LFE or LFE+Main setting on receiver?

aat

Hi expert,

I have a PSW505 (lfe) connecting to a Denon AVR 4306 (sw). I've tested both; when I selected LFE, the sub is off for the main speakers in stereo mode and the sub is on in the 5.1-chanel mode; when I selected LFE+Main, the sub is on for both.

What is the prefer setting on the receiver (LFE or LFE+Main)?

Thanks in advance,
~AAT

zombie boy 2000

what speakers are you running with cocheese?

kingsqueak

LFE+Main is generally when you have the L/R channels set to large, it's probably the best setting as even 'large' speakers don't generally cover the bottom end as well as a sub so you'll cross them over and let the sub pick up at that point.

aat

I have LSi25s.

AndyGwis

Sell the sub and your Denon. Buy separates and run LSi25s to large???

schwarcw

Hi aat! I suggest use the LFE + Main setting. It really depends on how much bass you need for 2 channel listening. You can use the LFE + Mains for 2 channel no problem, you may want to turn the volume down or reduce the crossover setting to about 60 Hz. You listening preference is more important here than the technical setup. Go with what sounds best to you and don't hesitate to experiment.

GATOR3000

I have the same sub as you. Selected to LFE only and the crossover on 3806 base management is set to 80Hz let the sub do the work. Sounds pretty sweet. One suggestion, make sure you play with location of your sub. Finding a sweet spot for the sub is important.

When I first setup my system I located the sub in front right corner of the room (15’x 18’) and open to kitchen and dining area. The sound was awful and muddy.

I have e-mailed a plan sketch of my room to SVS guys for help. They told me to move the sub to the back right corner and away from the walls. After moving the sub to rear right corner and recalibrating HT the sub’s base improved 1000%. The base is smooth and a lot tighter with no muddiness and fills in my whole room. The front soundstage is considerably louder. Sub’s volume is set about half way or slightly below.

Also, when I play music in “Pure Direct Mode” the sub is on. Suggestion, if you would have to move your sub for a longer distance from your pre/pro make sure you get a reasonable quality of cable.

Hope this helps.

Gator

unc2701

LFE+main
Otherwise you might as well have LSi 9's.

On the sub, set the crossover more in the 40-60 hz range.

kingsqueak

I say don't set your sub cross at all, if you are using bass management, the receiver should do that. If you can't disable the sub cross, set it to 120Hz or 160Hz so that LFE will get the full 120Hz it is supposed to.

Set your speaker cross at 60Hz or lower in the receiver.

Dr. Spec

"LFE + Mains" is only available when your main speakers are set to Large.

1) The mains get a full range signal.

2) The subwoofer gets the LFE (".1") channel for DD/DTS DVDs.

3) The subwoofer gets redirected bass below the selected XO frequency from any other (e.g., center/surrounds) speakers set to Small.

4) The subwoofer also gets redirected bass below the selected XO frequency for the mains, despite them being set to Large. This in essence duplicates/doubles the bass in the main L/R channels.

"LFE+Mains" usually results in too-heavy bass, and is discouraged in most situations. If you are going to run your mains on Large, then set the subwoofer to "LFE". Then it will only see signals 2 & 3 described above.

The decision to run the LSi25 on Large or Small should be determined by the source material you are sending them, the room size, and the desired playback volume.

While they have decent bass response to 30 Hz or so, they can't handle pipe organ music, and they can't fill a large room with high levels of bass (such as one might desire for loud HT playback). In that case setting them to Small would be preferable. For very deep (organ/synth) two channel applications, an XO of 40-60 Hz would work well, and for high volume HT applications in a large room, 80 Hz would work well.

Kingsqueak is correct; if you are using the 4306 pre/pro for digital bass management, then you want to use the LFE Direct (unfiltered) input on the PSW505 subwoofer.

kingtut

Ed, it's good to hear from you on this forum.

FicmanS

LFE+Main here... Sounds Great...

wingnut4772

Ok...so if you have the mains set to Large and you set the Pre/pro to LFE/Mains you get the subwoofer and the mains putting out the same frequency?..(At least as far as tha mains are capable of). Is that a potential dangerous situation for the mains to get the full signal on some of these crazy soundtracks?

gyusher

Set it to where it sounds best to you regardless of what speakers you are using. . .What I like you might not and so it goes. . .

One helpful hint though, make a change and leave it for long enough to know wether or not you like that setting. With mine it takes a few days especially if the change is minor. . .You might keep notes so you wont run around in circles. . .

I have described my settings to some who said I was nuts until those same people heard it in my house. . .Then they argue about wether or not I'm truthful. . .

adam2434

wingnut4772 wrote:

Ok...so if you have the mains set to Large and you set the Pre/pro to LFE/Mains you get the subwoofer and the mains putting out the same frequency?..(At least as far as tha mains are capable of). Is that a potential dangerous situation for the mains to get the full signal on some of these crazy soundtracks?

No, your sub will get a "copy" of the mains' bass below the selected crossover point - net, both your sub and mains are playing bass below the selected crossover point from the L/R channels. Your mains won't get the LFE channel.

brody05

I agree with the consensus,
LFE + mains for me, specially with the large fronts you have.

Dr. Spec

adam2434 wrote:

No, your sub will get a "copy" of the mains' bass below the selected crossover point - net, both your sub and mains are playing bass below the selected crossover point from the L/R channels. Your mains won't get the LFE channel.

Correct.

Count me among the minority if the consensus is LFE+Mains; it results in an overexaggerated bass response much of the time.

FWIW, I XO my mains at 100 Hz (it simply results in the best/flattest in-room FR in my case), and my mains each have four 5-1/4" woofers and a solid response to 35 Hz.

My subs are located between the mains and I tend to view them as part of the mains rather than separate entities. My XO points are 100 Hz (subs to woofers), 600 Hz (woofers to mid), 2700 Hz (mid to tweet). It all sounds like one full range speaker (which is the ultimate goal of course when integrating any subwoofer into the system).

brody05

Dr. Spec wrote:

Correct.

Count me among the minority if the consensus is LFE+Mains; it results in an overexaggerated bass response much of the time.

FWIW, I XO my mains at 100 Hz (it simply results in the best/flattest in-room FR in my case), and my mains each have four 5-1/4" woofers and a solid response to 35 Hz.

My subs are located between the mains and I tend to view them as part of the mains rather than separate entities. My XO points are 100 Hz (subs to woofers), 600 Hz (woofers to mid), 2700 Hz (mid to tweet). It all sounds like one full range speaker (which is the ultimate goal of course when integrating any subwoofer into the system).

Whats the point of having large fronts if you are going to treat them like bookshelves and cross them at 100hz? You say they are rated to 35 yet you cross them at 100.

Me, I cross my fronts at 50hz letting the active part do just that, by having a full range to them, my seperate sub is about the 80hz range at 12db drop per octive, no flat spots at all and I only use the big sub for movies and let the speakers (with active 8" drivers running off the pre outs) do the music, beautiful........

I have a mate with some RT55i's in the front and he crosses them at 80hz, sounds good too.

Dr. Spec

brody05 wrote:

Whats the point of having large fronts if you are going to treat them like bookshelves and cross them at 100hz? You say they are rated to 35 yet you cross them at 100.

Me, I cross my fronts at 50hz letting the active part do just that, by having a full range to them, my seperate sub is about the 80hz range at 12db drop per octive, no flat spots at all and I only use the big sub for movies and let the speakers (with active 8" drivers running off the pre outs) do the music, beautiful........

I have a mate with some RT55i's in the front and he crosses them at 80hz, sounds good too.

An XO of 100 Hz gives the flattest FR in my particular room. I've tried 40/60/80/100/120.

And I don't use large mains because they can play deeper. I use large mains for their dynamic output capabilities. The ability of the mains to keep up with the subwoofers is very important for the preservation of upper bass and lower midrange dynamics.

I've seen many systems with a powerful subwoofer XO'd to fairly small bookshelf speakers equipped with a single mid-bass driver (say 6-12" or smaller). A single driver like this cannot match the output capability of the subwoofer at the XO point and above, and upper bass and lower midrange dynamics accordingly suffer at higher playback volumes on demanding source material.

Letting eight 5-1/4" woofers handle 100-600 Hz provides very good system dynamics at higher playback volumes. The cone excursion required to reproduce 100 Hz is 1/4 that of 50 Hz and this lower cone excursion greatly reduces harmonic and intermodulation distortion.

brody05

Dr. Spec wrote:

An XO of 100 Hz gives the flattest FR in my particular room. I've tried 40/60/80/100/120.

And I don't use large mains because they can play deeper. I use large mains for their dynamic output capabilities. The ability of the mains to keep up with the subwoofers is very important for the preservation of upper bass and lower midrange dynamics.

I've seen many systems with a powerful subwoofer XO'd to fairly small bookshelf speakers equipped with a single mid-bass driver (say 6-12" or smaller). A single driver like this cannot match the output capability of the subwoofer at the XO point and above, and upper bass and lower midrange dynamics accordingly suffer at higher playback volumes on demanding source material.

Letting eight 5-1/4" woofers handle 100-600 Hz provides very good system dynamics at higher playback volumes. The cone excursion required to reproduce 100 Hz is 1/4 that of 50 Hz and this lower cone excursion greatly reduces harmonic and intermodulation distortion.

Hi, its been a while ey. Granted, but the same goes for a sub, the less freq range it does, the tighter it stays. Seeing as the lower the freq's the harder the load/work the more susceptible to less than harmonius sound. Most subs out there are run with cheap amps and asking them to do more is worse than expecting a speaker to work well within its capabilities. For me, I have found it is easier to hear and have problems with underperforming bass and the hardest to get 'just right' in regards to system setup, large speakers have a much larger and forgiving aspect to them. I have the satelites crossed quite low to get the best out of the active subs RT3000s (although when I had the SRT's it was around the 70hz mark from memory) and to be honest there is (with sine wave) a very slight gap at the x over point but the seperate sub is crossed a lot higher blending it in better but if you remember it is run with an NAD 218 so capable of handling a wider and larger workload. 45hx is a very low x over but lonly due to getting the best possible bass but 100hz seems the polar oppisite and a bit extreme imoi. Most would be somewhere in the middle I would expect.