Verifying my 650 connection to a Denon 3802

JediCowboy

I believe that after reading the threads here, consulting the manuals for the speakers sub and receiver, reading the Hartley book, and talking with some friends, I have the proper settings. I'll know for sure tonight when I unpack all those boxes and hook everything up

Could someone verify this for me or make any additional suggestions?

Denon AV Receiver 3802
Selectable Crossover at 80/100/120 Hz
If Front speakers are set to LARGE with the sub connected, I am given a choice of LFE or LFE + Main for bass output.

Polk Speakers
Floor Standing Fronts: RTi70
Center: CSi40
Surrounds: FXi50
Subwoofer: PSW650

The stereos, center and surrounds are all wired to their respective speaker outs. (Biwiring comes later!)

The sub is connected to the subwoofer pre-out on the receiver with a single RCA cable.

The RCA cable is split at the other end with a Y adaptor and connected to the L/R Line Level ins on the subwoofer.

Receiver configuration:

Front Speakers: LARGE
Center: SMALL
Surround: SMALL
Subwoofer: NONE (as per the 650 instruction manual) This will allow me to set the cossover manually with the dial on the 650?

Crossover and LFE settings: NOT SET because this option isn't available when I have the subwoofer set to NONE

This way seems right. But if there are any suggestions or reasons why something else might be better I'd love to hear it.
For Example:

Is it better to connect the subwoofer with speaker cable?

Would it be better to connect the subwoofer to the Left and Right Stereo Pre-Outs with 2 RCA cables? Or would this interfere with the Speaker Outs?

Thanks for your input!

RuSsMaN

Sub set to none, and connected via LFE? Try the 'YES' setting...

100's? I thought you were going to get the 70's.......

Cheers,
Russ

JediCowboy

Whoops! You're right -- I do have the 70s. My mistake from cutting and pasting that from an email I wrote last week. I'll edit that straight away.

As for the Sub out, its the subwoofer Pre-Out on on the Denon -- not labled as LFE, but Subwoofer. Yes, I was confused by the NONE setting for the subwoofer as well, but that's what it says under Option #2 on pages 7 and 8 of the PSW650 manual. This was the thing I was most curious about. Have you played with that setting?

RuSsMaN

I hear what you are saying now, sounds like that ship will sail....

Cheers,
Russ

hoosier21

I have (oops had) the 3802, if you set the subwoofer to none, it will not send anything to the 650. after you set it to yes the next option will come up LFE only OR LFE + MAIN. Why would you want the use the subwoofer crossover, I set my subwoofer crossover setting as high as it would go, to make sure it did not mess with the signal.

Am I missing something here? Russman are you sure this ship will sail? DO YOU?

RuSsMaN

Faak man, he's got the manual, all he needs to do is go take a big dump and get his read on.....

hoosier21

JediCowboy, you typed:

"The sub is connected to the subwoofer pre-out on the receiver with a single RCA cable. The RCA cable is split at the other end with a Y adaptor and connected to the L/R Line Level ins on the subwoofer."

That is for unfiltered subwoofer/LFE outputs, the Denon has a filtered output, use one RCA from the Denon's subwoofer out to the Polk 650 LFE input.

JediCowboy

Well, its a simple matter to test it both ways. I'll test the jack to be certain and let you know in 2-3 hours when I get home.

JediCowboy

Well, setting the Receiver to Subwoofer OFF doesn't send any signal to the woofer at all. Didn't think it would, but that's what I get for following directions! Should have learned my lesson years ago.

Right now I can't tell the difference between using the single LFE in or the L/R ins with the Y adaptor, but that and all the other tweaks I'll do later. Right now I'm just playing DVD after DVD and enjoying the rumble I've been missing for weeks!

liv4fam

JediCowboy, you should leave the sub cable plugged into the LFE jack on the 650 so you are not double filtering the LFE output. Set your mains to large and do LFE sub on in the menus.Crossover the Denon at 80HZ (which is as low as it goes) and just adjust the volume on the sub to match the DB output of all other speakers and you are done if placement is correct, and if your are getting peaks and dips in your room try moving the sub. I own the PSW-1200 and the dual side firing woofer setup is a nightmare. I f you have a really large room try to get in on the side-wall and away from any corners. Hope this helps.

GuitarheadCA

I vote the fronts for small. This gives a much more consistant bass response with the 70s. They can handle bass, but not like a sub can. It's especially noticable when listening to DTS CDs where the bass is mixed into the front two channels. With my 70s set to large, the deep bass dissapears. With them set to small, it sounds cherry.

I second Hoosier21's and Live4Fam's notion to use the unfiltered LFE input on the sub.

JediCowboy

Well after staying up way too late to tweak all the settings, I came to the folowing conclusions:

I can't tell a bit of difference whether I connect it to the single LFE in or the L/R ins. Am I right in thinking that since the sub is connected fron the Pre-out to the LFE in that the Variable crossover knob and the polarity switch on the sub won't work? I'm not hearing the differences. I left it connedted to the single LFE jack.

Front speakers set to SMALL. With the Avia home theater calibration DVD I was getting *nasty* sounds from the front speakers during the crossover sweep from 200 to 20 Hz. They were at the very low end of the range, 32 Hz and lower, but it sounded like a stuttering outboard motor with the wrong oil/gas combination. I didn't even realize those speakers would be working because of the crossover.

I can't perceive much of a difference whether I set the Denon Crossover to 80, 100, or 120 Hz. I decided to set it at 80.

I'll probably tweak some more, but the one thing I'm ceartain of is that I'll leave the Fronts at SMALL. That puttering stuttering sound when they were set to LARGE scares me. I don't want to damnage these things.

Thanks for all your help everyone -- I have a nearly perfect system with all of your help.

However, if anyone has any idea why that puttering sound happens or why the crossover settings don't seem to work, I'd love to hear it. I love learning as much as I can. For right now I'm guessing that the puttering and the crossover settings are because the sub is hooked to the Pre-Out which is Filtered.

Dr. Spec

That puttering sound is the woofers on the mains getting overtaxed - it's a soft bottoming at very low frequencies.

When the mains are set to "large", they get all the bass for those two channels. If you set the sub to "no", they will get the LFE channel in addition!

You are on the right track - set all speakers to "small", crossover at 80 Hz, and sub to "yes", and run a jack from the receiver's sub out to the LFE jack (NOT the left and right) on the 650, and you'll be good to go.

That will take all bass from the mains, center, and surrounds below 80 Hz and direct it to the sub, and it will also take the LFE channel and direct it to the sub.

This will leave your receiver more power and headroom to handle the music, and let your 650 handle the high current bass chores. Your mains, center, and surrounds will thank you, with less cone excursion and no more puttering!

Doc

brettw22

Originally posted by hoosier21
I have (oops had) the 3802,

Hoosier..........what did you replace your 3802 with?

hoosier21

nuttin yet, I am using some NAD separates 2 ch only

RuSsMaN

That's all a **** needs......

Cheers,
Russ

JediCowboy

Thanks Dr. Spec for letting me know what that sound was. Things are *much* better now that I have the fronts set to SMALL.

For my final tweak I biwired the fronts and the center this evening. My Lord, what a difference!!!! Thanks to all who sugested that in other threads! I couldn't be happier with my speaker choices!