Upgrading my 1.2TLs but a few Qs....

tugboat

Okay, finally gonna make mods / upgrades based on all the great info I've collected here. I'm not good with a soldering iron, so my bro will tackle most of the crossover and such. I have a common ground amp, so I'd like to make the replacement cable and put the A1 away for the day I get some mono amps. I'm also gonna replace the tweeters.

My questions are.... If there are noticable improvements changing speaker wires, interconnect cable, etc....what about the internal wiring from the crossover to the speakers? Does it stand to reason that if using better wire for all external connections, that the same would hold true for internal connections? If so, any recommendations on gauge and such?

If I were to replace the pin/blade connection with two binding posts and replace the ends of the A1 with compatible connections, all would be well? If I've read and understood correctly, the standard interconnect uses only one connection (pin I believe) and the A1 uses two (pin and one blade). As long as I keep the connections corrected internally, I only need two posts connected to the correct internal connections?

I really don't want to mess this up. I'm doing everyting at once, so it makes it easier for me to mess up.

Thanks!

Ricardo

Internal wiring: I don't think a lot of people have made this change...in fact I only read of one that has, and did not find it worth it. Could not find it but with patience and the search function you might be lucky...

Binding posts: actually you only need one additional binding post, for the pin connector. If using the normal interconnect, you just need one cable connected to this single binding post. If using the A1, you need to connect the "pin" to this binding post, and the "blade" to one of the negative posts. Internally, the blade goes directly to negative.

Crossovers: parts list and diagrams should be helpful
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37333&highlight=sda+srs+crossover

Binding posts:
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36963&highlight=binding+posts

tugboat

I'll search a bit more for any info on replacing internal wiring. I wonder if the person that replaced the internal wiring did so after changing all other wires (interconnect, etc.). If not, maybe that's why no real difference. If all else was changed as well, no way to tell what difference it might have made. Now the last possibility is that they did internal and external separately and noticed no difference. Man, I hope I can find some info on this one.

Thanks for the links. Gonna come in very useful. I see what you mean about switching to a single post for the interconnect. If the A1 is ever needed, it's just as simple as hooking to the neg post. Looks like I'll be shopping online for all my parts now.

Thanks again!

Ricardo

Here it is:
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30467&highlight=internal+wiring

The comment is under "Figure 8".

tugboat

Now as hard as I try, I can't seem to accept that the internal wiring has no impact. Of course I could be wrong, and it wouldn't be the first time (or second, third, and on....). Being the only tech geek in a family of mechanics and engineers, I seem to have picked up on their reasoning and how to explain it. So forgive me for this one.... I see replacing all external connections and wiring while leaving the internal wiring as is the same as upgrading the fuel delivery system of a car, but leaving the stock fuel injectors. All the improvements in fuel delivery will be limited by what the stock fuel injectors can handle. While it might be an improvement over before, it won't be what could be if the injectors were also changed to match the new fuel feed.

If I'm wrong, it's okay. I am just a pain.

Thanks!

thehaens@cox.net

Tug - I like the analogy you have, and if you have the time, and the patience, then change the wire out. Hell it shouldn't hurt. Look in the manual though, I think I read somewhere (owners manual) that Polk used two different kinds of wire for the LF and HF. Stranded/Solid Core, not really sure, something like that...

Scott

tugboat

Damn, if that's true, then it would be like needing leaded and unleaded fuel! ) Sorry, couldn't resist.

I have learned the hard way that just because I have made a diagram and noted everything, I can still mess things up. I'm now all about making one change at a time. If I get into the internal wiring, I will replace one at a time and mark each removed wire in case the change is bad and needs to be reversed. My car seemed to be okay when ever I worked on it and came up with spare parts/bolts/etc....something tells me my 1.2 TLs won't be as forgiving. )

As probably realized, I'm not all that familiar with electronics as they pertain to home audio and such. I do know that it's not the same as automotive, so I've already ruled out using 00 gauge wire. ) Don't think I could find a binding post big enough to solder it to anyway.

I am hoping to hear from someone that might have some insight on rewiring the interals, but if not, I will keep the wire gauge and construction the same, just with better quality.

thehaens@cox.net

Well if you run into trouble, someone has a wiring diagram on here I am sure. I seen one before. I'll take a peek in the manual tonight to see what type of wire they referred to.....

The biggest problem is going to be trying to get a higher awg cable/wire in the cups on the crossover.......

Scott

madmax

The internal wire is shorter which means it can be a smaller guage. Think of a fuse. How can that thin little wire carry a few amps at 125 volts? Because it is short and has a very low resistance thus a very low voltage drop.

But, if you are going to replace internal wire, why not up it a guage just in case the manufacturer went with the absolute minimum?

madmax

madmax

One other thing I thought of. Connectors cause more noise than wire. Remove any connectors and solder wire directly for the best results. On drivers, do it in a quick fashion (as you should anyway) so as to not damage anything.
madmax

thehaens@cox.net

TB - Good luck if you decide to do all this. A lot of work for what would seem (at least to me) would be a marginal return in sound quality Vs the time and effort....

tugboat

Good info from you guys. As for the wiring diagram somewhere around here, I seem to remember something about it and the person asking why the tweeters were wired out of phase in it. I guess I should find it and look for myself to see if there is a problem with it.

In the limited experience I've had in replacing OEM wires, I had learned that most often the replacement wire (of better quality) is usually easy to adapt to the original connection. In my old T/A, I fried my wires going from the starter to the fuse box in the cabin with my headers. I decided to replace them both with one larger wire and was pleased the single wire connected to the fuse box with no problem. I've seen the connectors that plug into the crossover and can get replacement pins for them. They can handle a larger wire by opening them up a bit and then soldering them. They'll fit back into the plug just fine, just a bit tighter on the top end.

thehaens@cox.net

TB....you ever work on import cars? I have a Twin Turbo Z that I would like to have built...(motor)

Sdh

madmax

tugboat wrote:

I've seen the connectors that plug into the crossover and can get replacement pins for them. They can handle a larger wire by opening them up a bit and then soldering them. They'll fit back into the plug just fine, just a bit tighter on the top end.

If you decide to use connectors thats fine but I just wanted to re-state that it might be optimum to remove them and solder the wire directly in the pc board, just in case you missed that thought.

madmax

tugboat

What year? Was a couple production years where the single turbo models actually had better overall performance. They really made a mistake on spool times for the dual turbos. The lag wasn't better than the single and the overall boost was lower.

There's much you can do to raise boost and/or delay wastegate opening. They are low compression engines with dished pistons, so boost can go much higher than factory with no internal mods.