My theory on cables...FWIW

steveinaz

In all these debates over cables, burn-in, differences in sound, etc., I think one thing gets overlooked.

Who is to say that our ears (our individual ears) are not much different than our sense of taste? In the lack of scientific differences, you need a totally subjective explaination, right?

Example:
You may love spinach...I hate it. We both have human tongues, designed primarily the same, and we can't measure a difference in the spinach you're eating and the one I hate. I know spinach is good for me, there's science to prove that, and I should like it, but I just don't. Get my point? Maybe hearing preferences are as specific as taste preferences. Could be the way our ears are shaped, differences in our hearing canals, and even preconcieved notions of how something should sound.

This would also explain why "more expensive" doesn't necessarily mean "better." Does pshycology play a part? I'm sure it does, but not anywhere near to the extent that the nay-sayers would have you believe---would you really "suffer" thru a product that you genuinely didn't like, even if its suppose to be better? I don't think so.

Your thoughts on my theory?

BlueMDPicker

Originally posted by steveinaz
Your thoughts on my theory?

I hate (cooked) spinach, too. You are a brilliant theorist!

PolkThug

If your theory is that we can't measure our "tastes" in hearing then I agree.

I do like cheesey spinach and artichoke dip.

steveinaz

My theory is that "our taste for sound is every bit as personal and sensitive as our taste for food."

SEE! You like spinach, and I don't---and thats OK!!!

reeltrouble1

Both of you eat your spinach.

I recall doing a thread about the ear once, all the little scilia in it that wave back forth with frequency waves, the tiny bones, etc. I basically hear like crap compared to the teens and young twenty somethings. I have to get a hearing test each year and it has shown a slight decrease in hearing each of the past four years.

I just burned in some PS Audio Plus for my 2 ch. compared to the Terminator 6 I was using I really could not hear any noticeable differance, both are pretty good cables though.

RT1

Willow

I always thought that as well we must subconciously equate the extra cash we paid for more quality and we think we hear. Yes there is some fact better build, should equal better sound. But I think that it's more of our ears/mind thinking there is a diff cause we paid a lot more. Then again as per my post about the AQ cables I just got I did find a diff. I don't think it should be a matter of if we do it should be if that person does and it justifies the price dif. than good for that person.

steveinaz

I've got pretty serious hearing loss in my left ear due to a fallen ear-plug during M60 machine gun nightfire. Probably why I sit on the left side of the couch when listening!!!

jdhdiggs

Originally posted by steveinaz
we can't measure a difference in the spinach you're eating and the one I hate.

Here's the hole in your theory, we can measure all kinds of things about what you eat. Chemical composition analysis with some material analysis would show any differences at all. Accounting for personal taste, thats something else entrely. If you ate to chemically identical items, they would taste the same. Anything that a human can experience can be broken down and measured by sceince. (even things like "love" can be explained through amounts of different chemicals released from various parts of the body)

Now whether you enjoy that experience or not, can not be predicted.

steveinaz

Originally posted by jdhdiggs
Accounting for personal taste, thats something else entrely.

...and there it is. PRECISELY. Do you have a device that measures "subjectivity?"

billbillw

Kinda getting off topic, but from one person to the next, there are great phyical differences in their abilility to taste. This is proven in the concentration of certain taste buds. They have discovered that there are "super tasters", average tasters, and dull tasters. They found that the "super tasters" have concentrations of taste buds that are orders of magnitude greater than the average taster. This explains why some can eat stuff that others can't pallet.

I have not seen studies that indicate there are such great differences in the number of functional nerve endings in the inner ear. Hearing loss aside, of course. We all know hearing loss accounts for huge differences from person to person.

PolkThug

Originally posted by steveinaz
My theory is that "our taste for sound is every bit as personal and sensitive as our taste for food."

Agree 100%!

Early B.

Steve, that's an excellent analogy.

As I mentioned in the other thread, you gotta account for personal taste in music, our expectations, etc., but we seem to overlook the feelings that music evokes. For instance, I have changed out tubes and could not "hear" a difference in the sound, but the feeling in the music was noticeably different. Sound waves create vibrations, and these vibrations are not just perceived in the ear, but throughout the body and the mind.

BTW, food is no different. Foods evoke feelings, too. Nothing tastes as good as Mom's apple pie, and there's a whole set of emotional responses that go along with it. These are things science will never be able to measure.

Airplay355

jdhdiggs you are wrong lol

i just did a test in my biology class ( and its a college course not 9th grade ankle bone is connected to your leg bone crap) where something chemically the same does not taste the same. in fact tastes can be effected by your genetics.

there is a chemical, i can't remember which one but if you want ill dig up the lab and give it to you, that only people with a recessive allele of a certain gene can taste. it is bitter and obvious if you can taste it. i can taste it, meaning i have the recessive allele. my lab teacher can't, she has the dominant allele. just because two things are chemically identical does not mean they will taste the same.

and steve I agree with your theory, but until we find a way to A/B what a person is actually hearing after the electrical signal is interpreted by the brain we won't be able to prove ****. especially because better is an opinion.

jdhdiggs

Originally posted by Airplay355
jdhdiggs you are wrong lol

i just did a test in my biology class ( and its a college course not 9th grade ankle bone is connected to your leg bone crap) where something chemically the same does not taste the same. in fact tastes can be effected by your genetics.

What are you talking about? You give me suger, it tastes like suger, and it will EVERY time. You can prove that the suger you eat is identical to that that I am. How you interpret the taste is up to your internal wiring. What I taste as sweet, you might see as the color red. Not the point. Each individual will interpret the same thing the same way every time unless biological conditioning or damage has taken place.

Tastes can be affected by genetics. Who cares, you missed the whole point. You give me the same thing twice, it will taste the same to me both times. It won't magically change into something else... :rolleyes:

Nowhere did I say that it would taste identical to different people. Just that you could prove that both people ingested the same material. Read a little closer next time college boy!

Easier way to say it: through science and machines, we can define a phenomenon far better than any human organ for just about every sense. What we can not do is predict how each indivduals brain will interpret the phenomenon.

Second part of his question/hypothesis would be that some people can hear, taste, run, feel, smell better than others and this can be prove through tests This doesn't mean that differences are not either 100% phsiological (sic) or psychological. So any discerned difference in experience to a phenomenon is not proof that the difference exists in reality, nor for all people. It only means that one person interpreted a difference.

RuSsMaN

James, when did you become such a troll?

jdhdiggs

Just that time of year. Check your posts as well...

steveinaz

...it's tax time, everybody's pissy.

jdhdiggs

Originally posted by steveinaz
...it's tax time, everybody's pissy.

Ah, but this year it was good...

Only real problem was changing banks on our credit card autopay after the move... Bouncy, bouncy, bouncy... :mad:

Early B.

FWIW, we don't actually taste food, we smell it. If you couldn't smell, you couldn't taste. That's why when you have a cold and your nose is stopped up, you can't taste your food. But, once again, we have gotten off subject, so let me just get to the bottom line with all of these discussions ---

No one should give a damn about anyone's opinion on cable burn-in, differences between cables, whether or not amps or power cords make a difference, or any other discussion where there is no real scientific basis for proving anything that has any degree of subjectivity involved in it. If you hear a change from burn-in, good for you. If you perceive an improvement from a different set of interconnects or power cords or speaker cables, then that's wonderful. Share your experiences on this forum, but don't be concerned at all whether anyone agrees or disagrees with you. Enjoy your ****.

jdhdiggs

You do taste (bitter, salt, sweet, etc..), but yes your nose is a good portion of it. I remember that from elementary school. Fun day with blue mashed taters. Good times...

Your last two lines, wisest I've seen today.

VR3

Enjoy your ****.

Now thats great...

My theories on cables is...dont buy something that costs you over 3 grand...then go out and plug it up with stock cables...

Airplay355

i did miss the point, what was the point? the quote from steve you are talking about made sense. he's saying there is no difference between the spinach but two people taste differences.

you win tho, i read the post wrong, my fault lol back to college

faster100

I agree that you shouldnt buy solely because someone said it was better, I have a balance i use, its called what i can afford versus what people have had good experiences with.. I rarely go out on a limb by myself... i simply don't have the money or experience to make such desicions.... I read reviews, listen to people on here and buy with what i feel is confidence. IF it didnt sound good after purchase its gone asap... to this point i actually don't think ive made a "bad" purchase.. just moving up the quality chain with amps and pre-amps....


you are right, It does not matter what other people hear!! or think, If you like what ya have... who cares if it burns in, or changes... But i take alot of advice to heart and base purchases on it, so i have to somewhat believe in them to take advice.. Right? if your on your own and don't need help.... Great !!!

jdhdiggs

Originally posted by Airplay355
you win tho, i read the post wrong, my fault lol back to college

Eh, don't beat yourself up about it, I speak english like it's my twelth language and was clear as mud. Now if I could only figure out what 1-11 were, I'd be set.