speaker cabinet care question

jimmyzen

Why is there a recommendation against cleaning speaker cabinets with furniture polish? All that is supposed to be used is a damp cloth. I had a set of JBLs for 30 years and I used either lemon oil, Liquid Gold, or Old English liquid furniture polish on them and never had anything bad happen to the veneer or detrimental to the finish. I shunned using wax polishes like Pledge on them because of potential wax build up issues. But, especially in the winter the cabinets would look faded and become dull from the dry air from the furnace. A wipe down with a damp cloth made them look OK for about 10 minutes. An oiling would restore the beauty of the grain and the luster of the wood. After all those years they still look great today although they are now retired replaced by a pair of RTi 12s and a PSW1000 all in cherry finish.

I recently bought a mint pair of JBL 312 Floor Standing Monitors with a black Ash finish for my TV surround system mains. They are pretty good sized speakers and really pack a punch. They had been sitting in a friend's garage for a year or more and were pretty dirty. After getting them home I cleaned them several times with a damp cloth and while it got the accumulated dust and other crud off, the black finish was still pretty sorry looking. It was dull and had an almost white sheen to them in large areas. The damp cloth treatments made them look good only until the wetness dried. I applied Old English lemon oil and they look great, like new in fact. The wood almost glows and the grain is very prominent standing out even through the black finish.

I haven't yet done anything to the Polk speakers because I have only had them for a month or so. So can anybody tell me why such applications of wood care products is verboten? What products are recommended when a damp cloth isn't enough? What do you do when the wood does get dry?

janmike

I do not use any polish and any wood in my house. A damp cloth is all I have ever and will ever use.

F1nut

Ah, the myths of wood care.

Lemon oil = mineral oil with lemon scent. Would you apply motor oil to the exterior of your car? Of course not, so why put oil on your furniture. A good wax on either goes a long way though.

Liquid Gold and Old English contain petroleum distillates, usually paint thinner or kerosene with the smell removed/replaced with something more pleasant. Again, ugh!

Pledge contains silicone and wax. Silicone contamination is really nasty when it comes to touch up/repair/refinishing, plus it leaves smudges and builds up over time. Just about the worst thing you could put on your furniture other than Murphy's Oil Soap which is a vegetable oil based product. Can you say rancid!

What furniture polish will do:
Add temporary scratch resistance
Add temporary shine to a dull surface
Help pick up dust
Fill the room with a pleasant smell, although short term

What furniture polish won't do:
Feed the wood by replacing missing oils
Feed the finish
Protect against heat, water, solvent or chemical damage
Slow deterioration caused by light or oxidation

If a finish is dull and lifeless, sometimes a good wax can restore the sheen or the finish has reached the end of it's lifespan and the item needs refinishing or the actual clear coat finish started life with a flat sheen. If you don't like that sheen, the finish can be buffed to a higher satin or gloss sheen.

What do you do when the wood does get dry?

Thank the guys who made your furniture with dry wood because wood containing more than 6-8% moisture will warp, crack and check. One of the purposes of clear coat finishes is to keep moisture out. As long as that finish is in good condition you CAN'T add moisture to the wood. In other words, none of that stuff can penatrate the clear coat finish, it mearly sits on top of it.

If you have to use a polish product for dusting, etc., Guardsman makes a decent water based polish. If you just want to raise the sheen, a good waxing will do that or have the item buffed out.

jimmyzen

F1nut wrote: »

Ah, the myths of wood care.

Lemon oil = mineral oil with lemon scent. Would you apply motor oil to the exterior of your car? Of course not, so why put oil on your furniture. A good wax on either goes a long way though.

Interesting point, but as I said, my JBL L100s going on 30+ years old still look great. As to the car analogy, if I pour a puddle of oil onto my car it will be there until it fills with dust and turns to sludge or whatever. If I pour [furniture] oil on my speaker cabinet it soaks in.

F1nut wrote: »

Liquid Gold and Old English contain petroleum distillates, usually paint thinner or kerosene with the smell removed/replaced with something more pleasant. Again, ugh!

Don't most stain and other wood coloration and preservation products also contain these chemicals or variations thereof?

F1nut wrote: »

Pledge contains silicone and wax. Silicone contamination is really nasty when it comes to touch up/repair/refinishing, plus it leaves smudges and builds up over time. Just about the worst thing you could put on your furniture other than Murphy's Oil Soap which is a vegetable oil based product. Can you say rancid!

Agreed. Being a biker type of guy I have a hard time finding leather treatment products that don't contain silicone which discolors leather with a whitish/grey haze.

F1nut wrote: »

What furniture polish will do:
Add temporary scratch resistance
Add temporary shine to a dull surface
Help pick up dust
Fill the room with a pleasant smell, although short term.

Yep. No argument there.

F1nut wrote: »

What furniture polish won't do:
Feed the wood by replacing missing oils
Feed the finish
Protect against heat, water, solvent or chemical damage
Slow deterioration caused by light or oxidation.

Interesting. Most of what you say is contrary to what the makers of these products claim.

F1nut wrote: »

If a finish is dull and lifeless, sometimes a good wax can restore the sheen or the finish has reached the end of it's lifespan and the item needs refinishing or the actual clear coat finish started life with a flat sheen. If you don't like that sheen, the finish can be buffed to a higher satin or gloss sheen.

Thank the guys who made your furniture with dry wood because wood containing more than 6-8% moisture will warp, crack and check. One of the purposes of clear coat finishes is to keep moisture out. As long as that finish is in good condition you CAN'T add moisture to the wood. In other words, none of that stuff can penatrate the clear coat finish, it mearly sits on top of it.

If you have to use a polish product for dusting, etc., Guardsman makes a decent water based polish. If you just want to raise the sheen, a good waxing will do that or have the item buffed out.

I appreciate the advice. I'll try to find some of this polish and try it. It appears that wood care is one of those esoteric subjects where everything I thought I knew is wrong despite never having harmed anything and having been happy with the end result. I am not doubting you; it's hard to discount what my eyes and experience have shown me over the years. I will abstain from using anything on my Polks since they are new and see how they look against the speakers I have (two pairs of JBLs and 6 Onkyos in the house and a pair of Klipsch on the garage audio system) already been oiling.

I really hope some other people reply to this who have treated their cabinets as I have been doing with similar or the identical products I have been using. It would also be very interesting to hear from anyone who actually damaged anything by using Old English, lemon oil, or other products.

F1nut

jimmyzen wrote: »

Interesting point, but as I said, my JBL L100s going on 30+ years old still look great. As to the car analogy, if I pour a puddle of oil onto my car it will be there until it fills with dust and turns to sludge or whatever. If I pour [furniture] oil on my speaker cabinet it soaks in.

In that case, your speakers were never finished with a clear coat, probably just an oil finish. The reason they become dull is the oil dries out. You add more oil with the application of "lemon oil", which is really mineral oil and that in turn dries out. However, "lemon oil" is the wrong product to use on an oiled finish. You should really use something like Watco Danish Oil, which will last much longer than mineral oil and has better properties for the purpose.

Don't most stain and other wood coloration and preservation products also contain these chemicals or variations thereof?

Yes, stains and most dyes do, but they go on UNDER the finish. Preservation products?

Agreed. Being a biker type of guy I have a hard time finding leather treatment products that don't contain silicone which discolors leather with a whitish/grey haze.

Have you tried a Tack shop?

Interesting. Most of what you say is contrary to what the makers of these products claim.

It's a billion dollar a year business, what do you think they are going to say? It's like Bose telling everyone that their products are the greatest. Those who know, know that's BS. As an antique restorer, I know what wood products are and what they do and what they can't do.

I really hope some other people reply to this who have treated their cabinets as I have been doing with similar or the identical products I have been using. It would also be very interesting to hear from anyone who actually damaged anything by using Old English, lemon oil, or other products.

Stop in my shop, I'd be happy to show you.

bikezappa

F1 thanks for the information. I also would like to know what brand waxes you would recommend for wood.

F1nut

I've been caring for my Yamaha NS10M's with lemon oil for 25+ years now. They have a gorgous black veneer fiinish. What would you recommend as far as a good furniture wax? And would you recommend this as far as preserving the finish on the RTi's?

Were the Yammies originally finished with an oil finish or a clear coat? If an oil finish, then I'd recommend you continue to apply oil, but use a product like Watco Danish Oil instead of mineral (lemon) oil.

A very nice wax is Renaissance Wax, which is made in England, but sold here. Wax should only be applied once a year at the most. On speakers, which are not handled the way a chair or table would be, a coat of wax will last for many years. The best things you can do to preserve any finish is to keep the item out of direct sunlight, away from heat sources and dust often. Other than that, the clear coat applied to your speakers can not be preserved, so to speak. It is what it is and when it reaches the end of it's lifespan, it's time to refinish.

I also would like to know what brand waxes you would recommend for wood.

As noted above, Renaissance Wax.

jimmyzen

Thanks for the explanations and advice. It was somewhat comforting to know I wasn't the only one who had questions about wood care. I'm glad I asked.

As to the Tack shop for leather care products no, I hadn't thought about it probably because cowboys and bikers didn't exactly have love for each other back in the day. It's almost second nature to avoid places where those of the pointy boots frequent. (a black friend of mine and I had a very interesting conversation one day about things we look for before going into a bar in a strange town like a majority of the vehicles in the parking lot being pick up trucks, etc. that are warning signs to stay away!) There is one about 20 miles south of me I will check out though. hopefully those days are behind us.

can the waxes you metioned be purchased on-line? I really doubt I could find any of those products locally and I work so many hours and so many days a week a shopping junket is not practical.

F1nut

I can only go by what you stated, "If I pour [furniture] oil on my speaker cabinet it soaks in." That tells me they were originally an oiled finish because if they had a clear coat (lacquer) the oil would not soak in, just sit on top. Any oiled finish will need to be reoiled from time to time, but a product like Watco is better suited than mineral oil.


Jimmy, I'm sure you can find it online.

F1nut

Mike, you're welcome. One word of caution, after applying the Watco, wet the rag with water and lay it out flat, outside, to dry before throwing it away. This is not a polish, but a finishing product, so you only need to use it maybe once or twice a year.

Book'em Dano

jimmyzen

Yes, many thanks kind sir. Your advice will be heeded and I shall begin the quest to fine some of the products you mentioned.

Here's a "that's how my mind works and I can't help it" tale. I have an RTi 12 in cherry that was damaged by UPS getting to me. I bought a replacement not wanting to be on the hunt since they are on sale and discontinued. Today UPS called me to tell me they would reimburse me for the full cost of replacing the speaker and the check had been mailed to me. They want the damaged speaker back and will pick it up next week. I simply could not resist a quick wipedown on one side with lemon oil. I hate that I liked the way it looked and promise not to oil the set I am keeping. I just couldn't help myself. I guess that's why I thought my name was Dammit Jimmy for the first 10 years of my life!:D

Out of curiosity, what would you charge to refinish a set of RTi 10 or 12 sized speakers and/or something that tall but twice the width? Would a black finish cost more? This is assuming there are no scratches, dings, etc. to repair, just straight up new clear coat. I'm just curious.

F1nut

Dammit Jimmy!

I never give estimates without seeing the job first, sorry.

McLoki

I use a paste wax (johnsons) made for wood. I don't apply it very often and like when waxing a car - apply it, then buff with a clean rag (turning often to keep a clean surface on the wood). Works great and the wood looks nice after I am done.

I just did this to a pair of monitor 10's I had just picked up and the cabinets went from dull with light scratches to very nice and I don't see\notice the scratches hardly at all anymore....

Michael

jimmyzen

F1nut wrote: »

Dammit Jimmy!

I never give estimates without seeing the job first, sorry.

I should have worded this differently- what could one expect to pay to have a set of speakers the size of an RTi 12 recoated with whatever the finish is?

I'm not looking to get a set redone; I'm just curious. I'm just looking for a barnyard figure here. Say, for instance if it would cost $500 to replace a speaker with a new one vs. $475.00 to have the speaker refinished to restore its appearance I would probably buy a new one. No, not really. If I could make it look acceptable by doing something evil like applying furniture polish a couple times a year that's what I'd do. The exception would be if it was a rare unit, crazy expensive, etc.

The Rti 12 that was damaged by UPS I referred to had a dent midway down the right top side on the edge. The dent is about the size and depth of my thumb (I have big hands) and broke all the way through the veneer. While exploring repair/replacement options before filing the claim I enquired at a local cabinet shop. From the conversation I had with the owner repair I was told it would have been more costly to repair the speaker by quite a bit than replacing it. He said that the old veneer would have to be removed and replaced because there was no good way to restore the wood grain pattern otherwise. He never gave me a dollar amount, but I had told him that I was looking at about $560 to replace it. Polk quoted $400 for a new cabinet and $40.00 for a new grille plus shipping. I gathered that didn't include acoustic material, sealer, or any other stuff that would be required. After the closeout sales began I bought a new one from Crutchfield for $475.00 with free shipping. UPS paid off the full amount.