'd be interested to know Tom V's take was?

    Doc
    "What we do in life echoes in eternity"

    Ed Mullen ([email protected])
    Director - Technology and Customer Service
    SVS
  • har_navaltahar_navalta Posts: 957
    edited October 2002
    In that case you should keep your PSW650....:D


    Har
  • tpetertpeter Posts: 54
    edited October 2002
    Dang bro I’m sorry to hear this, I hope it gets taken care of which im sure it will since they do take care of their customers. Your probably going through withdrawal without the sub now I bet.
    Polk LSi 15
    Polk LSi/C
    Polk LSi/FX
    SVS Ultra
    B&K AVR 507
    ps3 for BluRay "ps4 soon"
  • Dr. SpecDr. Spec Posts: 3,780
    edited October 2002
    BUMP!!!!

    Orange Peel - any updates on the new driver coming in, or what your volume setting was when it blew?

    What did Tom V say about all of this?

    I knew they would stand behind it, but lets try to see what happened (unless it was simply a bad driver) and prevent it from occuring again if it was a hot calibration issue or if you were simply asking too much from one sub.

    Ron at SVS has said many times, even if you are at -5 on the sub receiver volume and even if the sub amp volume is set at less than half, there are STILL situations (uncommon but they DO exist) where you can overdrive the woofer.

    My receiver sub volume is set at -3, and my sub amp volume is much less than half, and I am running around 77 dB on the sub (with a different SPL meter, so I am truly only 2 dB hot) and I have probably reached the clean limits of that sub (112 dB peaks at the couch) in my room at least two dozen times on different DVDs, including LOTR.

    I sure don't want to see you blow that woof again, because they might not cover it the second time, and it's nearly $300 including shipping.

    Doc
    "What we do in life echoes in eternity"

    Ed Mullen ([email protected])
    Director - Technology and Customer Service
    SVS
  • Orange PeelOrange Peel Posts: 53
    edited October 2002
    Update for you guys...

    Tom is sending me a new driver free of charge, and sending it rush delivery so I can have by this weekend, AMAZING guy and company! There's also something special coming too, I'll show you when it gets here :D

    I "thought" I calibrated it correctly, after emailing Tom and chatting about my settings, it looks like I was actually about 10 or so db's on the HOT side, and with the volume near reference my PC+ bottomed out and clacked, and then I could hear something rattling inside, like something broke off in there. These subs are VERY tough though, even after that I can still use it, and it does sound good to me, but I'm sure the driver got messed up.

    My HK AVR 520's sub level was a -5db's, so it was fairly low, but the gain on the sub was probably just a little too much :( a tich less than than half way.

    Tom was telling me that lots of subs out there are manufacter limited to roll off around 30hz, so the less educated people of the world can crank the crap out of the volume right out of the box and not hurt the thing. And with this logic and design you miss out on the sub 30 hz and below material because the sub manufacter has put a resistor or something on the sub to roll off and protect itself, UNLIKE the SVS which has no such limiter it's totally possible to bottom it out and damage the driver, hence my case. :(

    SVS is a TOP NOTCH company, I have recieved 110% customer service from them, they have my business for LIFE and anyone I talk to will be gettig a referral to them!

    I really can't say enough about Tom and SVS, I really appreciate everything they are doing to make this right and help me out. Countless emails, IMMEDIATE response and a new driver!
    Scott Goldsmith

    Home Theatre:
    Klipsch RF-3's (Front Mains)
    Klipsch RC-3 (Center)
    Klipsch RS-3's (Rear Surrounds)
    SVS 20-39 PC Plus Subwoofer
    Harman Kardon AVR-520
    Mitsubishi WS-65869 Widescreen TV
    Denon DVD 1600
    Sony DVD DVP-S530D
  • Dr. SpecDr. Spec Posts: 3,780
    edited October 2002
    Originally posted by Orange Peel
    Update for you guys...

    I "thought" I calibrated it correctly, after emailing Tom and chatting about my settings, it looks like I was actually about 10 or so db's on the HOT side, and with the volume near reference

    Well, that about sums it up..........recalibrate and you should be OK.

    Doc
    "What we do in life echoes in eternity"

    Ed Mullen ([email protected])
    Director - Technology and Customer Service
    SVS
  • Orange PeelOrange Peel Posts: 53
    edited October 2002
    Yeah, I still can't believe this happened, I thought it was calibrated right, guess not. :( I really need another SVS :D
    Scott Goldsmith

    Home Theatre:
    Klipsch RF-3's (Front Mains)
    Klipsch RC-3 (Center)
    Klipsch RS-3's (Rear Surrounds)
    SVS 20-39 PC Plus Subwoofer
    Harman Kardon AVR-520
    Mitsubishi WS-65869 Widescreen TV
    Denon DVD 1600
    Sony DVD DVP-S530D
  • jeberhartjeberhart Posts: 69
    edited October 2002
    The problem in this case is not your speaker. The problem is that damned movie. Wonderful film, but this DVD was mastered by a lunkhead and should be RECALLED. First time I watched it, I had the volume on my Denon 3801 set at -20 db -- and with many movies, I'm able to rack that baby up to about -15 and still be OK, including that outrageously aggressive DTS version of U-571! But LOTR-FOTR popped one of my 10Bs at the -20 setting. Fortunately, I had the volume control in my hand when it happened, turned down, and the speaker is OK. But I had to turn down to -23. On my system, this happened when Isuldur cut off Sauron's finger and the ring and parts of the hand fell to the ground. Believe me, the mix on this film is wretched. I'm no great believer in going heavy on the compression, but good Lord, this disc is awful. A new version is coming out in November -- the four (or five, depending on your preference) disc deluxe edition, and I'm really hoping someone at New Line Cinema has been listening for the pop -- not the ones our poor speakers made, but rather that "pop" you hear when you finally pull your head out from your ****.
    "Evil men have no songs." -- Quotation found in Nietzsche's "Twilight of the Gods"
  • Dr. SpecDr. Spec Posts: 3,780
    edited October 2002
    Like I said in my earlier posts - I guessed you were 8-9 dB too hot and add another 8 dB for LOTR being criminally mastered on the hot side, and poof, you were 16+ dB hot, assuming you were watching LOTR at reference. That's enough to wreck even a dB-12 driver. I'm assuming not much wasn't moving in the room at that point, Scott?

    Doc
    "What we do in life echoes in eternity"

    Ed Mullen ([email protected])
    Director - Technology and Customer Service
    SVS
  • Orange PeelOrange Peel Posts: 53
    edited October 2002
    Yeah, things were definitely moving!!!! :) The screen on my TV is the hardest thing to keep from moving, how do you keep your Gib Screen's screen from moving and wobbling?

    I love how you can feel the bass with these subs!!
    Scott Goldsmith

    Home Theatre:
    Klipsch RF-3's (Front Mains)
    Klipsch RC-3 (Center)
    Klipsch RS-3's (Rear Surrounds)
    SVS 20-39 PC Plus Subwoofer
    Harman Kardon AVR-520
    Mitsubishi WS-65869 Widescreen TV
    Denon DVD 1600
    Sony DVD DVP-S530D
  • Dr. SpecDr. Spec Posts: 3,780
    edited October 2002
    I have a concrete slab on grade - it doesn't transmit any vibes through the floor. I have no probs with screen blur with my RPHDTV, but I have heard a wooden floor over a basement will allow it to happen.

    Let us know when the driver comes in - replacement should be a snap. Whatever you do - DON'T allow the screwdriver to slip and puncture that Kevlar/aluminum cone while you are **** in the new driver!!!!

    Doc
    "What we do in life echoes in eternity"

    Ed Mullen ([email protected])
    Director - Technology and Customer Service
    SVS
  • scottvampscottvamp Posts: 3,297
    edited October 2002
    Love the way LOTR sounds - hot - hell ya.!! It rocks.
    In the bass management setup you can set your sub. to NOT bottom out. There is a cut off limit. But may not have helped if LOTR was cranked!!!:eek:
    PS3 and HD Front Projection, life is good. Too bad Blu-Ray and the PS3 are already obsolete.....:rolleyes:
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