The "last mile" upgrade is complete...

Early B.
Early B. Posts: 7,900
edited June 2005 in 2 Channel Audio
Well, since I modded my CD player and integrated amp, I knew I would eventually upgrade the crossovers in my Norh 5.1's. The crossover mods have been completed. It consisted of changing out the Bennic capacitors to Sonicaps and the el cheapo resistors to Mills brand. I used the same specs. Here is a pic of the old crossover...
HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

"God grooves with tubes."
Post edited by Early B. on

Comments

  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited June 2005
    Here's the upgraded crossover....
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited June 2005
    Let's try it again...
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited June 2005
    I just installed them and I'm letting them play for a while. I'll do some critical listening tonight.

    Stand by for a before/after mini review...
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited June 2005
    Awesome.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
  • dragon1952
    dragon1952 Posts: 4,899
    edited June 2005
    Very nice job....looks alot better than the original. ;)
    2 channel - Willsenton R8 tube integrated, Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE DAC, audio optimized NUC7i5, Windows 10 Pro/JRiver MC29/Fidelizer Plus 8.7 w/LPS and external SSD drive, PS Audio PerfectWave P3 regenerator, KEF R3 speakers, Rythmik F12SE subwoofer, Audioquest Diamond USB cable, Gabriel Gold IC's, Morrow Audio SP5 speaker cables. Computer - Windows 10/JRiver, Schiit Magni 3+/Modi 3+, Fostex PMO.4n monitors, Sennheiser HD600 headphones
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited June 2005
    My initial impression of the crossover upgrades is that they make a very subtle difference. The soundstage and imaging remains the same. However, there is slightly more detail, especially on the cymbals. On the other hand, the bass is ever so slightly less impactful and exudes less clarity, particularly on string bass instruments. You'll have to listen extremely hard to notice it. Otherwise, I can't tell much difference yet.

    I did not change out the internal wiring of the speakers because they appeared to be of relatively high quality. BTW -- the Sonicaps are about one-third larger than the Bennics. The new caps and resistors actually look pretty cool.

    I went on audioasylum.com and did a search on capacitor break-in and most people agree that it exists, so I may need to exercise some patience. I'm hoping that break-in will address the bass issue. If I notice any other changes over time, I'll report them here.

    Other than that, I'm glad I did the tweak and would recommend it to those who have virtually run out of the standard tweaks and upgrades. The total cost for parts was about $90. I now know that I have very high quality crossover components to match the quality of components in my other gear, so that's a psychological plus. I also realized that my crossover was already of pretty decent quality, which speaks highly of Norh.

    I wanted to acknowledge the assistance of Jason ("jcaut") for making the crossover mods for me. He did an outstanding job and is very knowledgeable, so if you're contemplating a similar upgrade and your soldering skills aren't up to par, I would echo Sid's sentiments and very highly recommend him as well.

    Enjoy the music.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited June 2005
    OK, now that I've put about 40 hours on the new crossovers, I can give you a better perspective on the crossover modifications. First of all, capacitor burn-in is real !!!

    Initially, I only noticed slightly more detail. Well, now the level of detail is much more apparent. Plus -- the sound is more "dynamic." That's the only word that comes to mind. The vocals are more forward and clearer -- brighter but not bright sounding, if that makes any sense at all. Songs that previously sounded a bit lifeless have been resuscitated. This, coupled with more detail, makes the music appear louder at the same volume level than before. The bass has certainly gotten stronger, too, but I'm still waiting for slightly more finesse between the notes on bass string instruments.

    Because of the improvements in detail, the instruments generally sound more like real instruments, there is another layer of detail that I’m hearing for the first time in my reference music, and you can hear every inflection of the singer’s voice. Very cool.

    The biggest improvements are in redbook CDs that were only moderately mastered well. For instance, I use Lizz Wright’s CD as one of my reference CD’s because it’s not the best quality CD in the world. Now Lizz’ CD is almost rivaling the SQ of my HDCD stuff.

    Bottom line – my music is definitely more musical. Even my wife noticed. She said, “It sounds better. Are there any more upgrades you can do?”:D :D:D

    Right now the crossover mods are sounding better than I anticipated. The difference is like going from a mediocre amp to a high end one. I can only hope that the new parts are still breaking in. Maybe after another 30 or 100 or 300 hours it'll sound even better.

    Great tweak. Cheap, too. Glad I did it. Highly recommended, especially if you plan to hold onto your speakers for a while.

    I’m done with tube rolling for now, so I’m running out of cheap tweaks. Maybe with the next project I’ll experiment with isolation. Hmmm, he says.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
  • organ
    organ Posts: 4,969
    edited June 2005
    Excellent write up. I've heard about break in with caps as well. Glad to hear you're enjoying the new sound. Sometimes, the most simple upgrade can be the most dramatic.

    Maurice
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited June 2005
    The bass has certainly gotten stronger, too, but I'm still waiting for slightly more finesse between the notes on bass string instruments.
    Problem solved. I simply turned down the gain oh so slightly on my sub to compensate for the perceived increase in volume due to the upgrades. Now the system's purring like a kitten.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."