Which Receiver Would You Recommend

rainman

one question here, for HT, do seperates make the whole movie expeirence as good though or do they just add more power.

doggie750

They do both..........separates is a key to heaven.........BUWAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAAA

Ferres

Rotel rsp1068 and rmb 1077 combination.

sickicw

rainman wrote:

Cool, there are sure alot of ideas out there, still I just don't know what I want to do, it seems seperates can do the same, if not a better job then a high end receiver, and come in a little cheaper. I just don't have the experience with them, that's all. My last set of speakers was the high end Rti's, csi, fxi's and the psw404 all run by a hk avr525. It seemed I was never getting the full potential out of my speakers because of my receiver not being able to keep up. This next step, I want to make it right, wheather I go with a 4ohm or 8ohm speaker system from Polk, I just want to be blown away.

If you are steping up to the lsi (4 ohm speakers) and wanted to be blown away, you are going to be in for a huge dissapointment if you dont also get a high current amp. Look at it this way, you need TWICE the amount of current with a 4 ohm speaker as you do with a 8 ohm speaker. Any receiver you buy (no matter how expensive) isn't going to give you that. If your currrent receiver has pre outs (and i think it does) just keep it and buy a nice amp. With the amount of money you have you can buy a very nice amp new or used. Also, if you go with the lsi speakers, i would invest a couple hundred dollars and have an electrician come out and install a dedicated 20 amp power line for your amp. Most high current amps will recomend this in there users manual as well.

sickicw

rainman wrote:

one question here, for HT, do seperates make the whole movie expeirence as good though or do they just add more power.

External amps in general add more clean, high current power, with large power reserves (capacitors and transformers) that will help to reduce voltage drops that can limit dynamic range. Im my opinion the major factor that makes the movie experience great is having a large dynamic range and external amps (along with dedicated power lines) help this quite a bit.

rainman

It seems that it may be time to buy a seperate to run with my pioneer 59txi.
Now should I buy one 2 channel seperate to run the lsi fronts and then the pioneer run the rest, or should I look for a 5 channel to run more. Since I'm not expeirenced with seperates, what is good match with my 59txi and what can I expect for the price.

doggie750

Keep in mind that there are multiple factors in having a real HT experience....EG: Cables; Dedicated circuit, Placement of speakers and cables, Pre-amp settings, DVD player settings, Audio settings, Soundproof wall, Rigid floors, Fresh cooked popcorn.....etc.....etc....etc.....oh yeah.......a hot lady next to you.........BUWAHAHAHAAAAAA:D

jdhdiggs

Cathy: Have you ever compared a receiver from the same price catagory as seperates? Mos of the "Seperates only" crowd upgrade from a $300 receiver to a $1K + amp and pre setup and claim how much better seperates are. It's kind of like trading out a Chevy Cobalt for a Rolls Royce and then saying that the Rolls is better because it has more HP. Not an apples to apples comparison.

What most people are missing here that in the price range he is discussing there are MANY receivers capable of delivering all the power the LSi's need. How many of you have actually demoed a 58XX series denon with LSi's? If so, you'd no that it leaves nothing on the table.

Rainman: Keep doing more research on the topics, AVS may also be a great resource for you. Also, you'll need to figure out if you are going HD and with how many devices so you can keep the HDMI 1.3 problem in check.

rainman

gotcha jd

PolkWannabie

jdhdiggs wrote:

Cathy: Have you ever compared a receiver from the same price catagory as seperates? Mos of the "Seperates only" crowd upgrade from a $300 receiver to a $1K + amp and pre setup and claim how much better seperates are. It's kind of like trading out a Chevy Cobalt for a Rolls Royce and then saying that the Rolls is better because it has more HP. Not an apples to apples comparison.

What most people are missing here that in the price range he is discussing there are MANY receivers capable of delivering all the power the LSi's need. How many of you have actually demoed a 58XX series denon with LSi's? If so, you'd no that it leaves nothing on the table.

So it's not valid to compare a $300 receiver to a $1k pre & amp ... But it's valid to compare a $1k pre & amp to a $5k receiver ? ...

While I have no particular disdain for receivers as I use them myself ... At $5k I can't see why I'd want one since there are so many other choices ...

Marcinko7

If I had it to do over again, I would go all Outlaw with the 990/7700 system.
I like the Denon and have finally gotten the amplification the LSI's need to sound right. You can't go wrong with Outlaw they're just super people to deal with. And listen to cfrizz on the 200wpc thing - she's spot on. I listened to her and am damn glad I did.

shack

PolkWannabie wrote:

So it's not valid to compare a $300 receiver to a $1k pre & amp ... But it's valid to compare a $1k pre & amp to a $5k receiver?

I think his point is that if you are buying 2 boxes you will have to spend more to get the similar level of performance over a single box. A good example (only because I am familiar with their prices) is the NAD C372 integrated amp vs C162 preamp and C272 stereo amp. The MSRP for the integerated is $899. The MSRP for the separates are $599 and $799. Same power, same circuits, same features, pretty much the same performance, except there is one box vs two and a $500 difference. Are the separates better? Maybe. $500 better? Not to me.

People keep using the $5,000 dollar figure.

rainman wrote:

My price range I would like to spend is between 2500-4000 dollars,

There are many very good recievers that can be bought in the low end of his price range that will do an excellent job. The NAD T773 ($1,800), Arcam DiVA AVR300 ($2,000), Rotel RSX-1067 ($2,200) are 3 examples of AVRs that will drive the LSis easily and sound very good. These are not your mass market, big box store, conusumer grade receivers. I contend that you would have to spend more on separates to get the same level of performance. (and yes, I have heard them) The only separates IMO that would be equal to these in terms of performance and price would be the Outlaw 990/7125 combo at $2,100 before interconnects. These figures are all MSRP and based on new gear, but the comparison is valid at street prices and used.

Again my point is that good receivers are out there that will drive the LSi series if that is what someone wants...FOR WHATEVER REASON. They are cost effective, size effective and do a very good job. There are more alternatives than separates.

YMMV but I am now.....OUT...(of this thread anyway).

PolkWannabie

The $5k number came from the mention of a Denon 58xx and while I suppose one can get one for less, MSRP is north of $7k ...

If one thinks this for some reason is equivalent to comparably price separates then by all means go for it ...

My personal thoughts with any of this are that if one has a rig that is likely to get upgraded a component at a time whether that be source, pre/pro, amp, speakers, ic's or wire then as far as receivers go your out of gas when you find some top of the line model whether that be a Denon 58xx, B&K, Sunfire or fill in the blank and when you go for an upgrade in this area it will be to multiple boxes, not another single ... there simply won't be other choices or maybe more correctly the other choices won't be better ...

So ... More alternatives ? .... Hardly ...

rainman

Marcinko7 wrote:

If I had it to do over again, I would go all Outlaw with the 990/7700 system.
I like the Denon and have finally gotten the amplification the LSI's need to sound right. You can't go wrong with Outlaw they're just super people to deal with. And listen to cfrizz on the 200wpc thing - she's spot on. I listened to her and am damn glad I did.

how much was your outlaw?

Marcinko7

$1,678.93 incl shipping

jdhdiggs

Shack pretty much nailed my point. A lot of people who blindly call seperates "vastly superior" do not compare equivelent gear. If you want a valid comparison, cost does come into play. A $1K Receiver should only be compared to seperates in the $1200 and less range. Most people don't do the comparison in the same ballpark, but rather just say "seperates sound better and are better" when it's not the case. Others pull the "you need 200WPC minimum" or "no receiver could ever power those speakers" lines as support for seperates when they are completely uninformed.

I prefer seperates because it gives me a lot of options for fine tuning the sound and video I want and I only need to replace the processsor for a new format which is a cheaper replacement than a comparable receiver.

I can see why others would want a receiver: Cheaper initially, less cables, easier setup, less space...

Saying one solution is always wrong is just dumb. Especially when you are in the >$1K range.

reeltrouble1

The less than 1000 (650) Outlaw receiver is better sounding than the Onk, H&K, Sony, Denon and Pannies A/V's I have owned, some of which cost more than the Outlaw. However, I preferred my old NAD 1130 pre with an old NAD amp to the Outlaw so back it went, old seperate dumb RT1. This has nothing however to do with surround sound ht movies.

The better companies like NAD, Rotel, Parasound, B&K, Krell, Sunfire, Anthem and so on do build A/V receivers with more than a passinig thought about design, why would they ignore a market? These companies though offer seperates as their best choice.

I believe AV Receiver vs. AV Seperate is a compromise between efficiency and effectivenss of the system, the priority rests with each individual's preference, I would say the important thing is making an informed choice with correct information and being able to live with that choice for a while.

RT1