Upgrading Carver Amps...

Bill Ayotte
Bill Ayotte Posts: 1,860
edited April 2007 in DIY, Mods & Tweaks
I am thinking about upgrading my Carver M200t and my M400t's. I was thinking power supply/caps, and replacing the spring clips with actual binding posts. I am looking for suggestions as far as capacitor/power supply companies, and a good place to get them. Any tips would also be appreciated.:)
Post edited by Bill Ayotte on
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  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited March 2007
    If those amps are more than ten years old then caps changing the filter caps is a good Idea.Try to find replacments with greater capacitance than the originals but will still fit on the PCB properly .Of course they must have the same or higher voltage.For longer life they should have a 105 deg temp rating.

    The Panasonics TSNH series from digi key should be fine but UCC is another good choice.
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  • Bill Ayotte
    Bill Ayotte Posts: 1,860
    edited March 2007
    Thanks. Where can I pick these up?
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  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited March 2007
    Bill Ayotte wrote:
    Thanks. Where can I pick these up?
    The Panasonics are available here http://www.digikey.com/ Before you buy replacements check the spacing of the solder termials to be sure you get ones that will fit.The digi key catalog has this info.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,194
    edited March 2007
    Bill, if you haven't already looked at the www.diyaudio.com forum, this is a great place for hands on advice. There are several very knowledgeable Carver techs over there that can help out.

    Join or look at the Solid Sate forum and pay special attention to a moderator named Anatech. Great guy, no b.s. and really knows his stuff. He'll tell you what will work and what is a waste of money and time. His specailties seem to be Adcom, Nakamichi and Carver among many others.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,194
    edited March 2007
    GV#27 wrote:
    If those amps are more than ten years old then caps changing the filter caps is a good Idea.Try to find replacments with greater capacitance than the originals but will still fit on the PCB properly .Of course they must have the same or higher voltage.For longer life they should have a 105 deg temp rating.

    The Panasonics TSNH series from digi key should be fine but UCC is another good choice.

    Also be very careful of adding caps with greater capacitance. Caps with higher voltage rating are ok, but increasing capacitance can be disasterous. There are several different designs that Carver used over the years and some are a complete opposite of each other so one really needs to know how their particular Carver works before attemting to start upgrading.

    They had conventional designs and a very complicated switching rail design which can kill if poked and prodded incorrectly. All I'm saying is know what yo've got and what you are doing before you start.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,194
    edited March 2007
    Nichicon, Mallory and Panasonic are popular. Digikey is good place as is Mouser from what I've heard. Although Mouser may require minimums.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • avguytx
    avguytx Posts: 1,628
    edited March 2007
    And if it gets right down to it, just send them to Rita at Classic Carver Repair in Washington. (no affiliation...just a happy customer) I already had one rebuilt and am getting the second one done soon. She went thru everything on it and replaced what needed to be...electrolytics, etc. I'm running a single M-1.0t right now but have a second one coming for bridging (or bi-amping). I concur with heiney9. The Carver amps were an interesting design that I don't know how many would understand the concept of them. Rita was with Bob Carver back in the Phase Linear days (from 1974) and is with Sunfire now.

    But, I know the feeling of doing things yourself but since I'm not at electronic wiz when it comes to that, I leave it to someone else. Now, most anything else, I'm good to go! lol
    Richard? Who's your favorite Little Rascal? Alfalfa? Or is it........................Spanky?.................................Sinner.
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  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited March 2007
    heiney9 wrote:
    Also be very careful of adding caps with greater capacitance. Caps with higher voltage rating are ok, but increasing capacitance can be disasterous. There are several different designs that Carver used over the years and some are a complete opposite of each other so one really needs to know how their particular Carver works before attemting to start upgrading.

    They had conventional designs and a very complicated switching rail design which can kill if poked and prodded incorrectly. All I'm saying is know what yo've got and what you are doing before you start.

    Disastorous?How so?If it is a standard linear supply (Transformer-bridge rec. -Capacitor)then increasing the amount of more capactance is not a problem but benificial ,and is an often done mod,I,ve done it myself on several units.

    I also clearly stated in my first post the need to observe proper voltage of replacement caps.

    But yes it is a good idea to get advice from someone who has actually worked on the specific unit in question.
    :)
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  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,123
    edited March 2007
    CCAR is no longer in service as of this Monday. Rita no longer works there.

    EDIT- See post below (near or at post 25) for update.....

    Rita still works there, that info. was false. The info. that they were closing was real, but things have changed for the better.
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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  • Bill Ayotte
    Bill Ayotte Posts: 1,860
    edited March 2007
    One of my M400t's has a shot power supply, anyone know where to get a new one besides Rolland? $300 is a little steep for me at the moment.....
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,194
    edited March 2007
    Bill Ayotte wrote:
    One of my M400t's has a shot power supply, anyone know where to get a new one besides Rolland? $300 is a little steep for me at the moment.....

    Besides here have you checked on the www.diyaudio.com forum? They can really help you out if you haven't been over there yet. Lot's of guys with experience
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • Bill Ayotte
    Bill Ayotte Posts: 1,860
    edited March 2007
    Just checked there and joined......Their "moderation policy" is kinda pissing me off.
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  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited March 2007
    Bill what part of the supply is lunched?
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  • Bill Ayotte
    Bill Ayotte Posts: 1,860
    edited March 2007
    I am not entirely sure.....It makes a loud clicking sound through both channels and from the amp itself.......It has a nasty buzz too..I am thinking I will upgrade the power cable the rca jacks, and replace the spring clips with binding posts...As well as the caps....Major tear-down!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,194
    edited March 2007
    Bill Ayotte wrote:
    Just checked there and joined......Their "moderation policy" is kinda pissing me off.

    Yes, I know what you mean and I forgot to mention it. It goes away real quick and then it's smooth sailing. They also don't seem to be as quick to respond compared to here, but hang with it and you'll get some great info.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • Bill Ayotte
    Bill Ayotte Posts: 1,860
    edited March 2007
    Yeah, that was a major annoyance.....I am used to slow, the carver forum isn't exactly lightning fast either.......
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  • avguytx
    avguytx Posts: 1,628
    edited March 2007
    No, the Carver forum moves at a very slow pace. lol. But I still like reading the posts and talking to the guys there. Lot's of good information to be had. Have you tried contacting "Classic Carver Repair"? That's where Rita does Carver amp repairs, etc. She is with Sunfire now but was with Bob thru the Carver years...maybe some Phase Linear. Can't remember exactly.
    Richard? Who's your favorite Little Rascal? Alfalfa? Or is it........................Spanky?.................................Sinner.
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  • Bill Ayotte
    Bill Ayotte Posts: 1,860
    edited March 2007
    I have talked to her as well, and I think I am just going to mod the damn thing. I guess they are closing soon, and there are about 6-7 guys on the carver forum scrambling to get their amps in there too, and I think she stopped accepting repairs as of yesterday....
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  • Deadof_knight
    Deadof_knight Posts: 980
    edited March 2007
    So with all that tfm-35s would see some improvement with upgrading anyone done these amps before ?
    :cool: " He who dies with the most equipment wins Right ? "

    Denon 3300 Adcom 535 BBe w/sub out 1 pr 4.6s 2 pr of 4 jrs Recent additions Samsung Lns-4095D LCD, Samsung hd-960 DVD, Monster HT-5000 Power center    ,HPSA-1000 18" sealed DiY home sub.:D
    Black Laquer 1.2tl's w/ upgraded x-overs and Tweets BI-Amped with 2 Carver tfm-35's Knukonceptz 10ga cables
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  • Bill Ayotte
    Bill Ayotte Posts: 1,860
    edited March 2007
    Not that I know of, all though I think it would be a lot easier because the it already has binding posts.....It would just be a matter of replacing them. As far as the caps go, I have no idea, but there is a lot more room in there than in the damn cube....
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  • Deadof_knight
    Deadof_knight Posts: 980
    edited March 2007
    sorry for the derail just had to ask though
    :cool: " He who dies with the most equipment wins Right ? "

    Denon 3300 Adcom 535 BBe w/sub out 1 pr 4.6s 2 pr of 4 jrs Recent additions Samsung Lns-4095D LCD, Samsung hd-960 DVD, Monster HT-5000 Power center    ,HPSA-1000 18" sealed DiY home sub.:D
    Black Laquer 1.2tl's w/ upgraded x-overs and Tweets BI-Amped with 2 Carver tfm-35's Knukonceptz 10ga cables
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  • Bill Ayotte
    Bill Ayotte Posts: 1,860
    edited March 2007
    Deadof_knight wrote:
    sorry for the derail just had to ask though
    It's cool man, as far as I am concerned it is basically the same subject...
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  • Deadof_knight
    Deadof_knight Posts: 980
    edited April 2007
    OK I have to ask why are they closing ?
    :cool: " He who dies with the most equipment wins Right ? "

    Denon 3300 Adcom 535 BBe w/sub out 1 pr 4.6s 2 pr of 4 jrs Recent additions Samsung Lns-4095D LCD, Samsung hd-960 DVD, Monster HT-5000 Power center    ,HPSA-1000 18" sealed DiY home sub.:D
    Black Laquer 1.2tl's w/ upgraded x-overs and Tweets BI-Amped with 2 Carver tfm-35's Knukonceptz 10ga cables
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  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,123
    edited April 2007
    Deadof_knight wrote:
    OK I have to ask why are they closing ?
    Updated information.

    I can answer that. There was a scare that CCAR [Mylinda and Rita] were closing the doors for good, and at one point that scare was real. Recent developments have gone to the good, and they will remain in business. I have been intimately involved with the latest news concerning CCAR and it looks like a move in location is inevitable. It will remain in the same area. They were gonna have a location directly across the street from Sunfire, but that deal fell thru. The current location will remain the same for about two months [approximately].
    I know of three repair shops for Carver gear in mainland US, and one in Canada, so it's not as if we have hit a brick wall for repairs.

    Sorry for the derail, Bill.
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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