Polk method vs. LFE method

singitloud

I have the RM6600 Speaker System with the PSW350 sub-woofer.

Over hte past several years I have had it set up via the LFE rather than the POLK recomended method.

What is the general opinion of this forum concerning this? My AMP will work with both set-ups so that will not factor in.

Accorfing to the manual: "If you connect the subwoofer to the receiver's subwoofer output jack the two filters will interact and reduce the fidelity of your system."

You guys know what the manual states...

Funny thing is, when I talk to home theater installers (not Best Buy guys) they either don't know about POLK's suggestion or at the very least don't use it.

SO......

What do you guys ado and what is the advantage?

Thanks,

Dwaine

PolkThug

Welcome to the forum. Try it both ways and see what you like best. Most of us here use the sub out on the receiver.

McLoki

I had the same speakers (and sub). This what I found out for my situation.

Best senario would be to set the crossover in your AVR to 150hz, all speakers to small, sub to on, and hook up the LFE port on your AVR to the UNFILTERED input on your sub.

The Polk senario takes second best at hooking up your sub with the speaker level outputs of your AVR, hook your speakers up to the speaker level outputs on your sub, set the sub filter to AT LEAST 150hz, In the AVR set sub to off, front speakers to large and all other speakers to small.

The least desirable method is to not have an adjustable subwoofer frequency (have it fixed at say 80 hz) hook up the sub like in the first senario and just have a hole in the 80-150hz range.

did that make any sense?

Michael

singitloud

C'mon you guys...

As of this post, 77 have viewed this post and only two have had an opinion.

Let us bump it :-)

Dwaine

dorokusai

I think the poll graph sums everything up quite nicely.

shack

singitloud wrote:

C'mon you guys...

As of this post, 77 have viewed this post and only two have had an opinion.

You know what they say about opinions....

You have already received the BEST POSSIBLE ADVISE anyone could give....

PolkThug wrote:

Try it both ways and see what you like best.

Theories and opinions should take a back seat to hands on trial and error. Particularly in this case because it's not that difficult...there are only two methods to try.

speakergeek

The traditional method seems to be MUCH simpler, and hence probably accounts for why it has the highest number of votes.

McLoki

If you have a variable crossover, go traditional, if not, go polk method.

Michael

Tour2ma

shack nailed it...

That said, I think the poll question is flawed. The 6600 package is a sub sat system made to be set up the Polk way. My HT system is a little more "homegrown", eclectic collection of Polks.

I prefer my way for my system, but if I owned yours, I'd start with the Polk way.

limashaynut

I have a question about the 'hole' in the 80-150hz range. If that is in fact there, why? I thought that with the LFE unfiltered method, that everything below 80hz would go to the sub, from 80hz up would be reproduced by the other 7 speakers.

I have a 7.1 system, and my sub is hooked up with the LFE unfiltered input, I have a Denon AVR-3806 and use the Audyssey Auto EQ calibration to adjust to room conditions. While it seems to work very well, I believe that it still set the crossover to 80hz. On advice posted above, while the Audyssey EQ was still enabled, I adjusted the crossover to 150hz, I did notice a fuller richer base, but the dialog fronm the center/front was not as defined, kind of was a bit overpowered by some of the other audio. Now granted, I was watching the movie 8 Seconds at the time, and this may not have been a best test source. So how about it, why would this hole that was described show up?

One other question, you can see the speakers I am using in my signature, what do you feel about setting the fronts as large (RTi8) to increase the bass output when hooked up as I described above?

McLoki

limashaynut wrote:

I have a question about the 'hole' in the 80-150hz range. If that is in fact there, why? I thought that with the LFE unfiltered method, that everything below 80hz would go to the sub, from 80hz up would be reproduced by the other 7 speakers.

You are correct in your understanding. (80hz and below to the sub, 80hz and above are reproduced by the other speakers.) The part you are missing is, he is using the really small polk satelights (think about bose cube size) and they can only play down to about 150hz due to their size. As a matter of fact they have a filter built into the speaker so the speaker will not even try and reproduce sound below 150 hz.

The 150hz crossover recommendation was just for his situation, unless your speakers just cannot reproduce bass, I would not crossover at anything above 80hz. For your RTi8's I would try the opposite direction. Test your speakers crossed over at 40, 60 and 80 hz. (I would expect 60 hz to sound pretty good, but don't know your system and room.)

I would not set your front speakers to large. Let the sub handle the bass it was intened to and just set the crossover lower in your AVR to direct a little more of the upper bass to your RTi8's. (crossed over at 40 or 60 hz, most music type bass would play from the RTi8 rather than your sub)

Often times if you don't force a speaker to play at it's lower limits by crossing it over to a sub in your avr, the midrange and upper bass that the speaker does play will be a little more clear due to less stress on the woofer, speaker cabinet, ports, and amplifier.

Michael

limashaynut

McLoki,

Thanks for the feedback. I should have read the thread a bit closer I guess, the need to do that with a smaller 'cube' set up makes perfect sense.

Tour2ma

limashaynut wrote:

I thought that with the LFE unfiltered method, that everything below 80hz would go to the sub, from 80hz up would be reproduced by the other 7 speakers.

Would just point out that the cross-over point is not a wall where LF signals stop, but a point above which the LF to the sub begins to diminish (or is rolled off) and below which the LF to the speakers begins to diminish.

Eric W

Well it ultimately depends on the specific system you have, as well as the receiver. We write the manuals to do it the 'speaker level method' (aka Polk method) because it is ultimately fail-proof. Most modern day Dolby Digital/ DTS receivers are configureable enough that you can wire it the traditional sub out method with excellent results. However, older Dolby Pro Logic receivers DO NOT have the dedicated sub out. Further, some newer receivers may also TURN OFF the 'sub out' if the receiver is put into stereo or direct mode- although this may be ideal in some situations. So in the end the speaker level method of hooking up a sub will work with ALL systems, from the modern day receiver, to an older surround receiver, to a two channel only system, to a bookshelf system with detachable speakers.

On some systems, such as the RM6800, and the RM10 the crossover is fixed in the subwoofer as well as the passive high pass within the satellites. On these systems, we definately recommend the speaker wire method, as using the 'sub out' will double filter the signal not only in the sub but also the satellites and give a slight hole in the midbass response.

On other systems such as with bookshelf and tower speakers or sub/sat ones with subs that have the LFE inputs, or variable crossover knobs, used with a fairly modern receiver, you can wire it up the traditional 'sub out' method and it will perform just fine.

MLZ

I have an Onkyo SR603 and Polk RM6800 and use the Onkyo auto speaker setup. I tried both methods, but with the Polk hookup I liked music but did not get the LFE from my DVDs. Would I be better off if I used the "Polk Method" with the 6800's and added a second subwoofer for LFE?

bpadget

I hooked up my M10-CSM-PSW10 system with the sub fed from the LFE out of a Sony STR-DE698. After playing around with it, I got the best sound out with the receiver filter set at 90 and the sub set at 100. When I set the receiver higher than the sub I got gaps and tinniness from the M10 and CSM. Lower receiver setting gave me distortion and lower sub setting gave me gaps.

FicmanS

I've played around with mine in several configurations, this is what I stick with... LFE Out (80hz crossover) all other speakers set to small, I do run the SW out about 2db's hotter than the rest of the speakers. Seems to run pretty well, TV is a little much on the bass... On my Denon rig the 5 channel stereo simulation runs paticularly well in this configuration...


I get a little wierd clicking noise when the TV is used, doesn't happen with anything else so I am pretty sure it's just my cable or TiVo box causing that.

myboypat

Eric Wong wrote:

On some systems, such as the RM6800, and the RM10 the crossover is fixed in the subwoofer as well as the passive high pass within the satellites. On these systems, we definately recommend the speaker wire method, as using the 'sub out' will double filter the signal not only in the sub but also the satellites and give a slight hole in the midbass response. and it will perform just fine.

Hi Eric,

I've been searching this site for a couple of days in regards to setting up the sub on the RM6800, and I'm using this quote as my decision maker.
One final question: I believe that the fixed crossover is at 150hz, but my receiver is asking me to set up a crossover as well. Should I mimmic the 150hz on my Onkyo 503 as well?

Thanks.

By the way, I'm so glad that I upgraded. My previous speaker system was an old Cambridge Soundworks, with the tiny-tiny satellites, and a passive subwoofer about the size of a large shoebox!

Tour2ma

No... you'd be in the land of double filtering.

I think your best bet is the speaker wire method and when you use that method you tell your receiver that you do not have a sub... in other words lie to it.

Welcome to the Club.... and thanks for using the search feature.