Adding Tubes into the Chain
venomclan
Posts: 2,467
Hi Guys,
I have been playing with the idea of adding a tube somewhere in my system. I have heard from many an audiophile that this is a must to reduce the "digital" factor.
Anywhoo, I pretty much devised that tube amps are not something I would like to tackle at this time. Same for a tube cd player as I use the Denon 2900 as a transport and do not want to spend the dough to replace it. That leaves a tube preamp or dac. I would consider a tube pre but it would have to have an HT passthru to replace my Krell Kav250P that has it. And also play nice with my Outlaw 950.
A tube dac seems the most cost effective and hopefully lowest maintenance.
Would a tube dac be heads & shoulders in performance above my Bel Canto Dac1.1? Would the tube dac "open up" other positive attributes of my other digital gear? Any thoughts are appreciated.
I am an addmitted Tube novice. Thanks,
V
I have been playing with the idea of adding a tube somewhere in my system. I have heard from many an audiophile that this is a must to reduce the "digital" factor.
Anywhoo, I pretty much devised that tube amps are not something I would like to tackle at this time. Same for a tube cd player as I use the Denon 2900 as a transport and do not want to spend the dough to replace it. That leaves a tube preamp or dac. I would consider a tube pre but it would have to have an HT passthru to replace my Krell Kav250P that has it. And also play nice with my Outlaw 950.
A tube dac seems the most cost effective and hopefully lowest maintenance.
Would a tube dac be heads & shoulders in performance above my Bel Canto Dac1.1? Would the tube dac "open up" other positive attributes of my other digital gear? Any thoughts are appreciated.
I am an addmitted Tube novice. Thanks,
V
Post edited by venomclan on
Comments
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What about a tube buffer from Musical Fidelity?I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
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I was thinking about that as I have seen Dac Attack, 3 piece systems from them. I think it is the buffer, power supply and something else?
Also have heard of Scott Nixon dacs very favorably. I guess synergy would have to be a factor as well.
V -
Do you have a "digital" sounding system? Your Krell stuff is supposedly high quality, and your other components are impressive, so it should mitigate the digital sound.HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50 LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub
"God grooves with tubes." -
v, you might want to take a look at this tube DAC. It's a Sigma.. uses one 12AX7 tube... which are easily available. I use one similar, but it's the next step up.. which would be a Alpha tube DAC from California Audio Labs. I really like mine, but I've never heard any other DAC's.. so I have nothing to compare it to.
This Sigma DAC and the one I use are 18bit DAC's. there were 24bit DAC's built by CAL Labs, and they show up on Epay once in a while.. and are always gobbled up right away. I'd love to have the 24bit DAC some time.
http://cgi.ebay.com/California-Audio-Labs-Sigma-Telefunken-Tube_W0QQitemZ150114516020QQihZ005QQcategoryZ64629QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemPolkFest 2012, who's going>?
Vancouver, Canada Sept 30th, 2012 - Madonna concert :cheesygrin: -
Do you have a "digital" sounding system? Your Krell stuff is supposedly high quality, and your other components are impressive, so it should mitigate the digital sound.
Hi Early,
I am not really sure how to answer that as I have never had a non-digital system. I guess I am shooting from the hip as tubes would be the next upgrade path; presumably.
I recently heard the Gallos I bought used in a dedicated room with MF gear: A5 preamp and dac, tube cd player with SS Parasound Halo amp. I really liked the sound. However, there was a lot of background noise and the owner said that he had a tube on the fritz. My room sucks accoustically. So it is hard to compare apples to apples.
I have heard and tend to agree that gear should synergize with each other for max. perfomance. One piece should zig where the other zags. My Krell stuff is very detailed and controlled. One might say a bit on the bright side. What I know of tubes, is that they tend to bring a warmth and keep the detail. My new speakers are really opening up the soundstage and it is exciting as new information is revealed on familiar recordings.
V -
Do you have a "digital" sounding system? Your Krell stuff is supposedly high quality, and your other components are impressive, so it should mitigate the digital sound.
I've found the exact opposite- the high quality gear tends to reveal the failings of the source. It's frustrating because the more you spend, the more you hear, but sometimes what you hear isn't good.Gallo Ref 3.1 : Bryston 4b SST : Musical fidelity CD Pre : VPI HW-19
Gallo Ref AV, Frankengallo Ref 3, LC60i : Bryston 9b SST : Meridian 565
Jordan JX92s : MF X-T100 : Xray v8
Backburner:Krell KAV-300i -
I would gather to say try a tubed pre first.
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I've found the exact opposite- the high quality gear tends to reveal the failings of the source. It's frustrating because the more you spend, the more you hear, but sometimes what you hear isn't good.
Yep. Lousy recordings can be frustrating. The better the gear gets, the greater the need to seek out good quality recordings.HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50 LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub
"God grooves with tubes." -
I would gather to say try a tubed pre first.__________________
Another option but would eb more expensive by far. I do not know how accurate this is but when Stereophile reviewed the tube buffer, they commented on how it made the sound like a tube pre. ? I guess an in home demo is the only way to know for sure.
V -
I have owned the Bel Canto DAC 1.1 and DAC 2 (you probably have the DAC 1.1 I sold to George Daniel). Anyway, the Bel Canto's are anything but digital sounding. Smooth as silk is how I would describe them. The music just flowed with ease with those things in the chain. The Bel Canto DAC's were far less digital sounding than my NAD or Arcam CD players.
Do you have your Krell amps plugged into your power conditioner? If so, try plugging them directly into the wall. I had my McCormack amp plugged into a Belkin power conditioner (a lower model) but the Belkin seemed to suck a little bit of life out of my amp and system...Sony KDL-40V2500 HDTV, Rotel RSX-1067 Receiver, Sony BDP-S550 Blu-ray, Slim Devices Squeezebox, Polk RTi6, CSi3 & R15, DIY sub with Atlas 15 -
Hi Early,
I am not really sure how to answer that as I have never had a non-digital system. I guess I am shooting from the hip as tubes would be the next upgrade path; presumably.
I recently heard the Gallos I bought used in a dedicated room with MF gear: A5 preamp and dac, tube cd player with SS Parasound Halo amp. I really liked the sound. However, there was a lot of background noise and the owner said that he had a tube on the fritz. My room sucks accoustically. So it is hard to compare apples to apples.
I have heard and tend to agree that gear should synergize with each other for max. perfomance. One piece should zig where the other zags. My Krell stuff is very detailed and controlled. One might say a bit on the bright side. What I know of tubes, is that they tend to bring a warmth and keep the detail. My new speakers are really opening up the soundstage and it is exciting as new information is revealed on familiar recordings.
V
This one sentence speaks volumes. "My room sucks accoustically". If that's the case I wouldn't drop another dime on any gear until you take care of that problem. The room is by far the most important piece of gear. And yes it should be considered as a piece of gear along w/ all the other stuff. You can swap out all the gear you want, but to no avail if you haven't taken care of your room. I've done some treatments (bass traps, absorption panels, corner traps) & the difference has been unbelievable. It's just that treating your room isn't as glamorous as adding a new amp, preamp, etc. Bottom line, the room will make or break a good system."2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up. -
Ditto, same here. And after 40 linear feet of bass traps and 72 sq feet of acoustic panels/tiles, calling it unglamorous is an understatementpearsall001 wrote: »This one sentence speaks volumes. "My room sucks accoustically". If that's the case I wouldn't drop another dime on any gear until you take care of that problem. The room is by far the most important piece of gear. And yes it should be considered as a piece of gear along w/ all the other stuff. You can swap out all the gear you want, but to no avail if you haven't taken care of your room. I've done some treatments (bass traps, absorption panels, corner traps) & the difference has been unbelievable. It's just that treating your room isn't as glamorous as adding a new amp, preamp, etc. Bottom line, the room will make or break a good system.
Tannoy Dimension TD10, SOTA Star Sapphire, Heathkit W4A's, McIntosh MC2100, Eddie-Current Zana Deux, Singlepower SDS, Sennheiser HD650, Audio-Technica L3000, Sony Qualia 010
