Bi-amping Monitor 70s?

BjornB17

I recently got some Monitor 70s and love them. They are currently paired with a Harman Kardon AVR130 (soon to be replaced by AVR230 which has preouts).

how exactly does bi-amping work with the monitor 70s? Im thinking about having all 5 speakers (fronts, center, and surrounds) powered by the AVR230, but I am thinking about getting two Outlaw monoblocks rated at 200 watts each. I will use one for each Monitor 70. Can i have the AVR230 power the mids and highs and have the Outlaw power the two woofers? What kind of benefits can i expect?

Thanks!

RuSsMaN

You could, but why? Just make some jumpers, or use a bi-wire cable, and run the Outlaws only on the 70's.

BjornB17

RuSsMaN wrote:

You could, but why? Just make some jumpers, or use a bi-wire cable, and run the Outlaws only on the 70's.

There wouldnt be any benefit to having the two amps making each other's lives easier? I already have jumpers across them (the ones that came with the speakers) so thats not really an issue. I just thought there might be some benefit to my idea (but of course I am open to suggestions ) Would using only the outlaws for the 70s cause any kind of difference in warmth/brightness or other sound characteristics compared to the other speakers?

RuSsMaN

I just can't bring myself to answer the same question twice.

BjornB17

RuSsMaN wrote:

I just can't bring myself to answer the same question twice.

:rolleyes:

ohskigod

the Outlaw is a very good amp and should outperform your avr on its own easily (dont take that the wrong way)

Biamping is good if you have 2 amps of the same calibre so to speak. If you have that, then biamping can be a good thing (still have to trust your ears)

in this case though, what Russ is saying (and I certainly agree) is that barring freak circumstance, you will get better performance running just the monobloc to each monitor 70

BjornB17

ohskigod wrote:

the Outlaw is a very good amp and should outperform your avr on its own easily (dont take that the wrong way)

Biamping is good if you have 2 amps of the same calibre so to speak. If you have that, then biamping can be a good thing (still have to trust your ears)

in this case though, what Russ is saying (and I certainly agree) is that barring freak circumstance, you will get better performance running just the monobloc to each monitor 70

Okay makes sense. Thanks

What benefits can i see by using a powerful monoblock such as the 200W outlaw? More powerful bass, better highs? Or will the difference only be fairly marginal?

Thanks again.

FicmanS

Would I benefit from Bi-Amp setup with my Denon AVR-3806 and 70's, I have to admit I have been reluctant to try it. Seems to be one of those on the fence things, some people think it's great other are not so sure?

Joey_V

Basically, the better the amp, the more of the speaker's potential you will unleash. It's not magic, but you will get a tighter image and better presentation sonically. Bass may be improved and so can little nuances of your music.

Instead of those Outlaws, I would suggest looking for a used Parasound on audiogon - I'm not a big fan of the Outlaw monos... plus they cost a bit once you get a bunch of them.

Ron Temple

You might want to look at this as an inexpensive experiment...

http://www.ubid.com/actn/opn/getpage.asp?AuctionId=10580941

oops, it's closed, may come back, was $239/150wpc/2/8ohm

BjornB17

I took the jumpers off of the Monitor 70s today and only plugged in the top binding posts. the top ones are only connected to the tweeter. The bottom binding post is connected to the 4 woofers. I just thought i'd point that out to anybody who happens to be interested

zombie boy 2000

I wonder what the difference would be between plugging in the top posts vs the bottom posts, while leaving the jumpers attached....
any at all?

ohskigod

zombie boy 2000 wrote:

I wonder what the difference would be between plugging in the top posts vs the bottom posts, while leaving the jumpers attached....
any at all?

not one iota. some have said however that replacing the jumpers with a higher quality cable between the binding posts makes a slight inprovement.

overall, I like parasound, but for theater use I prefer Rotel, seems more neutral for me, which is what I prefer for theater/movie use.

in terms of seperate amplification, you wont go wrong with Parasound, Rotel, Or Outlaw. All reputable manufacturers, which should show some improvement over the amplification of a typical reciever.

ohskigod

BjornB17 wrote:

I took the jumpers off of the Monitor 70s today and only plugged in the top binding posts. the top ones are only connected to the tweeter. The bottom binding post is connected to the 4 woofers. I just thought i'd point that out to anybody who happens to be interested

there ya go......when you biamp, one amp goes to the tweeter, one goes to the woofers. Jumper connects them when your using one amp only. As I said in the last post. Many believe (as I do) that using a better speaker wire as jumpers, or biwireing from the same amp, is a better way to go then using the stock metal jumpers.

drew spelts

This would most likely be due to the fact that the wire is a better conductor of electricity than the plate which is proably made of low conducting metal. If you want to test get both your fronts perfectly balanced so that you are happy with them, then replace one pair of metal plates with "good" speaker wire and see if you can tell the difference, you might need a friend to help do this in order to keep it a blind test so that one of you does not know which speaker was adjusted. Then just see if you can even tell if they are different at all.

BjornB17

drew spelts wrote:

This would most likely be due to the fact that the wire is a better conductor of electricity than the plate which is proably made of low conducting metal. If you want to test get both your fronts perfectly balanced so that you are happy with them, then replace one pair of metal plates with "good" speaker wire and see if you can tell the difference, you might need a friend to help do this in order to keep it a blind test so that one of you does not know which speaker was adjusted. Then just see if you can even tell if they are different at all.

i just did this right now after reading your post. Sound seems to be better.
This could be due to:
a) my mind playing tricks on me
b) there was a loose connection before
c) there actually is an improvement

who knows :P

ohskigod

and who cares? better is better

TroyD

BjornB17 wrote:

I took the jumpers off of the Monitor 70s today and only plugged in the top binding posts. the top ones are only connected to the tweeter. The bottom binding post is connected to the 4 woofers. I just thought i'd point that out to anybody who happens to be interested

I'd been wondering how that worked for quite some time.

Thanks for clearing that up for me.

BDT

TroyD

Ok guys, just a little biwire/biamp 101 for you guys.

The basic premise isn't so much to allow you to pump more wattage into your cottage. It's for the tweeter to be able, essentially, to draw power independently of the mids/woofers. This, among other things, avoids having the tweeter overdriven and damaged.

That said, remember, quality over quantity. Your typical AVR isn't in the same league as a power amp, generally speaking. Now, if you switch from an AVR to a power amp, the increase in sound quality will, generally, be subtle. It really depends on your listening habits and so forth.

Anyhow, just my .02......be an educated consumer. Before you plunk down your cash, be informed. Know what you are doing and why.

BDT

BjornB17

TroyD wrote:

Ok guys, just a little biwire/biamp 101 for you guys.

The basic premise isn't so much to allow you to pump more wattage into your cottage. It's for the tweeter to be able, essentially, to draw power independently of the mids/woofers. This, among other things, avoids having the tweeter overdriven and damaged.

That said, remember, quality over quantity. Your typical AVR isn't in the same league as a power amp, generally speaking. Now, if you switch from an AVR to a power amp, the increase in sound quality will, generally, be subtle. It really depends on your listening habits and so forth.

Anyhow, just my .02......be an educated consumer. Before you plunk down your cash, be informed. Know what you are doing and why.

BDT

Thanks for your advise.

Im probably going to be getting a new HK receiver soon with automated EZset EQ along with preouts so i can have it calibrated easily, and the ability to upgrade to dual monoblocks by the summer time. I upgrade something about every 6 months