The best way to go about a system in my new '01 Accord

nadams

I may have some money coming up here because I'm selling the db570's that I had in my truck, on eBay. I'm already starting to get the itch to play with my new Accord's sound. The front actually sounds pretty good to me, stock. It does have the 6 speaker sound system, so it has tweeters in the dash. That really helps clean up the sound. The rear speakers, however, leave much to be desired. They're plain-jane 6x9's, without even a whizzer cone to help. I'm thinking about trying the following:

Remove 6x9's. Put sub box with two DB104 subs in the trunk, facing the rear. Leaving the holes from the 6x9's in the rear deck open, should help with bass passthrough from the trunk. But leave the front soundstage stock for now. I'd have to hook the subs up with speaker-level inputs, though, since the HU is still stock.

I may be replacing the HU soon, though. If I do, I'm getting one with inputs, outputs, bells, and whistles. I'm not going to cheap out on this one. If I do that, I may go with either all new components up front, or at least new drivers in the doors. Should I leave the rear 6x9's unpopulated? Will that help the imaging and sound? Right now most of the bass comes from the 6x9's, but they sound horrible to me when I'm in the back seat (which, granted, will be rarely to never)

Any thoughts?

1996blackmax

Seems to me like you have a plan already. Get the sub and a nice set of components (full set), and amped them up. What HU's are you looking at?

audiobliss

Get you an amp and a box of db104's first, if that's what you're wanting to do. What kind of an amp are you looking to get for them? Something rather budget oriented like Phoenix Gold or the such? Or are you going to splurge with Polk, Arc Audio, etc?

I would go ahead and get an aftermarket HU before I started with changing out the front speakers. Actually, I'd do that before I went with a sub, but if you can wire the sub amp from the stock HU, then that'll work, I guess.

I would also recommend you taking out the rear 6x9's both for letting the bass into the cabin, and for improved soundstage and imaging up front.

nadams

Here's what I'm looking at for an aftermarket HU:

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-S9JC1mF81va/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=300&I=133C1333

I may actually remove the rear 6x9's, and try to get something going with the subs tomorrow. I'm not sure if the power wire I have will reach all the way to the trunk or not. Then I can just use one of the disconnected rear 6x9 wires to drive the amp in line level input until I get a new HU.

I already have the two DB104's in a box, I will need to eventually get a new amp for them, though. It's been the plan for a long time but I've never had the money. Now, I have a full-time job and am bringing in some decent cash, so I can afford to get some nicer stuff to make that drive to work more enjoyable.

I'm looking at these to replace the front components, possibly-

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-S9JC1mF81va/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=410&I=107DB5250

although crutchfield actually says these fit, too, so I might as well go larger:

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-S9JC1mF81va/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=410&I=107DB6500

I'd probably drive the components off the head unit, because there's no real place to mount an amp, except maybe under one of the seats.

One of my requirements is that the system be able to be returned to stock with no detriment to the car, in the event that I need to sell the vehicle!

audiobliss

Wow, you're really going all out with that Hu, aren't you? If you're just going to be running a front stage and then the subs, I think 2 pairs of preouts should work just fine, though they are only 2.5V.

If you're not planning on powering the front stage with an amp at some point, I'd stay away from components. Sure, components are much better than their respective coaxial speakers, but you really do have to get an amp to do them justice. If an amp isn't in the works, coaxial speakers will mate much better to a head unit.

If you've got a full-time job now, are raking in some cash, and don't have an awful lot of bills to pay (and are like me and aren't too interested in saving a lot ), I would really recommend you put in a little more dough into your system and spend about $250 on a Panasonic, Kenwood, or Eclipse HU, and get an amp to power those db6500 components.

nadams

What's wrong with the HU I picked out? I'm not one to WASTE money, so if a $120 HU will work fine for me, then I'm going to get it over a $250 jobbie.

I would like to power the front stage with an amp, I'm just not sure where I can mount one. Like I said, I don't want to be tearing into this car and making it some monstrosity that can't be restored.

I went out and removed the rear 6x9's, and didn't notice a lick of difference from the front seats! Seems that the front door speakers carry most of the bass pretty well. I'm going to run up to wal-mart and get a new wiring kit for my amp tomorrow, and then try to figure out where the hell I can run power from the batt to the trunk.

This HU does look sweet, though I think it's a bit much for me: http://www.crutchfield.com/S-S9JC1mF81va/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=300&I=133C7401

audiobliss

Well, basically what I would look for in a HU is a full-faceplate (meaning one that is motorized and accepts CD's from behind the screen), high-voltage preouts (4.0V or more...and 3 of 'em), MP3/WMA playback, and good DACs. I'm not sure how good of a DAC you're going to get at this price range, but I'd feel comfortable with a HU from Kenwood's Excelon series or Eclipse. Kenwood's KDC-X589 has 3 sets of 4.0V preouts and a wireless remote for $220. The Eclipse CD2000 had 3 sets of 5.0V preouts for $200. I'd personally go with the Eclipse.

MacLeod

The problem with that head unit is it only has 2 pre-outs (nothing for a sub), low voltage pre-outs and no EQ. It will work just fine but it gives you no options for tuning or upgrading.

Check this one out. $200, 5 volt pre-outs, subwoofer output and a 7 band EQ. This is a great head unit with plenty of tuning features and room for upgrades.

1996blackmax

I would spend a little more to have more control. The guys are pointing you in the right direction.


Bliss just saw that you had mentioned that you wanted to get a HU with all the bells and whistles...... The unit you mentioned does not.....

nadams

Well, I at least got a pretty good start on things today. I got the subs in and working, with all the wires permanently concealed. I ran the power down the driver's side, tucked under the plastic kick plates (there's enough of a hollow under them to put it there), and the same with the remote wire, just on the passenger side. Right now, I'm running them into a California crossover because it has high-level inputs. I seem to have lost the pigtail to plug high-level inputs directly into my amp.

Here's some pics:

Power wire where it sneaks behind the molding:



What power wire? Drivers side rear door sill



Now you see it...



You get the idea?



Ugly, but it works!



Some thump in the trunk



Here we see the rear speaker connections working as line level outputs.



Crappy ground? Sure, but it works:



No remote wire to be seen



Remote wire jacked into the fuse for the rear power windows. I was going to jack it into the radio fuse, but it's on all the time because of the security functions of the HU.



Power at the batt



It's a red snake!



Where it feeds through the firewall. I had to use a coat hanger to fish it through there



So that's it for now, really. If I had the money for that HU, I'd probably buy it, but having just purchased this car, I've got other bills to worry about for now. This setup should work okay for the time being!

audiobliss

So, you have to constantly run the rear windows up and down for the sub to work?

nadams

Yeah, I just hold the button down when I want bass

98thumpin

lol thats a good one

1996blackmax

So if you want more bass you then just hold both of the back power buttons... ok I get it.....

nadams

Okay, so here's my eventual plan for the car

Sub amp - Profile AP1000m

HU - Panny MXE CQ-7401U

Front components - Polk db6500

Amp for front components - Profile AP400

Thoughts?

audiobliss

You're going to send 65 watts to a db6500's mid and tweet?! That, imo, is an outrage. Give it some power. Granted I'm going a little overboard, but I'm gonna get a 75x4 amp to biamp my components.

The rest of the system, as far as I can tell, seems to be pretty decent. I'm not sure what the db104's want for power, but I'm assuming you've matched it up well with the amp.

nadams

The biggest limitation on the amp is the space it requires. That's why I picked what I did. I figured it'd still be better than a HU for power...

brettw22

Depends on where you're going to put the amp. I have a 400.4 installed in my trunk (you have a car identical to mine) and it takes up zero trunk space as far as real estate.

Look at THIS thread to see where I had the 400.4 installed and if it can hold it there, you can get away with putting just about any amp there.

98thumpin

thats a good spot for amps out of the way and its wasted space mine as well use it right? im not sure about the amps though ive not dealt much with profile but im sure you did your homework. is the sub amp going to be enough power fo that polk sub?

nadams

brett- i like that install location. I also like the crossovers mounted to the rear deck. I might have to do that. Would it be detrimental to mount the amp for the front speakers in the trunk, the crossovers on the deck, and just run speaker wire from the trunk to the front components? Two runs of speaker wire per side would be a heck of a lot easier than mounting the amp up front somewheres. Doing it this way would also allow me to go to a more powerful amp for the components.

The DB104's are spec'ed to 270wrms, per sub, at 4 ohms. I'm running two, so I can run a 2ohm load on the AP1000m. @ 2 ohm, the amp puts out 500wrms, giving each sub and effective 250wrms, which isn't too bad. Right now they're get 75wrms each, and they're still alive

nadams

I wonder, if I replaced my Jensen with the PRofile amp, if the Jensen would be good enough to drive front components for the time being... it is 75wrms@4ohm x 2. Here's a link http://www.cardomain.com/item/JENXA275

I know I could do a lot better, but as usual, I'm looking to spend the least amount of money for what I want to do

EDIT- I just noticed that the XA275 is listed as being 2 ohm stable, though they don't give a power rating @ 2 ohms. I might try bridging it with the two 104's in parallel and see what happens. My guess is, the amp won't be long for this world, as that would make a possibility of a 1ohm load during heavy bass.

nadams

Went out over lunch and tried it bridged parallel, but no go. It kept going into protection at high volumes. Must not be able to do the 1ohm load dips

MacLeod

Actually, Id rather have the Profile amp on my mids and highs. I really like Profile. Theyre really good amps and are cheap as dirt. I dont trust the Jenson enough to run my mids/highs.

nadams

Then I'd have to buy a second Profile for the components, because I want to use the AP1000m for the subs. That's probably the first thing I'll buy is the 1000m. The Jensen simply isn't cutting it for these subs.

How about my idea with the crossovers for the components, mounted in the trunk. Any detrimental effects doing it this way?

MacLeod

None whatsoever. Mine are mounted under my rear seat which is as close to a trunk as I have. As long as they are kept dry and out of the elements itll be fine.

1996blackmax

I agree with Mac.

I was actually thinking about the x-overs in my trunk and just running the wires up to the doors.

deepinya

Is that Profile AP400 enough to drive a pair of mmc690's for rear fill?
Will it make more than the 65x2 RMS?

This thing seems small (and cheap) enough to fit under my front seat.

1996blackmax

For rear fill you do not want too much juice as this will take away from your front stage.

deepinya

You know whats funny about the 6x9's in my Eclipse? They are mounted at an angle and in such a way that they aim dead center of the cabin....sorta under the dome light. Im almost tempted to put in some 6x9s and play with the positioning cause they add a ton of bass.

iworkfortweeter

i have an accord '00 that is exactly the same as you, save i have leather in it. i have put 2 powered 6.5's in it as well as powered 6x9's, and i stuffed a rockford sub in a bandpass box in there as well. funny thing is, i wired it EXACTLY as you have done! just thought id let you know that i thought it was clever. haha.