CD Player Shopping - found a 'gem'

RuSsMaN · January 2006

I'm usually not one for mainstream components, for the most part. Sure, there is a lot of GREAT mainstream gear - but staying with the esoteric, small companies, more often than not, results in higher quality, higher grade, and of course (gulp), higher cost.

I've determined the weak link in both of my 2ch rigs is probably the source. The AMC CD8b is a good, no great entry level player. Solid Burr Brown DAC, Bulletproof Sony transport and laser assembly. That being said, at the end of the day, it's still just a launching point, for one wanting to take that first step from avg sound, to something special.

So what can I buy? What do I want to spend? What will make a substantial jump in quality, noticeable AT the listening chair?

TEAC Esoteric? EAD? Musical Fidelity? YBA? Moon? CEC? A lot of choices to make. Again, a LOT of money to be spent.

On to this afternoon's outing. I visted my friend Vu at High End Audio in Dallas. Vu is the 'perfect' man to buy hifi from. He will spend the same time, give the same attention, to you if you are looking at $400 pair of shelf speakers, or a $20,000 pair of reference floorstanders. I WISH I had his ears, the man knows hifi. Continuing.....

I'm looking (and listening to) Moon and Classe. $2200 and $3500 respectively. This is high end. Buck stops here kind of stuff. You can't mess with this kind of stuff. I could buy a used car, a NICE used car instead kind of stuff.

I ask, what else is there to look at? He said let me show you something. A cd player with a hand-wound (at the factory) torroidal, separate analog and digital power supplies, a cutting edge Burr Brown PCM-1732 D/A with HDCD.... WAIT A SECOND, this doesn't sound mainstream at all. What am I getting at here?

Enter the Rotel RCD-1072.

I've been very lucky, and had some audio demos, from my own living room, to friends houses, hotel suites, and hifi showrooms that have left me speechless. I had another slack-jawwed moment today. It sounded phenomenal on the associated $5K rig it was playing on. I wanted more. A true test of a component, that I always like to do, is insert it into a rig where it is GROSSLY outclassed. A rig where it simply does NOT belong. More often than not, flaws become VERY apparent, VERY quickly. That's exactly what we did.

This 'cheap' ($700 retail) cd player was RIGHT AT HOME in a $30K rig. I simply could not speak. This little Rotel may very well be one of the sleeper sources out on the market today. I'm really at a total loss for words. The bass definition was stunning, there wasn't any noticeable digital 'grain'. It was very lush, and fluid sounding - and the background? Black. I mean the absense of color, light, everything. Black hole type sh#t.

Is it the end all? Of course not. Are there better players out there? Sure there are. That being said, if you are in the market for a $500 player, save up a little more, for a HUGE leap. If you are in the market for $1000-$1500 player, you owe it to yourself to get your ears (and eyes) on the Rotel. Am I going to buy one? Possibly. Vu took a new one out of the box today, and is burning it in over the weekend. I'll pick it up, and bring it home for a couple of days for further evaluation in MY rigs.

This one's a real gem boys and girls.

http://rotel.com/products/specs/rcd1072.htm

Cheers,
Russ

F1nut · January 2006

Nice write up, Russ. I believe Cathy has one and speaks very highly of it.

Shizelbs · January 2006

Very nice write up indeed. This after proclaiming your transcendental jump to uber hifi. I'll have to check it out. We have a great hifi shop in the Seattle area that carries some great stuff, with Rotel being its worst.

I'll have to bring it home for an evaluation too. Anyways, I was out doing my uber hifi today too, largely due to you (Russ) and Mark encouraging us all to do so. I'll be posting my comments later on some Wilson, B&W and Sonus Faber later on.

Any thing you didn't like about it? What other gear was it being used with?

steveinaz · January 2006

Russ, Absolutely agree w/your observations. I have nothing but big respect for Rotel CDP's, they are sleepers, and way underrated. People tend to take Rotel for granted...this is HIGH end ****, I don't care how snobby you are, or THINK you are.

Anyone who down-plays Rotel losses my respect instantaneously. They simply don't know **** from shinola.

janmike · January 2006

Interesting review. There a lot of used ones out there and it will be interesting to hear the follow-up. It would be nice to hear the Rotel played in 2 or 3 different systems to determine if the Rotel is the key. Thanks for the eye opener.

audiobliss · January 2006

Great write-up. I'll have to look into it and possible the RCD-02.

aaharvel · January 2006

very interesting & informative thanks.

halo · January 2006

I had the 1070 and let it go..probably shouldn't have. I thought I could do better for the money and I'm not finding that to be the case....yet.

cfrizz · January 2006

Yes I have one, and I have it's 16 yr old predecessor the RCD-855. Both are outstanding.

And cheap is a relevtive term. For ME it's the top of the line, and sounds like it!

RuSsMaN · January 2006

Let me be clear on THIS review.

I am not endorsing Rotel as a whole. Good company, sure. I've owned a TON of their products at one point or another. CD players? I've owned a couple, heard several, all were average for their pricepoint - nothing BAD, but nothing special either.

Cheap, yes, it is cheap. You can buy a $29 dvd player to play cd's, on up to $20K plus. On that scale, it is cheap (in a good way).

The point is, I feel this particular unit, is a real diamond in the rough. Not just a good buy, not just a good sounding unit. This is a REAL sleeper. This one stands out from the crowd, in my opinion. Every now and then, someone produces something that sets the bar by which all others should be judged. This is that peice of gear, in spades.

Those that know me, know I get more good deals in audio in any given week, than most may see in a lifetime. Paying retail, or anywhere even close for gear is almost unheard of for me. Listen (emphasizing my original point), I would have (and very well might) NO problem paying FULL retail for the 1072.

Those that got me, first time 'round, thanks. I'm not knocking any of the replies - I just want to be clear that I'm REALLY impressed with this player. So much so, that I can't stop thinking about it, and I've got $3000 CEC's and $2000 EAD's etc that I could pickup tommorrow for less.

Side note, to all forum members - Cathy has GREAT ears, I'm not kidding. I LONG for the day I can put her in a high end tube preamp. Quit fighting it Cfrizz, embrace it. You are going to get the sooper dooper insider hookup. You are SOOOO close to Nirvana, I can taste it.

You guys rock, I mean that.

Fellow Audiophool,
Russ

RuSsMaN · January 2006

I'll get the gear list together for both rigs when I go back, for reference.

Emlyn · January 2006

cfrizz wrote:

Yes I have one, and I have it's 16 yr old predecessor the RCD-855. Both are outstanding.

And cheap is a relevtive term. For ME it's the top of the line, and sounds like it!

The review in The Absolute Sound a couple of years ago of the 1072 compared it to the "knock it out of the park for its price" performance of the 855 when it first came out. I think the magazine picked the 1072 as its product of the year. The reviewer compared the 1072 to his Goldmund system and found the extremely low noise level of the 1072 to be both a benefit and a drawback compared to what he was used to. He suspected his Goldmund rig was adding distortion that gave the illusion of being more "musical" while the 1072 was probably being more accurate in playing back the information that's really available on the CD. The biggest benefit with the Rotel seems to be that it doesn't roll off the high or low end like some designs, or add distortion, but eliminates virtually all extraneous noise from the playback of CD's through its isolated power supplies and excellent circuit design. I agree that the 1072 is definitely high end. Anything above it in price really just adds flavor that some may prefer, and some may not.

I don't own Rotel gear anymore, but I was very pleased with what I had for the price, and it holds value well.

steveinaz · January 2006

1072; rock solid build, gorgeous cosmetics, outstanding performance---all for $799. The only thing I can think of that is comparable in all 3 aspects is the MF A3CD at $1125. I like the 1072 alot.

beardog03 · January 2006

outstanding write-up Russ..

I always liked these types of info based posts that actually inform one on gear..!!

Do you think this is better than the Jolida J-100..?

In your opinion of course...

shack · January 2006

I spent some time listening to RCC-1055 (the changer version of the RCD-1072) and was very impressed. It was hooked up in a Lexicon HT rig playing through Paradigm Studio 100s. It's a player I've considered purchasing, and may yet.

Early B. · January 2006

beardog03 wrote:

Do you think this is better than the Jolida J-100..?

Yeah, I have the same question. A tube vs. SS CD player -- how do they compare?

In the same price range on the used market and you gotta act fast on audiogon if you want either one of them.

cfrizz · January 2006

Thanks Russ, I appreciate the compliment.

I will probably not come close to having the kind of gear some of you have, it just blows my mind what some of you have!

I will never say never. However, I think I'm pretty much a SS kind of a person, and a loyal one. Once I find a company that makes an outstanding anything for the right price that I can afford I tend to stick with them.

I do put a lot of weight in what you fella's recommend, this is how I discovered Parasound & Outlaw.

I am probably going to go back to a separate amp & pre-amp at sometime in my life when the right deal & when the money becomes available.

RuSsMaN wrote:

Side note, to all forum members - Cathy has GREAT ears, I'm not kidding. I LONG for the day I can put her in a high end tube preamp. Quit fighting it Cfrizz, embrace it. You are going to get the sooper dooper insider hookup. You are SOOOO close to Nirvana, I can taste it.

You guys rock, I mean that.

Fellow Audiophool,
Russ

Ferres · January 2006

I have been considering this player as well. Can you confirm that it has a detachable/upgradable powercord?

dorokusai · January 2006

There's nothing like a diamond in the rough.

cfrizz · January 2006

Yes it is.

Ferres wrote:

I have been considering this player as well. Can you confirm that it has a detachable/upgradable powercord?

cfrizz · January 2006

Thank you Zero!

Yeah, I just look at my checkbook vs my expenses!

Can I drop a few hundred on some audio all at one time? Sure, but then what if I have an emergency & need to get some cash fast? Whoops! And it takes forever to replace it.

That is something I just WON'T do to myself.

I guess my special secret is called SURVIVAL INSTINCT!!!!

Ferres · January 2006

cfrizz wrote:

Yes it is.

Thanks for the info. The RCC version looks good aswell. I prefer to have long cd sessions in one go instead having to change cd's every hour.

Schris22 · January 2006

Well I'm no where close to spending my entire speaker budget on a CDP. I just wanted to chime in on the writeup. I value your opinons on lots of hifi gear. Especially with your collection. Thanks for the writeup on your experiences.

And on a side note. Vu eh? Sounds awesome I have a guy at my store that is just amazing at customer attention. The problem is he can't space it out! Too many people want his attention and knowledge. Oh well.

Chris

madmax · January 2006

Russ,
After reading the ces thread I got the opinion you and doro were considering taking the next step in audio madness. I believe you. OK, time to get into more cyber trouble here. Pass on it. This is yet a higher level of best bang for the buck as I see it. New, yes. Big loss upon resale, yes. Shine, glimmer, promises of the high end for low dollar. Save your cash until you can get something that will keep you smiling for the next five years. Use what you know and pick it up from someone with unlimited funds who has a different fancy this week. There is so much really high end stuff out there going for reasonable prices, relatively. Maybe I took the posts wrong, just hate to see you on an ongoing endless journey. You are not going to loose interest anytime soon, think big now. Just my opinion.

madmax

PS: For the price I totally respect your opinion. I just think you may be ready for some really good stuff.

MacLeod · January 2006

For what its worth, Im a pretty big fan of Rotel. Ive been doing quite a bit of reading, shopping and browsing my local shops for several months and Rotel seems to make very good quality gear at very affordable prices.

If all goes well, we'll be in a house by the end of this year and then I will be able to put together some good home audio. Living in an apartment, Ive come to the conclusion there is no reason to invest in it now but once in a house Ill be set and Rotel receivers, amps and CDP's are on my short list.

pjdami · January 2006

CD players are probably Rotel's forte. I've owned all kind of Rotel stuff, amps, pres, and receivers and held onto the RCD-961 that I have. Actually offered it here on the flea market kinda cheap but no one bit on it. Glad it didn't sell because I still use it with the Melos Preamp and Audire Crescendo amp that Russ sold me with my Spendor S8s. Killer combo and this is just my breakfast area / kitchen rig.

I have compared my Rotel RCD-961 to my brother's RCD-1070 (which has the torrodial transformer I believe) and couldn't tell the difference as hard as I tried. In my experience, Rotel cdp's worked out really well with some type of tube gear in the lineup. All solid state gear I prefer my Myryad, Cal Audio CL-15, or the Jolida cdps. Now put one of those Musical Fidelity X10 v3 tube buffers on that Rotel with sand pres / amps and I'm good to go. These are all great cdps and work well with systems in the $3,000 - $7,000 range. I doubt that I will ever get a more expensive rig in the near future so really no reason to get a "better" cdp.

The local hi-fi shop in town here regularly runs Rotel cd players on Audio Research tube pres / amps with JM Labs / big Maggie speakers. I haven't listened to the RCD-1072 specifically but will put it on my short list because I just "freed-up" another rig and need another cdp.

jcaut · January 2006

I might be interested in a CD8b, when and if.

RuSsMaN · January 2006

I'll GIVE you a CD8b, when - there is no if.

aaharvel · January 2006

wrong thread

RuSsMaN · January 2006

madmax wrote:

...Save your cash until you can get something that will keep you smiling for the next five years......There is so much really high end stuff out there going for reasonable prices, relatively...think big now...

Read you loud and clear Chuck. At the end of the day, the decision will be based on what I hear, in MY chair - and has little to do with price.

I know, I bag it, bring it home, 2 weeks later something else catches my eye, I've lost $200+ right from the get go. Ain't audio fun?

Cheers,
Russ

michael_w · January 2006

Cool find Russ. I've heard some great things about Rotel sources.

So do you plan on buying new? It seems they keep going for $500 ±~50 (based on recent audiogon listings) so it might be worth the little extra for that added insurance.

Could you give me a refresher here - what amp and pre are you planning on using with this?

CD Player Shopping - found a 'gem'

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