Ken Lay Dies

Demiurge

Of a heart attack. What an escape...

disneyjoe7

Maybe from being Pork to much behind bars.

Demiurge

He died in his home. He wasn't in the poke yet. I'm sure he killed himself with the stress and guilt, but I wouldn't pass off a tin foil hat theory with this guys death being a little convenient.

disneyjoe7

Sorry I wasn't up to date on this story. I do agree in quote "What an Escape"

mhardy6647

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060705/bs_nm/enron_lay_dc_6

Jeez Louise!

Do you think it is so, or is he pulling a Jim Morrison?

MrNightly

He ain't dead... new identity, new life. Money can do miracles.

janmike

MrNightly wrote:

He ain't dead... new identity, new life. Money can do miracles.

I agree.

Demiurge

He's definitely dead. It's just silly to assume otherwise. I would only question the means of his death. The 'people' that brought the trial against him have money too, and the most affected party will make sure he's dead.

Think his partener is going to sit in jail over a crime while Ken Lay gets to fake his death? :rolleyes:

wodom1

I agree that he got off way too easy. F-ing dying in his house in Aspen. That guy deserved time in a 'Federal Pound Me In the **** Prison.'

George Grand

Probably an awful lot of folks that would like to see him revived, just so they can kill him. Then have the remains dragged through the streets of Houston.

Skilling looks to me like he's got wings. He's gonna go on the lam.

polkatese

wodom1 wrote:

I agree that he got off way too easy. F-ing dying in his house in Aspen. That guy deserved time in a 'Federal Pound Me In the **** Prison.'

His death has deprived Bubba from getting a fresh meat. How cruel.

PhantomOG

haven't followed the story...

Do the families of these two guys get to keep all the money?

aaharvel

what a crock.

The rotten **** got off light if you ask me.

Fireman32

wodom1 wrote:

I agree that he got off way too easy. F-ing dying in his house in Aspen. That guy deserved time in a 'Federal Pound Me In the **** Prison.'

I agreee and love the office space refrence

seo

PhantomOG wrote:

haven't followed the story...

Do the families of these two guys get to keep all the money?

Uncertain. But for sure estate lawyers are going to come into the mix. More lawyers, less money for everyone else.

bobman1235

"He that dies pays all debts" -Shakespeare

If you believe in an afterlife, he's getting what's coming to him, and if not, he's freakin gone, so just let it go.

krabby5

PhantomOG wrote:

haven't followed the story...

Do the families of these two guys get to keep all the money?

As for Lay, 2 years before all the crap started coming down, he and his wife took $4 million and invested in variable annuities. Starting in 2007, they will make 900,000/year...all the while telling other employees of Enron to NOT do that and keep investing in Enron

Here's the kicker, in Texas those investments can NOT be touched by bankruptcies, feds...etc.....

yep...protected by federal law..

What a country..

Rot in hell, bich

Demiurge

I have trouble feeling sorry for people that put their entire life savings into one company. The ones I feel sorry for are those who had more to lose from an economic standpoint and got swindled. They always tell you to divirsify no matter how sweet the deal.

Greed was a 2 way street with both Ken Lay, Skilling, and their stock holders and employees. That often gets overlooked. You're not going to get the shaft if you don't play the game, and fooling with stocks is gambling, no matter how hot they were cooking those books.

seo

Demiurge wrote:

Greed was a 2 way street with both Ken Lay, Skilling, and their stock holders and employees. That often gets overlooked. You're not going to get the shaft if you don't play the game, and fooling with stocks is gambling, no matter how hot they were cooking those books.

I will only make one statement here. Diversification is key. However, the Enron 401K matching funds from the company could only be invested in ENE, EOG, or EOTT ( all enron companies). If you were with the company for any length of time, that money could be significant.

Also, the 401K was locked for "administrative purposes" on the fall of 2001. The price of ENE was ~$30 at the start of the lock and $10 when unlocked. You couldn't sell your ENE out of your 401K at that point if you wanted to.

Lastly, Lay was convicted of lying to investors and employees, the information we were getting from the Enron Executives deviated vastly from the truth. It slowly became apparent in 2001 what was happening.

I wasn't hurt too badly, I kept my job until my company was sold by Enron to someone else. I lost some money in my 401K, but not all. I was not in Houston, so I didn't have to go through the day when they put almost everyone out on the street. But I feel for the people who do get hurt badly.

Scott

ex Enron employee 1996-2002

ND13

I just hope he remembers me in his "Off-Shore" will.

pfenton

When Dr. Death calls, even money can't help...even rich dogs have their day.

brettw22

Cause of Heart Attack: Scared Shitless

krabby5

Demiurge wrote:

I have trouble feeling sorry for people that put their entire life savings into one company. The ones I feel sorry for are those who had more to lose from an economic standpoint and got swindled. They always tell you to divirsify no matter how sweet the deal.

Greed was a 2 way street with both Ken Lay, Skilling, and their stock holders and employees. That often gets overlooked. You're not going to get the shaft if you don't play the game, and fooling with stocks is gambling, no matter how hot they were cooking those books.

ummmm..ok

that's like saying a woman who gets raped was asking for it because she was wearing a low-cut shirt..

Demiurge

krabby5 wrote:

ummmm..ok

that's like saying a woman who gets raped was asking for it because she was wearing a low-cut shirt..

Financial greed is now akin to rape. Goodnight, everybody!

You act as if the greed with Enron was just 2 guys.

TroyD

Demiurge wrote:

Financial greed is now akin to rape. Goodnight, everybody!

You act as if the greed with Enron was just 2 guys.

No, in both cases the victim was hosed through no fault of thier own. Investors had no way to know what was going on with Enron. That's different than investing in a known high risk investment. If it's all there in black and white, you invest and you lose...sure, that's the way it goes. This was a different scenario.

Investing is not the same as gambling. Not even close.

BDT

Demiurge

TroyD wrote:

No, in both cases the victim was hosed through no fault of thier own. Investors had no way to know what was going on with Enron. That's different than investing in a known high risk investment. If it's all there in black and white, you invest and you lose...sure, that's the way it goes. This was a different scenario.

Investing is not the same as gambling. Not even close.

BDT

No, they weren't all hosed of their life savings, Troy, but what's a news story without the most dramatic scenario? Everyone that worked for Enron was hosed of some money, and others were made rich along the way, and it wasn't just the fat cats at the top. It just takes one person to misinterpret comments that were made, but if you want to focus on one line, go ahead.

As I said in my original statement, I feel sorry for the people who had a lot to lose and got sucked into it. I don't feel sorry for the greedy people who knew better than to invest everything into that company. You don't max out your percentages in your 401(k) if it's not well diversified. If you don't know that, I don't know what else to say. That's why playing the market is like gambling when you keep all of your eggs in one basket. Their greed cost them plain and simple.

If you don't think the stock market is like gambling I guess you haven't lost money. You don't invest what you can't afford to lose, and that's a fact, Jack. If winning was guaranteed everyone who played (key word, winners and losers) the market would be rich.

You want to draw a parallel from those comments as if I'm saying it exonerates what Ken Lay and Skilling did -- that's your problem. I'm just saying the greed in that company didn't rest on the shoulder of 2 men, not in the least, and you're naive if you think these 2 getting sent up was the full order of justice. They just got the 2 fattest pigs.

TroyD

*sigh*.....the world according to Demiurge.

Ok, what I'm saying is that the analogy of a woman being raped and folks who were fleeced by Enron were both hosed through no fault of thier own.

WHO, other than a select few, COULD have known how bad of a risk Enron was? On paper, from everything I've read there was no reason to doubt the safety and security of Enron.

How do you know what the hell I've done or not done with my money? Just who are you? If you don't see the difference between gambling and investing, well, there isn't much I can do. We see things differently, I may not agree with your opinion, but I do respect it (a concept with which you seem to struggle).

BDT

Demiurge

TroyD wrote:

*sigh*.....the world according to Demiurge.

Ok, what I'm saying is that the analogy of a woman being raped and folks who were fleeced by Enron were both hosed through no fault of thier own.

WHO, other than a select few, COULD have known how bad of a risk Enron was? On paper, from everything I've read there was no reason to doubt the safety and security of Enron.

How do you know what the hell I've done or not done with my money? Just who are you? If you don't see the difference between gambling and investing, well, there isn't much I can do. We see things differently, I may not agree with your opinion, but I do respect it (a concept with which you seem to struggle).

BDT

I know I convey my opinions strongly. It's nothing personal.

A lot of people got royally screwed, no doubt, and it was because of those that lied to the employees, general stock holding public, etc. I'm not arguing with you there at all. I'm saying that Skilling and Lay weren't the only greedy people in the room, and their risk got them. They still got screwed. I'm just not anguishing over the greedy ones as much as the ones that didn't know any better, and who would? I'd have been better off not saying anything, but then you have those talking about

You just can't put all your eggs in one basket, and that's where the risk always is unless you have stocks dropping all across the board.

I've got know idea what you've done in the stock market, but it is a gamble. Just like when you go to Vegas some games are more of a risk than others. The same 5 people don't get to the same table for the Poker Championship each year because they're the luckiest people in the world. It's a skill, and so is playing the market. If you're a mark you're going to get burned.

Danny Tse

Experts see Ken Lay's convictions getting erased

amulford

Hold on a minute..

First off, I hope the rotten c@cks#cker rots in hell for all eternity with a million dead Arab martyrs mistaking his **** for a vestile virgin.

#2 - I'm not even going to start about the scandal. Corporate America at it's finest...:rolleyes:

#3 - federally protected investments my ****. His wife should be in a f#ckin trailer, eating off paper plates and drinking from styrofoam. Screw that...

Just my cheery thoughts...