R30 Front with CS1

jaharmon

I started with one of the small sat speaker sets which blew away the quality of the Bose speakers I heard around the same time. Recently I decided to upgrade my speakers since Frys had such a great price on the floor standing R30's. I purchased the R30's for the front, R15s for the rear but could not find the VM center CSi20 anywhere. Instead I went with the CS1 which has incredibly crisp sound and good bass response to boot. I feel like the audio is a little bit off with the new center since its not voice matched with the Front LR speakers. Is there anything I can do to balance the audio or is it a bad idea to use an umatched setup like this. Overall if I reduce the volume on the center slightly it helps compensate but I really would prefer to have the sound correctly matched. Anyone else use a similar setup and get good results.

BrentMcGhee

Your three front speakers are the most important speakers in a home theater system. IMO they need to be perfectly voice matched to give you a flawless front sound stage.

There are two things i would recomend.
One - get rid of that center, sell it on here i am sure someone is looking for and by a csi20 that would much better math your current fronts.

Or replace the tweeter in your current center with a silk/polymer so it will better macth your other silk/polymer tweeters.

But in the end if you really want to keep your current center you could always play around with the equalizer settings for the center speaker to get to be a more close match. Most amps will let you set indivdial eq settings per channel.

jaharmon

Thanks, I will try adjusting the Equalizer for the center if possible. I didnt even think about the option of replacing the tweater, thats a good idea. The mid range responce should be alot less noticable. I havent had any luck finding the CSi20 in new condition, I am hesitant to order a used one since it could have been over driven. I'll see if I cant tweak it for now...

I appreciate the tips. -James

BrentMcGhee

i would not be to worried about buying used. (i have bought used in the past many times and have never had any problems)

Speakers can usually take alot of abuse. If you are that concerend about it, just see if the seller offers some sort of gurantee or return policy

whackedoutpom

Ok your ear might be a lil better trained than but i want to avoid the same problem that you have if i dont already have it and dont realize it. I was thinking of putting R50s up front and moving the R30s to the surround position ( i thought it would better match the CSi40 in the middle). However im still pretty new at this and no one ot here has any real knowledge on the subject. Any thoughts advice or input on this would be greatly appreciated.

BrentMcGhee

hey wacked, both your 50's and your 30's would go pretty well with the center you have. But you are right i would put the 50's up front considering they have a wider frequency range because of the two 6 1/2's insetad of the 30's single. The center will sound ever so slighly warmer than your other speakers just becasue of the size difference in the tweeters. But becasue they are the same tweeter they will match nicely.

Serioulsy though i doubt there would be a very big audible difference with the two sizes unless your playing a very demanding multiuchannel passage with alot of brass in in it.

whackedoutpom

brent,
is it not really worth the upgrade to the R50s?

BrentMcGhee

o, i though you already had the 50's..
what is your current set-up right now (what speakers, where)

whackedoutpom

CSi40 in the center
R30 in the front
Onkyo in a box 12 in sub
Onkyo in a sourround speakers
Onkyo R500 reciever
wired with monster cable. Everything that is currently onkyo will be replaced by denon and polk products. As the plan currently stands

Ron Temple

wacked,

I checked out the 30s before I picked up the 50s as fronts. I think they are an upgrade. The 30s sounded great, but the 50s produce a broader soundstage with more detailed mids. I gave the 30s to my son and I'm waiting for the 15s to go back on sale for surrounds. I'm doing the same thing as you are. Upgrading out of an Onkyo 770 one step at a time. When you got a Frys in your backyard you can get some great prices. I'm also looking for the right center match. Is the CSi30 or 40 the way to go for the R series?

R50s fronts
Onkyo HTR 520 receiver
770 speaker package
220 watt sub

jaharmon

Thanks for the help everyone:

FYI:From what I read a while back the R50's and R30's are both designed to be voice matched with the CSi20 and CSi40. I agree the way to go would be with the 50's in front for a little extra bass responce. Im going to start looking for a CSi20/40 myself. I cant justify replacing the tweater in my new CS1 which sounds so good, will probably use the CS1 with another TV in the house where I will use some R15's for LR. Im getting ready to configure a theater room in a new home so I am excited about the chance to make some changes to my existing setup. Eventially will get the Monitors50's for the main theater setup but just cant justify the expense at this time.

Also Circuit City sometimes drops the price of the R15's down to around 39- a piece which is what I paid... Will keep my eyes out for any more steels and post if I find any.

Ron Temple

Originally posted by jaharmon
Also Circuit City sometimes drops the price of the R15's down to around 39- a piece which is what I paid...

Frys frequently puts them on for $50/pair - also check Outpost.com, same deal, but shipping charges.

jaharmon

Im not having any luck finding a used CSi20/30/40 Center channel. Checked all the major search engines, amazon, half.com, etc.. Let me know if anyone finds one. Thanks -James

Ron Temple

I saw one on ebay yesterday (I think-may have been a CSi3) check it out.

whackedoutpom

Ron,
The CSi 40 is a greant lil speaker that made a dramitic difference in the sound the Onkyo in a box was able to produce. I got mine from Circuit City they had it as an "Open Box/Floor Display " model and nothing was wrong with it at all. The R30s you think that they may be alil much for surround speakers?

Ron Temple

Originally posted by whackedoutpom
Ron,
The R30s you think that they may be alil much for surround speakers?

I think they'd sound great as a surround. I just think they are the wrong size for me. I have my surrounds above and behind my couch on a mantle. I just can't work 30s or 50s in that part of the room.

The R15s went back on sale today. I'm off to Frys.

Ron Temple

Originally posted by Ron Temple
The R15s went back on sale today. I'm off to Frys.

Just picked up the R15s for $50. Center channel next. After I replace that I'll put the Onkyo center as the rear surround in 6.1 (unless anybody out has a single R15).

whackedoutpom

I havent thought about making the Onkyo center a 6.1 speaker. Lemme know how it turns out. Right now mine is an overpriced beer coaster.

jaharmon

Speaking of R15's anyone think that might be a decent front center. I am curious to know if the front speaker has any logic built into it for handeling of frequences / sounding better with all the vocals that get passed though. I would think the range your speaker could handle would be the most important factor, any ideas?

Ron Temple

I read somewhere on this forum that someone was using an R15 as a center and was happy with it. Do a search, I think I used R50 speakers and it came up in one of the first few threads about center matching.

jaharmon

It could work well / that would also give me the option to setup 6.1 in the future with an r15 in center front/back.(could use R30s F-LR, R15s R-LR) Im very curious to know if anyone has heard the diffrence between a CSi20/30 and an R15 as the center channel. Not a typical comparison for a theater store to make.

I was also thinking however that the price diffrence between a pair of R15's or a used CSi20/30 and the newer monitor 30's is only about $30-50, I could then have my best center speaker the CS1 configured with the monitor 30's for a unified front stage. It may be worth holding off a little while for the monitors. Once I get moved it will be easier to make a final decision on placing everything.

Thanks everyone for all the help.

Ron Temple

I added in the R15s last night, replacing the Onkyo LR surrounds. I put on Alan Parson's DTS 5.1 "On Air" and Yes " Magnification" DVD A. These little speakers really perform well and now I have a matching front to back soundstage with no roll off of the highs to mid that I was getting before.

Now I will hunt down a center. I have a friend who tells me replacing the receiver w/ a Pio 1014-15 or mid - HK will really improve the sound, but I really feel that the Onkyo performs well. Any thoughts?

whackedoutpom

my Onkyo does well enough for right now but i think the HK or Pioneer would be a far better option. The HK 435 that i have my eye on really gives alot more options for sound settings ect. and gives alil more oomph. I might be wrong but i seem to remember there being even a 7.1 option on the HK 435.

Ron Temple

I think ur right. Most new receivers are 7.1. I know the Pios are and the Onkyos are upconverting across all levels. I don't think 7.1 will work in my house unless I ceilihg mount the surrounds. I like the way it sounds now, not sure if there's a benefit.

Heard great things about HK and as I said, my friend went from an Onkyo 510 to the Pio and tells me there is a world of improvement, specifically distortion.

whackedoutpom

My Onkyo starts distorting out around 60 on the volume meter. Currently that is just plain too loud in the apartment that i live in anyway but ore is always better than not enough. On the other hand if you arent going to play it that loud and you are happy with the sound why fix what aint broken?

Ron Temple

Seriously 60? My head would explode. Even with the Onkyo speakers 45+ on music was enough to make the entertainment center move. With the polks pushing past 35 gets to be too loud. Not distorting, but the soundstage gets too crowded in my 14x18 family room. HT depending on the source seems to just right between 38 - 44.

The Onkyo receiver with the 770 was tweaked to get more power to the inefficient speakers. They claim 130x6 @ 20/20 w/220 sub. I figure they are inflated. Their high end receivers don't deliver that much. That being said, I still thinks it's decent, maybe better than the 502, which alot of people like as an entry level receiver.

whackedoutpom

Seriously 60. About 55 for watching movies and 40 to 45 for listening to music. Mine is the HT-R 500 ( I just went to doble check) which might explain the distortion. Looking around at things i did notice that my center (CSi 40 ) has bi wiring capablities, is this something that you have tried or does not really make a difference? Furthermore what exactly is biwiring?

Ron Temple

Haven't tried it. Higher end speakers have the bi-wiring capability. My understanding is that you hookup both a receiver and dedicated amp. How that works is something I would need explained to me as well. I've seen some threads, but as it doesn't apply (yet) I haven't paid much attention.

BTW your neighbors must love you.:D

whackedoutpom

they dont talk much just kinda glare at me huh maybe your right?

Ron Temple

I close up the doors and windows when I listen loud, but my next door neighbors still give me the needle:D

I have to listen to their kids screaming and dog barking so we're even.

whackedoutpom

Odd the double standard there Ron. Today my quest to understand biwiring begins ( Hey i can do it and if its louder and prettier then i say party on ) if anyone has any kind of ideas suggestions so on and so forth please tell me. Even though this is a speaker thread i am thinking about getting the center biwiried so i figured it still appllies if im a lil to far off topic please lemme know and go and search another more appropiate thread thanks everyone.