More Ramblings from a Fellow 'Phoole

Early B.

Although I’ve only been an audiophoole for a short time, I thought I’d share a few opinions and lessons learned. Hopefully, someone new to audio can gain something from it and the veterans can teach me something, as well. Feel free to disagree. Here goes:

1. Tone is everything. It is what every audiophile strives to hear, whether he/she realizes it or not. Every "upgrade" should improve tonal quality; otherwise, get rid of it and try something else.

2. The secret lies in the source. I realize we’ve had this debate here before, but I look at it from two perspectives – my common sense tells me that if the music starts out at a source ill defined, there’s no amount of high end equipment behind it that can salvage the sound. My limited experience tells me, thus far, that upgrades or modifications to the source yield major improvements if the downstream equipment “stays out of the way” and lets the signal flow (relatively) unimpeded.

3. Cables rule! You gotta experiment with them.

4. CDs suck, but we’re stuck. Most CDs are poorly recorded. The more revealing your system becomes, the more you’ll wanna make Frisbees out of your favorite CDs.

5. Go through all of your CDs. Compile a list of reference music tracks. These aren’t necessarily your favorite tunes, but the music that sounds the best on your system. This list will prove beneficial when showing off your equipment and when you’re in the mood to listen to the best cuts you’ve got. It’s also a good list for examining changes and tweaks to your system.

6. Buy the best gear. Yes, you can afford it. There are tons of “giant killers” in every category. These giant killers are usually “off the beaten path.” The key to finding them is to do plenty of research and to be patient. Another hint is to look at what isn't selling. If you hardly find a used "Widget Audio 3000" for sale, or they are sold within hours of being listed at close to their retail price, it could be a winner.

7. Audiophile friends are essential. You gotta be able to try out new things on someone’s system other than your own. This helps tremendously with the learning curve and allows you to gain more confidence in using your own ears.

8. Here’s one to stir some controversy -- It’s gotta be pretty. Yeah, I said it. Beyond the WAF thing, I like my components to look nice. Hell, I’ve even gone as far as performing major cosmetic surgery on my CDP and painting my pre. It’s a psychological satisfaction thing – if it looks good, it sounds good. It’s kinda like a golf club – it’s gotta look good and feel good to me in order for it to work well.

9. Buy it used, but not abused. Why buy new when you can get the same item, often in MINT condition for half off retail or better? Most audiophiles take care of their gear, so it’s a good investment.

10. Forums like this one are invaluable.

11. Finally, your system is never good enough, but there’s gotta be a point at which you stop flipping gear every 6 weeks (at least for your reference system) and work with what you’ve got. Then tweak the hell out if it and enjoy the music.

Rambling complete...(until the next post).;)

tonyb

I think you need a cup of java and a jelly donut this morning.:)

Good points btw.

fatchowmein

#8 is not controversial. I see it as Pride in Ownership. Plus, you've got rule #1 and #6 to keep you out of trouble.

Nice list.

george daniel

#2 cannot be overemphasized,,, followed by numbah 6

engtaz

george we think alike. +2

Mike Reeter

I agree with all of your points,especially #2...and #8.

I currently have three pieces of Blackface and two pieces of Silverface gear in the rack...and it's driving me nuts:D

I will never be quite happy with the "look" of things,until everything matches.

How petty is that ?

steveinaz

Good points Early. I'm a form follows function kinda guy, so physical appearance doesn't matter to in as far as colors/finishes. When it comes to condition, I'm seriously anal. I take very good care of my equipment and can't stand having a knick or scratch on anything.

One I'd like to add is an old one, from audio 101: Concentrate the majority of your money on your speakers. Sure, you want a good source--no doubt--but nothing has such a drastic effect on overall tone, than speakers. Try to "get by" on compromise speakers, and you'll end up chasing your audio tail.

Note: If you find yourself listening to the equipment, and not the music--something is wrong.

WilliamM2

All that rambling, and you failed to mention one of the most important things. The ROOM.

Room treatments will yield much greater improvement than any equipment upgrade.

And Steve is right on about listening to the music, not the equipment.

F1nut

Bravo, especially #1 and 2.

#4, I would point out applies to all formats, not just CD's.

schwarcw

Great words of wisdom! I would agree with all points. I like that your message applies to all types of equipment. It's not CD vs vinyl, or solid state vs tube. All your experience is relevant to all audio hobbyists, no matter what level of experience or investment. Thanks for the thoughtful post.:)

Yashu

I agree with just about all of that!

Also, about reference tracks and bad recordings, sometimes a bad recording can make a good reference. I have one Billy Cobham record that sounds harsh on all but the best systems, it is a good way for me to test things out quickly... if those symbols are harsh then whatever I just did/bought is no good!

I wish I had more audiophile friends... that would be cool... The friend I do have that is closest to an audiophile is more into HT and can't understand why I spend so much on "just stereo".

Early B.

WilliamM2 wrote: »

All that rambling, and you failed to mention one of the most important things. The ROOM.

Agreed. But for many people, including myself, room treatments beyond the typical throw rug, drapes, etc. aren't feasible. I can't put bass traps in the corners of my den, or hang acoustic panels on the wall or suspend them from the ceiling.

reeltrouble1

schwarcw wrote: »

Great words of wisdom! I would agree with all points. I like that your message applies to all types of equipment. It's not CD vs vinyl, or solid state vs tube. All your experience is relevant to all audio hobbyists, no matter what level of experience or investment. Thanks for the thoughtful post.:)

Yes Carl but just to avoid any little confusion......TUBES RULE;)

I always Enjoy Early's posts, he tries things out with such an open mind.

Good Points Bro.

Steve as well.

Neskahi

#4. So just how does one assure thay are purchasing
a quality recording? One that comes to mind is my son's
Led Zepplin Greatest Hits. Sounds like crap, it's old stuff
but muddled and zero stage effect. Eagle's Greatest Hits is
wonderful.

cfrizz

Precisely! Some artists took great care throughout the entire process of the album & some didn't. You won't find a bad cd of any Eagles album. The cd is a great medium for music. If you get a muddled one, blame whoever transferred the music to the cd!

Neskahi wrote: »

#4. So just how does one assure thay are purchasing
a quality recording? One that comes to mind is my son's
Led Zepplin Greatest Hits. Sounds like crap, it's old stuff
but muddled and zero stage effect. Eagle's Greatest Hits is
wonderful.

reeltrouble1

So your letting that one pass Frizz??........gave up finally.......did ya...

Agreed, Eagles Desperado is awesome.

RT1

hearingimpared

Great rant EB. . .I like every point especially the CD are horrible one. However I do have some CDs that are real gems so I have to throw in with the some, not all, CDs are horrible camp, although they don't have the same depth of image that LPs have.

I have the Led Zepplin box set and it is awful but then again I just listened to the LP of Led Zepplin III, great, great music that sounds like pure diarrhea.

Tube rule huh!!! Well RT1 I can't argue cause I ain't heard any tubes in 20 years and back then the only thing they ruled was the trash can, noisy, microphonic messes.:p Not entirely true, I've heard Phil's CJ tube pre and it does sound sweet. I've also heard some tubed CDPs and they were awful.

I have to admit though I've never heard a fully tubed system and look forward to the experience.

Early B.

Neskahi wrote: »

#4. So just how does one assure thay are purchasing a quality recording?

There are companies that produce high quality CDs such as Mapleshade, MSFL, Concord, Chesky, and a few others. Also check out www.stevehoffman.tv.

Most jazz recordings from folks like Blue Note are mastered fairly well. It's the commerical stuff (pop, rap, rock, etc.) that usually sounds horrific.

hearingimpared

Early B. wrote: »

There are companies that produce high quality CDs such as Mapleshade, MSFL, Concord, Chesky, and a few others. Also check out www.stevehoffman.tv.

Most jazz recordings from folks like Blue Note are mastered fairly well. It's the commerical stuff (pop, rap, rock, etc.) that usually sounds horrific.

Yep thems what I was talking about!

Yashu

I listen to a lot of electronic music. Abstract, IDM, minimalist, ect... and some of these albums take the medium of digital and turn it completely on it's head. Think about it... an album that may not have a single analog source or instrument, one crafted entirely in the digital realm... Autechre, are one of the artists that comes to mind, where the music can be so abstract, that you don't even have a reference point with which to compare, to find out how it is "supposed" to sound.

I enjoy these types of records A LOT because I am not listening to "find fault", I am listening to experience... and system tweaks and changes become more about finding the sound that gives you the most pleasure. It is kindof anti-audiophile but still a lot of fun. These albums also make great test CDs, because of the surgical detail and insane dynamics, to use along with "analog" music.

As digital becomes more "analog" (like with re-mastering, upsampling, SACD, ect...), I still think that it is kindof a cathartic experience to listen to a digital disc with 0% A/D conversion and associated perils.

tonyb

O % A/D conversion????
Somewhere along the chain,you still have A/D conversion going on before it hits your speakers.

Yashu

Not true.

Take Autechre's EP7 album. If I play it on a redbook transport that goes right to a good DAC and then out to my amp and then speakers, there is NO A/D conversion happening at all... the album was made digitally and the only conversion is the final D/A conversion, which is a totally different animal, since that is something that YOU can control, unlike how the album was recorded, mastered, transferred at the studio.

You can't fix a bad recording, you can only try to mask it's flaws, that was my point. With some electronic music, the recording is essentially "perfect", giving your system total control of the final sound.

tonyb

I get what your saying,but since all speakers are an analog device,playing anything digital will have to be converted.AS far as a/d conversion goes,you may be right,but d/a is always happening.Exactly how do you control the dac?
just curious.Point being,almost impossible to play something digital and hear it as such thru speakers that are analog,without some sort of coversion going on.


Btw- digital is not really perfect,all depends on the studio recording it to their taste.
Perfect to me is live music.

I guess I was confused,you ment a/d not d/a

cfrizz

There is nothing to give up on Ted. Your kind are an extinct species!:p

reeltrouble1 wrote: »

So your letting that one pass Frizz??........gave up finally.......did ya...

Agreed, Eagles Desperado is awesome.

RT1

tonyb

I think the word your looking for Cathy is...unique.
Nothing like makeing dear 'ol Ted seem old by useing the word extinct.:)

hearingimpared

tonyb wrote: »

IPerfect to me is live music.

. . . unamplified live music at that. I've heard some extremely well done live performances recorded.

madmax

Early B. wrote: »

Although I’ve only been an audiophoole for a short time, I thought I’d share a few opinions and lessons learned. Hopefully, someone new to audio can gain something from it and the veterans can teach me something, as well. Feel free to disagree. Rambling complete...(until the next post).;)

Very well written! Although I somewhat agree with the general outline of your ramble, at least for most people, my general outlook is a little different. Below are some of my alternate thoughts.

1. Tone is everything. I found "tone" quite some time ago and truely believe it is #1. It can be had for high or low dollar amounts and is the real reason I like audio. When you hear all the different sounds of each instrument it is something wonderful.

2. Source? Gotta dispute this one. Synergy is the key, not the source. With synergy you can have a very low dollar setup which outperforms the highest priced (quality) setup.

3. If you got the wrong cables you will never get where you are going.

4. The worst CD's are better than the worst vinyl. However, the best vinyl just can't be beat for tone. Sure, there are different methods of comparison and if #1 for you is quietness or convienience, then CD's win hands down. If tone is #1, look towards vinyl.

5. Compile your best sounding tracks? Nah, only the novice does that. I used to. Forget what others think and play the piece of music that you think sounds cool, not the best. We all want to share that piece of heaven we found and have others agree but in reality, they will hear it differently anyway.

6. Buy the best gear? Absolutely correct. Trick #1 is knowing it will not necessarily cost the most or look the coolest. Trick #2 is knowing what the best is and how to listen for it. I'm still working on #2.

7. Right there with you on this one. Hearing the best out of other systems is absolutely necessary to figure out where you missed the boat. Believe me, you missed it somewhere.

8. Pretty? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. It doesn't have to be stinkin' pretty. Give me the ugliest you got if it sounds the best. I can appreciate a classy looking system but at the end of the evening, it either sounds exceptional or it doesn't.

9. Buy used. Oh yea, let someone else take a 50%+ loss. I'm only interested in the sound, not what came out last week.

10. +10 on the forums.

11. Flip gear for awhile until it synergizes, then tweak the hell out of it.

At least those are my opinions.
madmax

Early B.

Very cool, Max. You got a good point on #2 re: synergy. Problem is -- you don't know you have synergy until you realize the gear you just bought sounds worse, then you gotta re-purchase the old stuff or sell the stuff you just got. The point at which you think your system starts to click is just the beginning. That's the dilemma audiophiles constantly find themselves in. On top of that, the baseline constantly changes. What you thought sounded great last week sounds like crap this week.

hearingimpared

Early B. wrote: »

Very cool, Max. You got a good point on #2 re: synergy. Problem is -- you don't know you have synergy until you realize the gear you just bought sounds worse, then you gotta re-purchase the old stuff or sell the stuff you just got. The point at which you think your system starts to click is just the beginning. That's the dilemma audiophiles constantly find themselves in. On top of that, the baseline constantly changes. What you thought sounded great last week sounds like crap this week.

Yep I'm absolutely with the synergy thing. I've really lucked out so far with synergy and I do have the week to week problem but I found that if I'm not in a good mood to stay away from the rig because a rotten mood leads to the rig sounding like somebody put horseshit in the drivers.

Yashu

Cables! Yes!

You never know how important they are until you try a bunch of them. Cables are a great way to "tune" your system after you have found your basic synergy. I never used to buy into this either until I started to swap cables after getting a good set of speakers that could reveal the differences. I have ICs that sound best with "dark" speakers, and ICs that sound best with "bright" speakers... I think as far as cables go, it is probably money better spent on interconnects than speaker wire... I am not sure why, but ICs seem to make greater sound differences.

Before I got into this, the natural assumption was to assume that speaker wire made the biggest difference... but some good extention cord wire, cat5 cable, or some halfway decent oxygen free radioshack stuff will work fine, but try to use any old RCA cable and your system can sound like puke.

Early B.

Yashu wrote: »

Before I got into this, the natural assumption was to assume that speaker wire made the biggest difference... but some good extention cord wire, cat5 cable, or some halfway decent oxygen free radioshack stuff will work fine, but try to use any old RCA cable and your system can sound like puke.

Keep tweaking. Speaker cables make an equally huge difference, too.